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36 minutes ago, JKD said:

Scenario,,,, (as I know they are important to some on this thread)

A vehicle carefully moves out of a side road/parking space/driveway just into the corner of a side road, and its bumper is just protruding (but stationary) into the view of you in your oncoming vehicle. You brake firmly to avoid a potential collision and the vehicle behind you hits the rear of your vehicle. An accident, avoidable but an accident none the less. You possibly will think that the driver behind should be paying more attention.

Now,,,, replace the vehicle 'creeping out' with a pedestrian/cyclist/motorcycle. The pedestrian/cyclist/motorcycle has stopped, but obviously wants to cross the road/continue their journey. You brake firmly and come to a stop to allow the pedestrian/cyclist/motorcycle to cross/continue,,,, vehicle behind hits the rear of your vehicle. Same result,,,, the driver behind should have been paying more attention.

The only difference is what caused you to brake/stop suddenly.

Makes no difference as to why a vehicle stops/slows down suddenly (genuinely),,,, if that vehicle gets hit from behind, the driver of that vehicle is at fault.

Car/van/lorry drivers don't have total right of way 100% of the time.

I could write a book a week about the appalling driving I witness ! And no, I'm not a perfect driver,,,, just safe and aware of my surroundings.

BTW, I drive a LWB Renault Trafic with only side mirrors to see behind.

Being more aware and slowing down just a tad won't delay you enough to make any big difference to your journey time 👍

 

 

Thats pretty much the way I see it 👍.

Things that I think we should be getting upset with are .

Texting at the wheel. (I'd have texting drivers flogged through the market place , and banned from driving for a year ).

Drug driving . Multiple times every day , cars drive past me , and the driver is smoking a spliff , even on my way to work at 5.30am ( I'd have drug drivers stoned to death in the market place , along with drink drivers).

Drivers that drive with the seat reclined so far , that they increase their front blind spot(below bonnet level) massively ( I'd have reclined drivers pelted with rotten tomatoes in the market place , until they promised to stop driving like a knob).

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1 hour ago, mel b3 said:

Thats pretty much the way I see it 👍.

Things that I think we should be getting upset with are .

Texting at the wheel. (I'd have texting drivers flogged through the market place , and banned from driving for a year ).

Drug driving . Multiple times every day , cars drive past me , and the driver is smoking a spliff , even on my way to work at 5.30am ( I'd have drug drivers stoned to death in the market place , along with drink drivers).

Drivers that drive with the seat reclined so far , that they increase their front blind spot(below bonnet level) massively ( I'd have reclined drivers pelted with rotten tomatoes in the market place , until they promised to stop driving like a knob).

I see all that, and smell the 'spliffs' 🤨 every day too.

Nothing is really going to change, it's all a way to make the sensible person, be it pedestrian, driver or cyclist, more aware with a campaign in the press etc. I'm not holding my breath that it's going to make things out on the roads any better any time soon 🤔

Incidentally,,,, in September 2021, my nephew was run over and killed (almost instantly) by a 'bin lorry' turning a corner. My nephew was a fully geared-up sensible cyclist, 19 years old, briefly riding on the (empty) pavement to avoid a tight bit of traffic leading up to some roadworks. Bin lorry made an instant left turn (from stationary and to avoid queuing up to the temporary traffic lights, and to beat another bin lorry to the upcoming junction 300 metres ahead) at exactly the same time my nephew left the curb,,,, he was crushed from the ankles up to his waist/chest. Local people tried desperately to help him within seconds,,,, nothing they could do 😢😢😢

The bin lorry driver would have saved a couple of seconds on his journey.

The new laws wouldn't have saved my nephew or changed the outcome, as the lorry driver would still have made the senseless manoeuvre to race his colleagues.

Both journeys/manoeuvres were unnecessary.... My nephew was on his way to pick up a laptop for university that was in for repair. He was given that date for it to be ready,,,, it wasn't ready !!! Wrong place,wrong time ☹️

Edited by JKD
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45 minutes ago, JKD said:

I see all that, and smell the 'spliffs' 🤨 every day too.

Nothing is really going to change, it's all a way to make the sensible person, be it pedestrian, driver or cyclist, more aware with a campaign in the press etc. I'm not holding my breath that it's going to make things out on the roads any better any time soon 🤔

Incidentally,,,, in September 2021, my nephew was run over and killed (almost instantly) by a 'bin lorry' turning a corner. My nephew was a fully geared-up sensible cyclist, 19 years old, briefly riding on the (empty) pavement to avoid a tight bit of traffic leading up to some roadworks. Bin lorry made an instant left turn (from stationary and to avoid queuing up to the temporary traffic lights, and to beat another bin lorry to the upcoming junction 300 metres ahead) at exactly the same time my nephew left the curb,,,, he was crushed from the ankles up to his waist/chest. Local people tried desperately to help him within seconds,,,, nothing they could do 😢😢😢

The bin lorry driver would have saved a couple of seconds on his journey.

The new laws wouldn't have saved my nephew or changed the outcome, as the lorry driver would still have made the senseless manoeuvre to race his colleagues.

Both journeys/manoeuvres were unnecessary.... My nephew was on his way to pick up a laptop for university that was in for repair. He was given that date for it to be ready,,,, it wasn't ready !!! Wrong place,wrong time ☹️

I'm so sorry to hear about the sad loss of your nephew  . The terrible loss of a young life is simply tragic. 

I've been driving bin lorries for around 20 years now , and I can honestly say that they can be lethal . The vehicles are no more dangerous than any other hgv ( all hgv are to be avoided by pedestrians and cyclists) , but it's what they're used for , and the places that they are used in thats so dangerous .

At my work , all new , refuse /green waste / recycling,  drivers ,  have to do a minimum of ten hours driving ( broken into short sessions), under the direct supervision of an experienced ,  refuse / green waste , driver . Even if you've been driving trucks for years  . Then they have a driving assessment to make sure that they've got it , and if they haven't,  they get further training before they're allowed to drive unsupervised . When I supervise the new drivers , I drum it into them to slow the xxxx down , because the answer to pretty much everything is , slow the xxxx down. It gives your brain time to figure things out , and gives others the chance to get out of your way if you mess up ( anyone that drives anything will mess up at some point). All hgv drivers will take a hgv into places that really aren't suitable for a hgv(deliveries etc) , but , in a bin lorry , you'll spend most of your day driving in places that really aren't suitable for a hgv , so the chance of things going wrong is much higher.

On the subject of new bin lorry drivers.  Some of them assume that as they're now a council driver , they can ignore weight limits . I explain that youre all good to drive inside an environmental weight limit , but ,  only when you're collecting bins , and that should the black rats catch you using a weight limit as a shortcut , they'll xxxx you so hard , it'll rattle your grannies teeth . 

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24 minutes ago, mel b3 said:

I'm so sorry to hear about the sad loss of your nephew  . The terrible loss of a young life is simply tragic.

Thanks for that 👍 And yes, this was/is particularly tragic as a couple of seconds either way and it would have been avoided or a cyclist skidding to a stop. Lots of little instances added up to an extremely tragic and wasteful loss of life !!!

My previous comments are in no way connected to this. I've always been an observant driver. Even on a lesson I quickly pulled into a small lay-by to let an impatient driver pass,,,, the instructor didn't notice what was going on behind me, but commended me on my actions 😆 This awareness definitely comes from being an unprotected cyclist !

Anyway, I've commented enough on this subject, with my thoughts, opinions and observations,,,, so over and out 😉

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41 minutes ago, JKD said:

Thanks for that 👍 And yes, this was/is particularly tragic as a couple of seconds either way and it would have been avoided or a cyclist skidding to a stop. Lots of little instances added up to an extremely tragic and wasteful loss of life !!!

My previous comments are in no way connected to this. I've always been an observant driver. Even on a lesson I quickly pulled into a small lay-by to let an impatient driver pass,,,, the instructor didn't notice what was going on behind me, but commended me on my actions 😆 This awareness definitely comes from being an unprotected cyclist !

Anyway, I've commented enough on this subject, with my thoughts, opinions and observations,,,, so over and out 😉

Life can be so fragile and tragic at times. I hope that you and your family manage to find peace mate.

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3 hours ago, mel b3 said:

Life can be so fragile and tragic at times. I hope that you and your family manage to find peace mate.

Cheers fella 🙂 I'm ok,,,, very pragmatic and the clock can't go backwards. My brother and his wife and daughter are really struggling ☹️☹️☹️

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https://www.theguardian.com/news/2007/may/09/obituaries.mainsection

My wife’s uni friend was killed by a bin lorry turning left whilst he was cycling on the road, their college was devastated as even amongst the elite he was notably above all others in his intellect and enjoyment of life. Nonetheless every road death is a distressing waste. 

Edited by WalkedUp
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1 hour ago, JKD said:

Cheers fella 🙂 I'm ok,,,, very pragmatic and the clock can't go backwards. My brother and his wife and daughter are really struggling ☹️☹️☹️

I can't even begin to imagine the devastation that those poor people must be feeling. 

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