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New method of restricting auto to S.2?


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A friend has just bought a new auto shotgun on SGC. He tells me he can  only load 2 cartridges into the magazine so far so good. He says he can see no evidence of crimping of the mag tube nor any proof marks to confirm the restriction. Looking through the tiny gap round the tab on the mag spring retainer he thinks he can see 1 of those plastic rod restrictors and the retainer  may have been crimped in place as it doesn't pop out as the instruction book suggests it should. His rfds phone is on answer phone constantly.

Has anyone any knowledge if this is a new way of restricting?

Thanks

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I think he may be trying to solve a problem which doesn’t exist. If he can only fit two in the mag’, as should be the case, then I’m not sure what the issue is. 
He won’t find any proof marks relating to its restriction, and I can’t see why there would be any.
The only reference I’ve had to a mag’ restriction on any S2 self loader I’ve owned, was a proof house certificate which came with a Remington 870. 

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I had a Browning A5 restricted by having the mag tube crimped at Wisemans gunsmiths who then sent it to Birmingham proof house. When it came back it was complete with a Magazine Restriction Certificate stating make, model and serial number and also a proof mark of crossed swords the letters M R and 18 which was the year it was altered. The law may have changed by now but if it was mine would get it checked to be sure.

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19 minutes ago, Andy H said:

If it's manufactured /made as a 2 in the magazine there will be no proof mark's , If it's been converted in this country there will be proof mark's.

This. 100% correct. Made as a two shot fixed in place magazine (non-removable...this is important) for the UK market it will be s2 without need for any Proof House "MR" stamp. 

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Thanks for your replies.

I come with a very long, pre 1988 changes, history in practical shotgun. I have seen and had done conversions S.1 to S.2 and S.2 to S.1 but I had never come across the method of restiction that the SX4 has. At least I thought I hadnt then realised Mrs YVM has a S.2 SX3. This has the no crimp no RM or MR marks also.

I am perplexed as to how these guns can be deemed to be S.2 but do not meet the specification for restriction laid down by the Home Office.

Perhaps I should let sleeping dogs lie.

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I remember when I had a 3.5inch chambered semi/auto that I could place three 65 or may have been 67mm shells in the magazine and one in the chamber.

I never told anyone and never loaded it in such a way once I knew it was possible.  I did research it online and found old forum posts saying that it was a grey area and not to worry about it. Just don't put more than two shells in the magazine. 

At my next FEO visit he asked me how many shells could I put in the gun and I said, two in the mag one in the chamber. I thought about mentioning the short cartridge thing but realised it might land me in trouble. 

I'm sure the law know about it though, right?

There was someone on here a few years ago who bought a section 2 gun and one day playing around with it discovered it could hold I think five or six shells in the mag.  A few posters told him to not bother about it but he did take it back to the gun shop and sorted it out. 

 

  

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3.5" guns should be crimped, welded or whatever using 3.5" cartridges as a measure. The fact that more shorter cartridges may be loaded is an anomaly caused by poor legislation that was drafted in a rush. Surely not?.

And then there is ghost loading, perfectly legal as the legislation only mentions magazine capacity. The ghost load doesn't go in the magazine.............

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41 minutes ago, Yellowvanman said:

3.5" guns should be crimped, welded or whatever using 3.5" cartridges as a measure. The fact that more shorter cartridges may be loaded is an anomaly caused by poor legislation that was drafted in a rush. Surely not?.

And then there is ghost loading, perfectly legal as the legislation only mentions magazine capacity. The ghost load doesn't go in the magazine.............

However many 3.1/2 inch chamber semi auto won’t cycle the 2.1/2 so the problem has solved itself 

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Guns that  originally had 4/5 shot magazines and were restricted had to be checked , stamped and certificated by the Proof House's .Guns imported after the law was changed to 2 shot magazine , it was assumed all those sold would comply with the Law .This was the norm although one or two did slip through the net . Some not being restricted and  not checked by police on certificate  renewal , and continued to  on a shotgun certificate  .I had this once were an auto was brought into the shop for repair on a shotgun certificate , on finding it had not been restricted I was unable to return it to its owner as he did not have variation on his firearms licence .

The Police instead of admitting error and gating a variation, as they were at fault , insisted he made a fresh application and had to go through the whole grant process .

As we all know that it is possible to put 3x  2&1/2" cases into a mag on a 3&1/2" gun making the whole system ridicules .

 

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ive had a few like that. american guns seems to be where you see it most or atleast guns that were aimed at the american market. The reason being is their average sporting shotgun is 1+5 but in some states to hunt waterfowl  the need to be 1+2 so they come supplied with a removable plug to restrict them. when they get shipped over here its usualy easier and a job alreay half done to make this plug a permanant fixture.

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On 02/06/2022 at 19:57, Shadowchaser said:

I remember when I had a 3.5inch chambered semi/auto that I could place three 65 or may have been 67mm shells in the magazine and one in the chamber.

I never told anyone and never loaded it in such a way once I knew it was possible.  I did research it online and found old forum posts saying that it was a grey area and not to worry about it. Just don't put more than two shells in the magazine. 

At my next FEO visit he asked me how many shells could I put in the gun and I said, two in the mag one in the chamber. I thought about mentioning the short cartridge thing but realised it might land me in trouble. 

I'm sure the law know about it though, right?

There was someone on here a few years ago who bought a section 2 gun and one day playing around with it discovered it could hold I think five or six shells in the mag.  A few posters told him to not bother about it but he did take it back to the gun shop and sorted it out. 

 

  

yeah i looked into this aswell and the answer is pretty simple it turns out.  its not a manufacturing defect or a technicality its as simple as as long as it has more than 1+2 in it youre commiting an offence and if youre caught youre getting done.  theirs no other way to effectly restrict tube mags. in theory you could load up shorts and cram half a dozen in.

loads of stuff like this with shooting its the norm.

 most 22lr rifles have threaded muzzles. and you can buy a moderator intended for 22lr for a sub 12ibs air rifle no problem. but as soon as you put it on the 22lr if its not registered on your Fac.... instant fire arms offence.

standard law really.  whos car cant go faster than the speed limit?

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