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Time for independence?


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I have told this story several times before on here

When Scotland had its last referendum for independence a man in a kilt turned up un my aunt's doorstep in Langholm. He was from the SNP. He told her that after independence Scotland would have so much money from the oil and gas they would be able to double her pension.

She believed him and she voted for independence. Till the day she died she still believed it. Looking back now, I think the man from the SNP must have believed it too, at the time anyway.

Looking across the Atlantic to the American elections I can see similar misinformation being bandied about to win votes  

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1 hour ago, AVB said:

And so they should. Unfortunately fishing isn’t a big revenue generator (£750mln iirc) and a lot of that is already from Scottish ports.  

But that is as a result of the EU accessing Scottish fishing grounds which resulted in the decimation of the Scottish Fleet.  If Scotland get back their grounds then this figure would change significantly I'd imagine.

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1 hour ago, Mickeydredd said:

But that is as a result of the EU accessing Scottish fishing grounds which resulted in the decimation of the Scottish Fleet.  If Scotland get back their grounds then this figure would change significantly I'd imagine.

True but there has to be a market for the fish caught and Europe is the biggest market for U.K. fish. And without access to English/Scottish waters the EU are unlikely to allow free access for us to sell the fish. Not my area of expertise though. 

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9 minutes ago, AVB said:

True but there has to be a market for the fish caught and Europe is the biggest market for U.K. fish. And without access to English/Scottish waters the EU are unlikely to allow free access for us to sell the fish. Not my area of expertise though. 

Yes. I can see any regaining of exclusivity in British waters being a pyrrhic victory for that reason. That and the red tape meaning that live caught langoustine are dead by the time they reach the continent and so then rejected at the markets.

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4 hours ago, enfieldspares said:

Of course what nobody yet has mentioned is that if you live by the sword then you die by the sword. Thus as Johnson and Gove are asserting in a post-Brexit Britain a two hundred mile fishing limit so if there were to be an independent Scotland I'd assume that Ms Sturgeon would then use the same argument deployed by them to assert a two hundred mile fishing limit for Scotland?

But the unknown, yet to reveal itself, is how The Orkney and Shetland Islanders will react to a Scottish vote in favour of independence. Already they are talking of operating in a similar way to the Channel Islands. So presumably they would control their own oil and fisheries within their own limits. The SNP remain quiet on this issue.

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1 hour ago, AVB said:

True but there has to be a market for the fish caught and Europe is the biggest market for U.K. fish. And without access to English/Scottish waters the EU are unlikely to allow free access for us to sell the fish. Not my area of expertise though. 

The market for fish in the UK contracted because so little fish was being landed once we joined the EU. Will it regenerate after we leave? who knows? 

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1 hour ago, Vince Green said:

The market for fish in the UK contracted because so little fish was being landed once we joined the EU. Will it regenerate after we leave? who knows? 

I think we are likely to see a greater growth in the sale of lentils than fish.

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3 minutes ago, Vince Green said:

If fish comes down in price people will buy more. Its dearer than steak at the moment. At one time fish was poor people's food.

Spot on. Cod was indeed the choice of the less well heeled but now it's luxury food, especially if you want a decent sized serving.

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6 hours ago, enfieldspares said:

Yes. I can see any regaining of exclusivity in British waters being a pyrrhic victory for that reason. That and the red tape meaning that live caught langoustine are dead by the time they reach the continent and so then rejected at the markets.

But if the EU want fresh fish, where else would they get them from?

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On 18/10/2020 at 14:56, Scully said:

But were you Americans.....or immigrant settlers?  
You certainly weren’t indigenous to the Americas. 🙂

After one generation we were😁

I’m just saying Britain ruled like 1/5 of the world at one time.  I wouldn’t be given up anymore territories.  Because if you lose Scotland and Wales you would loose a lot of oil rights in the sea would you not? 

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6 minutes ago, NoBodyImportant said:

After one generation we were😁

I’m just saying Britain ruled like 1/5 of the world at one time.  I wouldn’t be given up anymore territories.  Because if you lose Scotland and Wales you would loose a lot of oil rights in the sea would you not? 

North sea oil is one of the most expensive to extract. Its very deep in the middle of the sea. When Oil is $30-40 a barrel it is hardly worth pumping. 

Scotland costs Westminster approx £3000 per year for every man, woman and child there! 

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15 minutes ago, NoBodyImportant said:

After one generation we were😁

I’m just saying Britain ruled like 1/5 of the world at one time.  I wouldn’t be given up anymore territories.  Because if you lose Scotland and Wales you would loose a lot of oil rights in the sea would you not? 

🙂I don’t really know much about Scotland’s North Sea oil to be honest. If it stops Sturgeon whining it’ll be a price worth paying. 
I just get the impression independence is more to do with an inherited hatred of the English ( for many ) rather than an economic or political reason. 
It’s all tedious and boring to me, and although I’d be sorry to see them go, I think that if that’s what they want then they should be allowed to go. It won’t make one jot of difference to me at all. 

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