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Pension age increase


Dougy
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We'll all be brown bread by the time we get state pension, i see they have increased it again. The plan is that we die before we start to claim so it can be handed out to all the incoming money grabbers. 

Just brill never been out of work all my life and get penalised. 

 

Yes im becoming a grumpy old man, and no wonder. 

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I completely agree with you and I’ve been saying it for years! And if that makes me a grumpy old man at 36 then so be it! It’s disgusting that we have worked and paid our taxes and then get stiffed whilst all the dole dossers continue to reap the benefits of playing the system.

 

to clarify dole dossers - those that are claiming benefits that they do not need/ shouldn’t be getting and could quite easily go out and work. NOT the genuine persons that NEED help 

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49 minutes ago, Spr1985 said:

 

 

to clarify dole dossers - those that are claiming benefits that they do not need/ shouldn’t be getting and could quite easily go out and work. NOT the genuine persons that NEED help 

My wife is a domestic assistant for the local hospital, came home yesterday and told me that they had advertised for for more domestic staff and had been holding interviews over zoom/face time, she said some that where up for interview where still in bed or still in their dressing gowns. Just go's to show how much they want a job.

 

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I'm 29 and hoping I live long enough to at least see one state pension payment. 😆

It could be worse, you could live in Wales and have the government breathing down your neck for having the gall to have enough saved to buy a second house to sell for your retirement.

We'll have none of that capitalist nonsense here, Hen Wlad Fy Führer!

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You pay NI and enter into a contract for a retirement age and the Govt move the goal posts half way through, I am amazed it hasn't been challenged in the courts it's simply fraud.  When you start paying NI the retirement age at the time should be fixed to you.

Edited by Weihrauch17
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1 hour ago, clangerman said:

don’t worry by time it’s due being unable to buy heat or food will clip you first just about tops this country starve freeze or die on a waiting list! 

You know, you call this country so much, you really ought to go and live somewhere else.

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1 hour ago, Dougy said:

We'll all be brown bread by the time we get state pension, i see they have increased it again. The plan is that we die before we start to claim so it can be handed out to all the incoming money grabbers. 

Just brill never been out of work all my life and get penalised. 

 

Yes im becoming a grumpy old man, and no wonder. 

Out of interest Mr Grumpy :lol: , what is the new state pension age and when do it start ?

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1 hour ago, Weihrauch17 said:

You pay NI and enter into a contract for a retirement age and the Govt move the goal posts half way through, I am amazed it hasn't been challenged in the courts it's simply fraud.  When you start paying NI the retirement age at the time should be fixed to you.

I can agree with that,  I'll have been paying in for nearly 30 years and still don't expect there to be a state pension when I stop work, be nice if it was a set time, but it'll be 80 before long.

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38 minutes ago, Mice! said:

I can agree with that,  I'll have been paying in for nearly 30 years and still don't expect there to be a state pension when I stop work, be nice if it was a set time, but it'll be 80 before long.

Sadly, I don't think it quite works in the way we would like it to.

By paying in now you are effectively paying for this generation of pensioners. When you retire (eventually), the next generation will be paying for you.

As the UK has a population that is not only growing but has an advancing average age we either have to pay more to stay afloat or defer paying others by raising the retirement age.

It sucks but that's the price we pay for having people who will happily spend their entire lives doing nothing but reproducing and sucking on the teat of the state. What I mean by that is we cannot have a system where we pay for ourselves or those who didn't pay in wouldn't have anything.

If I could 'opt out' then I would happily do so and invest the savings in a retirement portfolio for me.

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8 minutes ago, Poor Shot said:

If I could 'opt out' then I would happily do so and invest the savings in a retirement portfolio for me.

You cannot 'opt out' - but you can make your own independent savings to either fund the 'gap' between when you retire and when your state pension starts, or more realistically fund a pension (which gets tax relief as you save) and a portfolio in ISA (which gets tax relief as you draw out).  I started my 'savings' (both in pension and ISAs) before I was 30.  It meant sacrifices then and I paid in for 30 years - but now 35 years on, I don't regret doing that as it gave me the flexibility to take early retirement.  It has always been the case that the 'state pension' was never intended to be more than a basic 'safety net' and many people/companies have made separate arrangements to give a better retirement income. 

Many company 'final salary' schemes now paying out are very generous - especially to people who stayed in one employment with such a scheme.  Unfortunately, although many like me do have a 'final salary' defined benefit type scheme, the payment in retirement reflects the time you were in that scheme, which for me was only a small part of my overall working life.

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4 hours ago, Weihrauch17 said:

You pay NI and enter into a contract for a retirement age and the Govt move the goal posts half way through, I am amazed it hasn't been challenged in the courts it's simply fraud.  When you start paying NI the retirement age at the time should be fixed to you.

I like that. 

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7 hours ago, JohnfromUK said:

You cannot 'opt out' - but you can make your own independent savings to either fund the 'gap' between when you retire and when your state pension starts, or more realistically fund a pension (which gets tax relief as you save) and a portfolio in ISA (which gets tax relief as you draw out).  I started my 'savings' (both in pension and ISAs) before I was 30. 

Thats all well and good saying that but how can you plan for retirement when the "GAP" keeps increasing ? 

I am was planning to retire end of this year after working out how much im expected to need for 4 years until state pension, but now i have to plan for an additional year. 

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1 minute ago, Dougy said:

Thats all well and good saying that but how can you plan for retirement when the "GAP" keeps increasing ? 

Like all 'pre-planning - you can only act based on a 'best guess' basis.  It changed from 65 to 66 for me.

3 minutes ago, Dougy said:

I am was planning to retire end of this year after working out how much im expected to need for 4 years until state pension, but now i have to plan for an additional year. 

I did similar - I'm 65 now and state pension kicks in at 66 for me - but my state pension will only form part of the picture assuming all goes to plan. 

My plan (made 30+ years ago in conjunction with a financial advisor) was going well - then nearly spoiled when dividends (on which I partly depended) were much reduced by covid - which was a non planned event(!).  Back on track now. 

Almost any form of 'providing for yourself' has lots of risks - and rules/economic climate changing is a big risk (times, interest rates, annuity rates, taxation allowances) as all governments change rules (both Brown and Osborne made major pension rule changes when Chancellor) - and interest rates on savings have dropped to near zero - which has badly reduced annuity rates.  All these are beyond our ability to predict - and doing a mix of pension (for the tax relief on the 'way in') and portfolio (in ISA for tax relief on the 'way out'), (some people add property and rental property investments, some might add crypto nowadays) helps mitigate the risk of any 'eggs in one basket' type policy.

Many employees will have had a pension scheme of some form provided by their employer - some very generous (mainly public sector and older big company final salary schemes) and some very marginal benefits.  In addition we have always been encouraged to use the various private pension options by saving through our working lives with tax incentives to do so.  Many people I know who have been self employed have also done their own pension schemes. 

There are (for those younger and in their prime working lives now) a variety of incentives and arrangements for saving for old age with things like SIPs (Self Invested Pension) schemes available, but there is also now a much tighter cap on how much you can save before losing tax relief. 

As has been said earlier in the thread - state pensions (and all public sector pensions) for the old now are paid by the working young.  That is the way UK governments (of all colours) have always done it.  The old cannot expect the young to keep them in luxury and it was always meant to be a safety net.  Other countries (e.g. Norway) built up a huge 'sovereign wealth fund' that helps fund both future pensions and invest in industry etc.  The UK has never done that (by either main political party).

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55 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

 

As has been said earlier in the thread - state pensions (and all public sector pensions) for the old now are paid by the working young.  That is the way UK governments (of all colours) have always done it.  The old cannot expect the young to keep them in luxury and it was always meant to be a safety net.  Other countries (e.g. Norway) built up a huge 'sovereign wealth fund' that helps fund both future pensions and invest in industry etc.  The UK has never done that (by either main political party).

It's a chronic shame that the UK has not adopted this route of investing for the future. It could be investing in assets of the country. Owning say 40% of the utilities, highway and bridge tolls, national grid, power generation would have been a good start. Instead we squander short term income. Many public sector pensions are now funded this way. 

I am a big believer in saving hard for your pension at the earliest opportunity. The state pension itself is a very basic back stop. The tapered tax relief on contributions needs to be looked at (the 60% tax band) together with the loss of tax relief for higher earners, and pension life time limits. The government made a good start insisting on work based pension schemes (was it the coalition that brought it in?) but it could do with another rethink. 

Edited by oowee
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22 minutes ago, oowee said:

It's a chronic shame that the UK has not adopted this route of investing for the future. It could be investing in assets of the country. Owning say 40% of the utilities, highway and bridge tolls, national grid, power generation would have been a good start. Instead we squander short term income. Many public sector pensions are now funded this way. 

I am a big believer in saving hard for your pension at the earliest opportunity. The state pension itself is a very basic back stop. The tapered tax relief on contributions needs to be looked at (the 60% tax band) together with the loss of tax relief for higher earners, and pension life time limits. The government made a good start insisting on work based pension schemes (was it the coalition that brought it in?) but it could do with another rethink. 

I agree in the main, though not so sure about concentrating on utilities where state 'inertia' can hold back progress - but that's another discussion! 

One of the reasons for a longish and perhaps rather detailed post above was to emphasise the need to start early and not to rely on the state as anything more than a basic backstop.  That is what both state pensions and the NHS were originally conceived to do - safety net not 'bells and whistles'.  The fact is that today's workforce is paying of today's retired population's pensions including that of a massive public sector.  It is wrong to expect them to have to fund anything other than a basic level of pensions for the general population, basic benefits etc, the exceptions being certain people (such as disabled, wounded, ill) who have been unable to make their own provisions.  The rest should make some of their own provisions. 

Everyone should be strongly encouraged to look out for themselves and their families and not expect the state to do it all for you.

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6 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:

How can you plan when Gordon Brown with me, and as with many many others, ripped the backside out of people's private pension plans in 1997.

He did with me as well - as did covid for a time.  But - all planning has to accept there are risks that can't be planned for. 

The current Ukraine war is another that will make a huge dent in savings (through inflation).  That wasn't in my 'plan' either - but with luck there will be enough slack in the plan to ride that out.

Edited by JohnfromUK
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28 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:

How can you plan when Gordon Brown with me, and as with many many others, ripped the backside out of people's private pension plans in 1997.

Exactly the same with the tapered tax relief (tories) on pensions which had a huge impact on the NHS. Pension legislation changes are complex and the law of unintended consequences loom large. Unfortunately the £50bn pension tax relief is a tempting target in times of austerity. 

33 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

I agree in the main, though not so sure about concentrating on utilities where state 'inertia' can hold back progress - but that's another discussion! 

One of the reasons for a longish and perhaps rather detailed post above was to emphasise the need to start early and not to rely on the state as anything more than a basic backstop.  That is what both state pensions and the NHS were originally conceived to do - safety net not 'bells and whistles'.  The fact is that today's workforce is paying of today's retired population's pensions including that of a massive public sector.  It is wrong to expect them to have to fund anything other than a basic level of pensions for the general population, basic benefits etc, the exceptions being certain people (such as disabled, wounded, ill) who have been unable to make their own provisions.  The rest should make some of their own provisions. 

Everyone should be strongly encouraged to look out for themselves and their families and not expect the state to do it all for you.

I would mostly agree. My point with things like utilities ect was they were national assets being sold a part of which could have been retained and put into the pension pot (if we had one). 

 

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7 minutes ago, oowee said:

I would mostly agree. My point with things like utilities ect was they were national assets being sold a part of which could have been retained and put into the pension pot (if we had one). 

I would quote Norway which invested the revenue from their part of North Sea Gas I believe - whereas our (from both sides) government squandered it.

We are actually participating in a massive legalised Ponzi/Pyramid selling scheme at the end of the day

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13 hours ago, Poor Shot said:

I'm 29 and hoping I live long enough to at least see one state pension payment. 😆

It could be worse, you could live in Wales and have the government breathing down your neck for having the gall to have enough saved to buy a second house to sell for your retirement.

We'll have none of that capitalist nonsense here, Hen Wlad Fy Führer!

Hello, I can remember many years back there was a lot of aggro when people not from Wales were buying property for holiday homes, 

Edited by oldypigeonpopper
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Hello, many young people in UK cannot save to buy their own home or renting let alone a pension, was it Cameroon who decided to put the retiring age up stating as we are living longer so pay more and less retirement years, ok for millionaire Cameroon , I forsee 1000s of young people who retire in years to come living on the breadline, worst still if self employed and not able to save, 

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1 hour ago, oowee said:

am a big believer in saving hard for your pension at the earliest opportunity. The state pension itself is a very basic back stop

That probably depends on the kind of job your in and what your income is, I certainly couldn't have afforded to loose £50-100 a month for a pension years ago, seems like nothing now, but you have different priorities when your younger. 

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