Churchill method and pigeon hides

[PeterHenry]

20 hours ago, Minky said:

 

How are you going to get dented barrels.?  I  sit on a drum with 3 Hazel sticks supporting two smallish nets about 6ft square  these are formed into a V out front. I try to find if possible a bit of a dip into a hedge so that I don't stand out. Two of the sticks on the hedge line and the third out front. The nets are set low in front and if you were to stand out in the decoys you would be able to see me from the shoulders upwards. The hide is relatively small and inconspicuous. The siting of the decoy patern needs to be where the pigeons want to land and feed. If it is the pigeons don't flair away and  you shoot 5hebirds as they are about to land. You don't have to stand up waving the gun about.  If  the birds don't come into the pattern let them go.  They'll probably come back round. Think of it in a different way.   If you weren't out there shooting the pigeons would find a feeding spot and land in that spot to feed either until they were full or something disturbed them.  In the Archie Coates video with Jack Charlton, Archie said that he took the front bales down and just shot completely uncovered.  I  have  shot pigeons coming Into a pattern just standing against a gate post.  You just got to keep still and wait for the bird to commit to landing.  Bonk. No need to take wild swings around the sky. It's a lot more cartridge efficient.  I  generally manage from about 1.8 to 2 :1

I use metal hide poles - hence the worry about dented barells.

I see what you are saying about takeing the sitters - but I do like to try some if the more challenging shots as well

[Minky]

Go and cut some Hazel sticks. If your in the right place the birds come straight into the kill zone of the pattern and bonk. There is no need to be waving the barrels about.

Edited June 7 by Minky

[PeterHenry]

2 hours ago, Minky said:

Go and cut some Hazel sticks. If your in the right place the birds come straight into the kill zone of the pattern and bonk. There is no need to be waving the barrels about.

👍

[THEINVISIBLESCARECROW]

I shoot from a seat decoying, either a drum with a swivel seat or fishing Box seat, I use tall undergrowth in front of a high hedge for a hide, I shoot sat down. For roost shooting I stand in front of a tree or bush moveing locations as needed at the time for new flight lines. I've been reading about the Churchill method after buying an AYA XXV. Going to give it a try at harvest. At the moment I'm rifle shooting.

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, I would also look at the Ruffer method in his book Good Shooting book, maybe much the same as Robert Churchill ??

[Old Boggy]

On 11/06/2024 at 16:32, THEINVISIBLESCARECROW said:

I shoot from a seat decoying, either a drum with a swivel seat or fishing Box seat, I use tall undergrowth in front of a high hedge for a hide, I shoot sat down. For roost shooting I stand in front of a tree or bush moveing locations as needed at the time for new flight lines. I've been reading about the Churchill method after buying an AYA XXV. Going to give it a try at harvest. At the moment I'm rifle shooting.

The AYA XXV is a cracking gun for instinctive shooting, quick to start, but quick to stop. Also a good gun for the hide. I had one many years ago and shot as well with it as I am ever likely to shoot.

Enjoy it.

[PeterHenry]

On 11/06/2024 at 16:32, THEINVISIBLESCARECROW said:

I shoot from a seat decoying, either a drum with a swivel seat or fishing Box seat, I use tall undergrowth in front of a high hedge for a hide, I shoot sat down. For roost shooting I stand in front of a tree or bush moveing locations as needed at the time for new flight lines. I've been reading about the Churchill method after buying an AYA XXV. Going to give it a try at harvest. At the moment I'm rifle shooting.

👍

On 11/06/2024 at 16:39, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, I would also look at the Ruffer method in his book Good Shooting book, maybe much the same as Robert Churchill ??

I've just gone and bought myself a copy cheers

3 hours ago, Old Boggy said:

The AYA XXV is a cracking gun for instinctive shooting, quick to start, but quick to stop. Also a good gun for the hide. I had one many years ago and shot as well with it as I am ever likely to shoot.

Enjoy it.

I found that using the method in Churchills book deals with the quick to stop bit - so what you end up with is more of the pros, less of the cons

[oldypigeonpopper]

1 minute ago, PeterHenry said:

👍

I've just gone and bought myself a copy cheers

I found that using the method in Churchills book deals with the quick to stop bit - so what you end up with is more of the pros, less of the cons

Hello, Let us know what think on the Ruffer method compared to Churchill , cheers

[PeterHenry]

18 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, Let us know what think on the Ruffer method compared to Churchill , cheers

Will do 👍

[Dave at kelton]

Not really picked up this thread until now. I used to shoot pigeon and generally sitting on a plastic drum. While birds would occasionally catch you by surprise I could usually shift to a comfortable shooting position. As for denting barrels I never had my hide set where it was a remote possibility.

Now wildfowling is very different. I am generally in a muddy gutter and rarely use nets as at best it birds off. I am kneeling if I am lucky and crouched behind a ditch bank. You can’t shift and it is all about moving at the hips or just taking the most comfortable bird out of a skein which is not necessarily the best. If you are unfamiliar with the challenge the pics in my BASC article give a good idea. As for standing and shooting….forget it. I have been lying down shooting more than I have standing. I don’t see anyone practising that at the clay ground 😂 

[marquesgriffin]

The Churchill method emphasizes a smooth, instinctive swing. Sitting with the gun muzzles pointing up in a hide might be risky. It could snag on netting or damage the barrels on poles.

Instead, try starting with the gun resting on your lap, unloaded and broken open. When a pigeon approaches, stand up smoothly and bring the gun straight into shooting position in one motion. This avoids extra movements and keeps the barrels pointed safely away from the hide.

[JDog]

19 minutes ago, marquesgriffin said:

The Churchill method emphasizes a smooth, instinctive swing. Sitting with the gun muzzles pointing up in a hide might be risky. It could snag on netting or damage the barrels on poles.

Instead, try starting with the gun resting on your lap, unloaded and broken open. When a pigeon approaches, stand up smoothly and bring the gun straight into shooting position in one motion. This avoids extra movements and keeps the barrels pointed safely away from the hide.

You forgot loading the gun then closing it. Hardly one motion, certainly not smooth.

[PeterHenry]

29 minutes ago, JDog said:

You forgot loading the gun then closing it. Hardly one motion, certainly not smooth.

👍

[PeterHenry]

1 hour ago, marquesgriffin said:

The Churchill method emphasizes a smooth, instinctive swing. Sitting with the gun muzzles pointing up in a hide might be risky. It could snag on netting or damage the barrels on poles.

Instead, try starting with the gun resting on your lap, unloaded and broken open. When a pigeon approaches, stand up smoothly and bring the gun straight into shooting position in one motion. This avoids extra movements and keeps the barrels pointed safely away from the hide.

What I really object to about AI is the cobbled together nonsense replies like this - that, and the ungodly amount of resources consumed to bring them to us...

Edited July 5 by PeterHenry

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, How did you find the Ruffer book Peter ?? , any different to how Churcill advocated in his style of shooting ?,  It all goes back to a time when short barrel side by sides with high raised ribs became a firm favourite, a lot of people i knew bought one, i had an  AYA XXV boxlock, Shooting was one swift movement from gun down to shoulder always with both eyes open and trigger pulled as you pass the bird, Prefered cartridge , Eley Impax , Today i see it as point / pass / shoot, mainly semi auto and O/U , That is how i seem to do with my O/U , a few years back i did try another XXV type shotgun but never did any good compared to the O/U , 

[PeterHenry]

1 hour ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, How did you find the Ruffer book Peter ?? , any different to how Churcill advocated in his style of shooting ?,  It all goes back to a time when short barrel side by sides with high raised ribs became a firm favourite, a lot of people i knew bought one, i had an  AYA XXV boxlock, Shooting was one swift movement from gun down to shoulder always with both eyes open and trigger pulled as you pass the bird, Prefered cartridge , Eley Impax , Today i see it as point / pass / shoot, mainly semi auto and O/U , That is how i seem to do with my O/U , a few years back i did try another XXV type shotgun but never did any good compared to the O/U , 

It took a while for the book to arrive, and I've only has a quick flick though - but it seems to be more or less identical to Churchills method.

I'm looking forward to spending a little more time going though the book when I have a minute or two - excellent book suggestion thank you 👍

 

Edited July 5 by PeterHenry

[oldypigeonpopper]

4 minutes ago, PeterHenry said:

It took a while for the book to arrive, and I've only has a quick flick though - but it seems to be more or less identical to Churchills method.

I'm looking forward to spending a little more time going though the book when I have a minute or two - it excellent book suggestion thank you 👍

 

Hello, Ok that sound good, not sure on the Churchill book but Ruffer explains in great detail with diagrams etc, 

[PeterHenry]

1 minute ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, Ok that sound good, not sure on the Churchill book but Ruffer explains in great detail with diagrams etc, 

👍

[Westley]

Instead of sitting reading, have a word with your local clay shooting ground about sitting to practice shooting from that position.  I took my shooting seat to a skeet layout and shot it sitting down. OK so there was no net, but it still makes you adopt a position prior to shooting, that aids gunmounting etc. Choose a stand that is easily shootable to start on and work your way up. It will help you far more than reading about it.

[pigeon controller]

I have always stood to shoot. The hide is constructed to be  higher at the edges so I can move to the centre to shoot over it but watch the incoming birds from the edge. I  reload the gun inside the hide not over the top.

Thats the way I do it.

[wymberley]

On 28/05/2024 at 20:09, JDog said:

I cannot imagine how those who do not use a seat can ever keep their faces below the level of the net.

Wish I'd said that. My mistake was saying, 'you should keep your face.......'. This was very quickly followed by a member pointing out my error in that 'should' means it's obligatory and you 'must'........'. 

If you're going to shoot from sitting, get a fair sized cardboard box or similar and shoot it while sitting upright. Then turn it around and try again leaning into the shot. You'll get my drift.

[Westley]

I thought the 'Churchill Method' involved choking the birds with cigar smoke first   !     😆

[TIGHTCHOKE]

OUCH!

[oowee]

On 02/09/2024 at 17:41, pigeon controller said:

I have always stood to shoot. The hide is constructed to be  higher at the edges so I can move to the centre to shoot over it but watch the incoming birds from the edge. I  reload the gun inside the hide not over the top.

Thats the way I do it.

I do the same but.... when I am shooting every day big numbers (abroad) I either have to be more selective or shoot sitting down. Sitting and then standing 500 times a day, day after day is a killer. If I am shooting from inside a tall crop like sunflowers I remain standing and only sit for a rest. 

It can be a real work out. Key is getting a seat where legs are not too bent. 

[marsh man]

1 hour ago, oowee said:

I do the same but.... when I am shooting every day big numbers (abroad) I either have to be more selective or shoot sitting down. Sitting and then standing 500 times a day, day after day is a killer. If I am shooting from inside a tall crop like sunflowers I remain standing and only sit for a rest. 

It can be a real work out. Key is getting a seat where legs are not too bent. 

Sitting and standing up to 500 times would be a workout for the fittest and the younger generation , from 50 onwards you can cut that back to 400 times , then reaching 60 the cut backs come into play again by cutting it down to 300 times , you then enter the allocated time of three score years and ten , this is where the seat legs are straight and your own are bent like a Cucumber , like me the 80 is a lot nearer than the 70 so just getting out and remembering to take your gear is as about as much as you can hope for .