London Best Posted July 5, 2021 Report Share Posted July 5, 2021 Sorting some cartridges just now and I found these. Obviously a mixture from two different boxes because of the different colour printing. But both are Eley Grand Prix H.V. Bismuth No.5’s.......or are they. One states 2.8mm, as you would expect. But the other states 3.1mm? No wonder some people are confused! I’m not, I’m confused .com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
udderlyoffroad Posted July 5, 2021 Report Share Posted July 5, 2021 This might be anathema to traditionalists, but the only way out of this mess is to print the metric load on the box in a standard form, viz. 32g of 2.8mm Lead - and if you must, give the approximate equivalence in old money. As there is no agreed standard amongst mfrs what precisely constitutes "UK no 5 size". "You can pry my English no 5 from my cold dead hands" "My car gets four hogsheads to the rod and that's the way I likes it" And so on, and so forth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted July 5, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2021 2 hours ago, udderlyoffroad said: This might be anathema to traditionalists, but the only way out of this mess is to print the metric load on the box in a standard form, viz. 32g of 2.8mm Lead - and if you must, give the approximate equivalence in old money. As there is no agreed standard amongst mfrs what precisely constitutes "UK no 5 size". "You can pry my English no 5 from my cold dead hands" "My car gets four hogsheads to the rod and that's the way I likes it" And so on, and so forth. I actually half agree with you. But I think the foreigners should be printing the standard form as 1 1/8 ounces of .110 inch lead. If they weren’t a pound each I would cut open a couple and have a count and a measure, but I’m a tight ***. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted July 5, 2021 Report Share Posted July 5, 2021 "actually we should be using #shot per oz, you cant fudge that ! " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted July 5, 2021 Report Share Posted July 5, 2021 3.1 mm is a No 4. in lead, but a touch larger than a No 5 in "non toxic" apparently. 2.8 mm is a No 5 in lead, but a No 6 in "non toxic". https://www.claygame.co.uk/shot-size-info-22 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted July 5, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, wymberley said: "actually we should be using #shot per oz, you cant fudge that ! " Unless you measure in grams! 1 minute ago, JohnfromUK said: 3.1 mm is a No 4. in lead, but a touch larger than a No 5 in "non toxic" apparently. 2.8 mm is a No 5 in lead, but a No 6 in "non toxic". https://www.claygame.co.uk/shot-size-info-22 Yes, I looked at their chart as well. edit: they all kill ducks! Edited July 5, 2021 by London Best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted July 5, 2021 Report Share Posted July 5, 2021 4 minutes ago, London Best said: Unless you measure in grams! Yes, I looked at their chart as well. edit: they all kill ducks! The author was right. It's irrelevant which measurement scale is used, the bottom line is is that it can't be fudged and there can be no ambiguity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted July 5, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2021 I have been trying to find a definitive source to tell me the number of Bismuth shot/oz but all non-toxic seems to be lumped together with steel, which can’t be right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted July 5, 2021 Report Share Posted July 5, 2021 2 minutes ago, London Best said: I have been trying to find a definitive source to tell me the number of Bismuth shot/oz but all non-toxic seems to be lumped together with steel, which can’t be right. Try here https://outdoorproductguide.com/steel-lead-hevishot-tss-shotshell-pellet-count-table/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted July 5, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2021 (edited) 2 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: Try here https://outdoorproductguide.com/steel-lead-hevishot-tss-shotshell-pellet-count-table/ Thanks, John, just what I was looking for. except they are based on lead American sizes. Edited July 5, 2021 by London Best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holloway Posted July 5, 2021 Report Share Posted July 5, 2021 I have in the past contacted Eley regarding there Bismuth shot size descrepencies ,my case involved a few BB shells that I dismantled,they all contained in my opinion smaller than bb shot my concern was as a goose shell the smaller shot could be an ethical issue. There reply was as always from Eley dismissive they stated that all shot was within the parameters of standard Bb measurements . some of the smaller shell sizes seem to have shot of different sizes mixed in . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busbiter Posted July 7, 2021 Report Share Posted July 7, 2021 (edited) I had exactly this with some Alphamax 16g Bismuth well over 15 years ago.... The shot size 5's were 2.8mm (correct) and the 4's were also 2.8mm..... I am sure it was just a printing error but never cut one open to find out! They also forgot to print Eley on the 4's.... 🙃 I bought these from Woods at Swaffham as was the nearest place that I could find that actually sold Alphamax Bismuth 16's! Going by the style of the Eley scroll on the 5's, I think these were actually loaded in the mid to late 90's. Edited July 7, 2021 by busbiter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted July 7, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 7, 2021 1 hour ago, busbiter said: I had exactly this with some Alphamax 16g Bismuth well over 15 years ago.... The shot size 5's were 2.8mm (correct) and the 4's were also 2.8mm..... I am sure it was just a printing error but never cut one open to find out! They also forgot to print Eley on the 4's.... 🙃 I bought these from Woods at Swaffham as was the nearest place that I could find that actually sold Alphamax Bismuth 16's! Going by the style of the Eley scroll on the 5's, I think these were actually loaded in the mid to late 90's. Thanks for the reply. The Grand Prix HV Bismuth in my original post are certainly 15 years old. I obtained them when I helped dispose of a deceased friend’s guns around that time and was given all his cartridges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.