Shotgun Licence ??Refusal??

[davo]

The FEO is only doing his job. If someone has depression and getting treatment, the chances of a licence are remote. Which FEO would recommend a licence - none I suspect. He cannot go against a medical opinion.

 

 

Who's post is this a response to Gordon?

Can't see where the FEO is going against a medical opinion, because he's not taking the application and has given back the accompanying photo's.... before he has had a medical opinion on the applicants present condition.

[rhodes]

Just for the record I do not have, and have never suffered with, depression.

 

Anxiety has very different symptoms to depression.

 

I mentioned I would come off the meds because I'm ready to now anyway, the doctor has already begun reducing the dose down.

 

However, I guess I'll just have to wait and see. Thanks for all your advice everyone.

[rhodes]

Again, for the record,

 

the FEO requested and recieved the medical report BEFORE he arranged the home visit.

 

When he'd seen the report and THEN arranged a visit I thought everything was OK. However, the first thing he said at the visit was that he didn't expect me to be granted a licence.

 

I thought it strange that the application would get that far since he had the medical report first?!?!

[Gordon R]

"Who's post is this a response to Gordon?

Can't see where the FEO is going against a medical opinion, because he's not taking the application and has given back the accompanying photo's.... before he has had a medical opinion on the applicants present condition".

 

"Again, for the record,

 

the FEO requested and recieved the medical report BEFORE he arranged the home visit".

 

I rest my case.

[invector]

I wonder if Ryan or Hamilton were suffering from depression?

[davo]

"Who's post is this a response to Gordon?

Can't see where the FEO is going against a medical opinion, because he's not taking the application and has given back the accompanying photo's.... before he has had a medical opinion on the applicants present condition".

"Again, for the record,

 

the FEO requested and recieved the medical report BEFORE he arranged the home visit".

 

This information only came to light after my reply

 

I rest my case.

 

 

Confused I am, what case was that?

It was only disclosed 1 post above your's that the FEO obtained a medical report prior to the home visit, so how did you know that's what he'd done?

The circumstances surrounding the application have been presented in dribs and drabs, only now do we know the order in which things took place, answers to the original posters questions where answered accordingly given the presented facts and as per individuals views. retrospective responses such as the one you have chosen to add are easy to make given the whole story, and in no way give the person with their query any assistance.

Instead of resting you're case you should pack it.

 

And, JUST FOR THE RECORD,

I agree totally with the points raised about suitability, mentally/socially with regard to the issuing of SGC/FAC and that FEO's are out there doing there job, and any bad decisions on their part they would be accountable, also yes, they would not go against a detrimental medical report.

You see how easy it is to reply given all the facts.

[davo]

I wonder if Ryan or Hamilton were suffering from depression?

 

 

Just because people suffer from or have suffered from depression does not mean they are out of control or potential mass murderers, and as a condition to which we are all vulnerable, (even rock hard emotionless tough guys) we should not stigmatise nor label any body that has had or does suffer from the condition or similar.

A medical history of depression does not automatically exclude you from possessing a SGC/FAC, there are a thousand reasons for suffering depression and about as many variations of the condition.

[rhodes]

I wonder if Ryan or Hamilton were suffering from depression?

 

 

Just because people suffer from or have suffered from depression does not mean they are out of control or potential mass murderers, and as a condition to which we are all vulnerable, (even rock hard emotionless tough guys) we should not stigmatise nor label any body that has had or does suffer from the condition or similar.

A medical history of depression does not automatically exclude you from possessing a SGC/FAC, there are a thousand reasons for suffering depression and about as many variations of the condition.

 

Thanks Davo, could't have put it better myself.

[dustyfox]

Just because people suffer from or have suffered from depression does not mean they are out of control or potential mass murderers,

 

But they have got to choose which ones are or not.

 

And the the GP must of said something to the FAO for him to be so convinced of him not getting a Certificate, I think there is a lot more to this than we think.

[rhodes]

Just because people suffer from or have suffered from depression does not mean they are out of control or potential mass murderers,

 

But they have got to choose which ones are or not.

 

And the the GP must of said something to the FAO for him to be so convinced of him not getting a Certificate, I think there is a lot more to this than we think.

 

Trust me there isn't. The FEO tol me tha it was simply policy to act on the cautious side in case where depression/anxiety is involved. period.

[dustyfox]

Just because people suffer from or have suffered from depression does not mean they are out of control or potential mass murderers,

 

But they have got to choose which ones are or not.

 

And the the GP must of said something to the FAO for him to be so convinced of him not getting a Certificate, I think there is a lot more to this than we think.

 

Trust me there isn't. The FEO tol me tha it was simply policy to act on the cautious side in case where depression/anxiety is involved. period.

 

Whats your age he could just be thinking that you are young and do stupid things.

[rhodes]

Just because people suffer from or have suffered from depression does not mean they are out of control or potential mass murderers,

 

But they have got to choose which ones are or not.

 

And the the GP must of said something to the FAO for him to be so convinced of him not getting a Certificate, I think there is a lot more to this than we think.

 

Trust me there isn't. The FEO tol me tha it was simply policy to act on the cautious side in case where depression/anxiety is involved. period.

 

Whats your age he could just be thinking that you are young and do stupid things.

 

 

I wish!! A grand old 33!!

[dustyfox]

Just because people suffer from or have suffered from depression does not mean they are out of control or potential mass murderers,

 

But they have got to choose which ones are or not.

 

And the the GP must of said something to the FAO for him to be so convinced of him not getting a Certificate, I think there is a lot more to this than we think.

 

Trust me there isn't. The FEO tol me tha it was simply policy to act on the cautious side in case where depression/anxiety is involved. period.

 

Whats your age he could just be thinking that you are young and do stupid things.

 

 

I wish!! A grand old 33!!

 

No offence on the age thing.

 

Anyway you say that you get anxiety when in social occasions are these anywhere or in a pub or somthing, couldnt be that thing where you in a room full of people I think its called i try and spell it Claustrophobia

 

Claustrophobia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[markbivvy]

Enochlophobia- Fear of crowds.

[ROBLATCH]

i realy think the top and bottom basis of this is that the feo is covering his own a// just in case of the inevitable.no matter what is said or done if he says no i think he means no (at least for the time being)

[rhodes]

i realy think the top and bottom basis of this is that the feo is covering his own a// just in case of the inevitable.no matter what is said or done if he says no i think he means no (at least for the time being)

 

 

Yep, I guess your right.

 

To be fair, if it's not a job I'd relish!! If I was the one signing the certificate off I'd cover my a// too!!

[dustyfox]

Cant you do some research and show him the facts, he may not understand it and if you show him the facts he may think about it.

 

And get a report from your doctor and see what he says.

[rhodes]

Cant you do some research and show him the facts, he may not understand it and if you show him the facts he may think about it.

 

And get a report from your doctor and see what he says.

 

That's the plan. I just have to wait for the official 'no' so I can get in writing what his actual concerns are.

[dustyfox]

Cant you do some research and show him the facts, he may not understand it and if you show him the facts he may think about it.

 

And get a report from your doctor and see what he says.

 

That's the plan. I just have to wait for the official 'no' so I can get in writing what his actual concerns are.

 

Well I hope all goes well in the future and hope that soon you will get what you want. Never give up and keep ur head up.

[rhodes]

Cant you do some research and show him the facts, he may not understand it and if you show him the facts he may think about it.

 

And get a report from your doctor and see what he says.

 

That's the plan. I just have to wait for the official 'no' so I can get in writing what his actual concerns are.

 

Well I hope all goes well in the future and hope that soon you will get what you want. Never give up and keep ur head up.

 

Cheers dude, if everything in life was easy it'd be boring!!

 

thanks again x

[Eagleman]

I've worked in the mental health field and as many have said so far both depression and anxiety are complex areas. As a matter of fact the vast (and I mean VAST) majority of people who suffer mental ill health are no danger to anyone. One major problem is that most people do not understand mental ill health and lump all "mental illness" from mild anxiety or depression through to major psychosis in one bag. This generates a fear of mental ill health as mentally ill people are perceived as "different" and thus provoke anxiety in others.

 

Anxiety is of several types. How many members on here suffer some sort of phobia? More than a few I would expect. Well, if you do, technically you are a neurotic. You are suffering a focused form of anxiety - the object of the phobic response. As has been mentioned, Claustrophobia is an example, Agoraphobia is another. There are a great many. Another, more debilitating anxiety is "generalised anxiety" when a person feels anxious but cannot readily recognise the cause. A yet more serious form of this is called depersonalisation where the person starts to feel "fuzzy" and disorientated. Both generalised anxiety and the more serious depersonalisation tend to respond well to drug treatment and usually can be easily controlled on drugs.

 

Depression takes many forms. All of us at sometime during our lives suffer the reactive depression brought about by loss of a loved one. It doesn't have to be a person lost to life, a deeply loved pet and even inanimate objects can engender such depression. Loss reactions are natural and inevitable and we get over them. Not so easy to treat is a depressive illness that is often referred to as endogenous depression which is deep seated and the cause of which lies deep in the past and is often inaccessible to the person afflicted. This type is very hard to treat (all forms of treatment) and some cases do end in suicide.

 

Conditions that result in psychosis are many. However, the main forms are the various types of schizophrenia, bi-polar (manic) depression and schizo-affective disorder. These conditions usually result in psychotic episodes from time-to-time where the person loses contact with reality to some greater and lesser degree. Most people suffering these conditions are more a danger to self than others (although some are a danger to others - most often paranoid schizophrenia) and the suicide rate for schizophrenics generally is very high at 1 in 6 approximately.

 

I am, of course, unsure what the situation is in this case and the Police will naturally and reasonably err on the side of caution. Medical opinion is the key.

[Chard]

Everyone gets 'depressed' at some time or other. I used the word 'anxiety' ('suffered from in my youth') in my application. No probs at all.

What you have to think about is a young soldier:

 

'I'm anxious and depressed Sgt. Major...'

 

'B*****ks! Pick up that gun an' get marching!'

 

If it's good for him it's good for you!' I'm sorry, but it's a 'job's worth' thing with doctors and Chief Constables.

 

I agree with this.

 

I got a bit depressed when my business took a major downturn. I just couldn't see anything positive in anything for a while. I went to the doctor about it and she asked me a few questions on an official "depression" questionnaire. I remember one of them was asking whether I ever wanted to harm myself or others. I answered "No" to that one and she said that if I felt that I wanted them, she could prescribe anti-depressants, and asked if I wanted them. I said that I would prefer not to take pills, and she said that was a good sign and suggested that I pi$$ off , see how it went and come back again if I didn't feel any better or if it got worse.

 

I then told her about being a SGC holder and asked if I should declare all this officially and she said "No". I queried it, reminding her about the declaration on the application, and she said that she was aware of that, but in view of the answers to the questions and my refusal to take pills that were offered, she was happy that I wouldn't do anything silly.

 

After a while, I felt more positive about things, accepted that we would have to economise drastically, that life goes on and now I would just describe myself as "a bit pi$$ed off", rather than depressed :lol:

 

I do think Rhode's case sounds like a bit of a jobsworth situation, but that's how the doc reacted to my circumstances.

[mr_colt]

As I have said previously, the police have far too much discretion in these applications. It often ends up getting based on their personal opinions as opposed to objective evidence and professional opinion. They say it matters not as people can challenge it in court; but forget to say it can cost thousands to do so. Legal Aid is almost non-existant for these legal challenges.

 

Our licensing system should be impartially weighted; with adequate due process giving the applicant the right to a fair defence. Probably many people with anxeity or mild depression history hold SGC's and FAC's. We all can go through difficult times in our lives which can have an effect on us. It all seems to depend on whether the person has seen the doc about it for which should not be punished as the person has done the right thing. Also some docs will exaggerate the facts if they are anti-gun. Medical records too often are not cleaned up after previous entries have been proved false, despite the best efforts of the subject. Doctors are not susposed to fill them with their own personal diatribes about patients but; frequently do.

 

Depression does not equate to a risk of self-harm or harm to others on its own. People should stop fearing anti-depressants in general as they have many non-depression related indications as I have previously stated. Just because they are prescribed for certain conditions does not mean those conditions are psylogicial in nature.

 

Applications with declarations of problems such as this should be looked at individually and CURRENT medical opinion should be viewed as the most important. Historic opinion may need to be considered but, if a person has a mild condition that should not cause too much of a risk regarding firearms. Or the problem is no longer an issue then a cert should really be issued.

 

Bigoted FEO's, Bigoted Doctors and Bigoted Chief Constables are the problem here.

 

mr_colt.

[rhodes]

The comments above are very well informed.

[Scully]

On 10/11/2007 at 08:51, rhodes said:

The comments above are very well informed.

Despite this thread being eleven years old, yes, I would agree, they are. As one who has to declare a bout of anxiety which occurred over 25 years ago, I would say there are other well informed opinions in this thread also.