Ron L

NTTF I have gone to Argentina and Uruguay 5 times in the last 3 years. Each time I have taken my own guns with very little difficulty. It is a 1 page form that you have to have filled out in triplicate. Unfortunately, each year they want to chargemore money and I just found out that this year it is $100US per gun. Yes, the pig sticking was done with catch dogs (Argentinian dogos) which were very good at their jobs. Ron L Highlander I would be interested in learning more about your pigeon/dove shooting in SA ( assuming that you mean Sout Africa rather than South America). I am interested in a wingshooting trip in South Africa along with some game viewing and fishing. Could we talk by private email? Thanks Ron L

Paul It is hard to believe but it is true. Your calculations were pretty close to the truth except there were 2 hunter on this day. With this volume of shooting, I can only shoot 6 hours a day before I am just too fatigued to shoot well. We shoot 3 hours in the morning, have a nice lunch in the field followed by a siesta, and then shoot 3 hours in the afternoon. We can easily have 1 shot every 15 seconds as there are multiple targets. 2/3rds of the time I hit the bird. My son is a little better. This works out to 240 shells per hour or 160 birds per hour for each hunter. 6 hours x 160 birds/hour x 2 hunters = 1920 birds between the 2 of us in one day. I have friend who has shot 2200 shells and killed 1500 birds himself in 1 day just this last Feb. He was using 2 semiauto Benellis with magazine extensions (7 shots) with 2 bird boys loading guns for him. I prepurchase 1000 shells/day for every day that I am planning on dove hunting. All of this is hard to believe but very much the truth. If you try this with a single gun, it gets so hot that it will burn you. Gloves are mandatory. My side by side has gotten so hot that it would no longer open. Here is a picture of hunter whose gun did not fit him well. This is after the second day of shooting doves. The flocks of doves are literally millions of birds which breed 2-3 times per year with several chicks in each nest. The chicks are breeding within 9 months of being hatched. To watch them leave the roost is a constant stream of birds for about 3 hours. Use "GOOGLE" and do a search for Argentina dove hunting. You will see that I am not joking about the volume of birds. Ron L Highlander I have copied this from one of the outfitters in Argentina that I have shot with. FEW WORDS TO THE CONCERNED I can understand that some people would feel bad that millions of birds are being shot by sport hunters every year in Argentina. I understand because I realize that it is their nature and their instinct. I hunt for the same reasons, because it is in my nature and instinct. Let me however put into perspective the impact on dove as a species without entering into the morality of the thing. Morality is in large part a product of the culture we are raised in you know. In Argentina there is no season on dove and no limit to how much you can shoot. There is a reason for this. The number of dove and the rate at which they reproduce is such that they pose a serious threat to the livelihood of many people. When they descend on a grain crop they will destroy around 50% of that crop. This understandably upsets the farmers who before the dove shooting industry flourished, would poison the roosts where the doves live and breed. The goal of the farmers was complete eradication of the dove. The poisoning of a large roost resulted in the killing of several million birds and the poison runoff would affect a great many other species. Since the dove shooting industry flourished in Cordoba, mass poisoning has stopped. The farmers recognize in the dove a viable source of income. A lease on a good dove roost costs what an average argentine worker makes in a year, and that is just for the shooting rights. An entire year of dove shooting by the estimated 4000 shooters who come here will kill less birds than the poisoning of just 4 roosts. In addition many major dove roosts are being saved from destruction by the dove lodge operators themselves, who purchase them, thus avoiding the cutting down of the trees and clearing of the land for agricultural use. When the dove lose their habitat they will be no more. There are easily over 300,000,000 dove in Cordoba. They nest 2 to 3 times a year and lay 2-3 eggs each time. The only real danger to them is the destruction of their habitat and poisoning. It is impossible to endanger them as a species by means of recreational hunting. As has happened many times before with many other species, recreational hunting is in fact saving them. Another factor to take into consideration is the spread of diseases in which the birds act as a vector of transmission to humans. The explosion in bird populations that results when the dove have large tracts of agricultural land to feed on, puts the human population in danger of diseases like some forms of encephalitis and flu, both quite deadly to humans. Control is a necesity, not an option. anyone? probably dumped Dazza Everytime we shot, the doves were picked up, bagged, and taken to the local towns and given away. The local people can not afford to pay for shotguns and shells. I am told that the meat is given to school, orphanages, nursing home for the elderly, and anyone that might want some. I guess that they could just be dumping them but they sure go through a lot of work at the end of every shoot collecting the birds. Ron L

The shells are not cheap as we paid $8.00/box. Shooting 40 boxes/day can begin to hurt by the third day! The hunts are relatively cheap. We are going back this July for 4.5 days of shooting which includes 3 dove hunts, 3 pigeon hunts, and 3 rough hunts for perdiz over pointing dogs. Total cost is $1050 US which includes all food, lodging, drinks, etc. The outfitter is promising realistic numbers of 1000 dove/day, 500 pigeon/day, and 30 perdiz/day. I have never shot more than 100 pigeons/day so I am looking forward to trying to shoot 500 in one day. They pass shoot their pigeons but I am planning on bringing some decoys with to experiment with. I know that this is a wingshooting forum but this is a wild boar that we killed using a knife when we were wingshooting in Argentina 2 years ago. It is a very exciting way of getting up close and personal with your quarry. It is not recommended for the faint of heart! Ron L

I realize that these are not pigeons but I thought I would show you how many doves a father and son from North Carolina can shoot in 1 day when given the opportunity. This hunt occured 2 summers ago in Argentina where the typical dove roost has several million birds! I shot 983 using a side by side with my son shooting over 1000 using a Benelli semi auto. Enjoy! Ron L

When setting up for pigeon hunting, what ratio do you use for heads up versus heads down on your decoys? I was thinking that if all the birds had their heads up, it would look like a flock of pigeons on alert. Thanks. Ron L

We set-up the hide just at dark the night before. We then returned the next morning before light, put out the decoys, and got settled into the hide. The crows started coming at first light but kept coming until 1:00PM when we quit to have a bite to eat.

I would like advice on which electric flapper to purchase for hunting pigeons and crows. Should it have a timer or a remote control? Why? Which is better? Pinewood offers a flapper including a timer and a battery but the price seems steep. Decoying.co. offers a flapper with a free battery but no remote or timer at a much more reasonable price ukshooterswarehouse offers a remote control for their flapper Thank you in advance for your opinions.

Yes, we built 1 hide and put all 4 of us in it. We are all friends and have hunted together safely for years. It makes for interesting conversation when 1 of us misses a bird!

After having read posts on this forum about crow hunting without an electronic caller or an owl decoy, I invited several friends for a crow hunt last week. We drove to southern Georgia (USA) where we put a dozen flocked decoys on the ground and several up in trees while hunting in a pecan orchard. We built a good blind which you can see in the background of the pictures. We then used 1 mouth call, and tried to imitate feeding crows rather than the usual run and gun hunt doing a crow/owl fight that is most commonly used here in the U.S. The crows kept coming in singles and pairs for 5 hours which is very different than the usual 20 minute hunt where we kill 4-6 birds and then have to move and set-up again. As you see our final total was 64 birds! Thank you for all the good information that is posted on this forum.

If this is the wrong forum, please accept my apologies. In the U.S., we use a few whole body crow decoys with an electronic caller and have a moderate amount of success . I was just wondering that if I added more movement to my decoys, would I decoy more birds? When hunting crows in England, do you hunt them using floaters/bouncers, rotary magnets, or flapping decoys? Thanks. Ron L

I have been reading John Humphreys "Shooting Pigeons". He mentions manual pull type flappers "Dead Cert or Semark/WAGBI" as well as a "Fife Swooper" flapper decoy. Has anyone used these successfully and are they commercially available for purchase? He also mentions taking a dead bird, breaking its wings, and then lobbying out the dead bird near his decoys to attract live birds passing in the distance. Does this tactic work often? Thanks again. Ron Liljedahl

These may seem like silly question but........ Would one of you please explain the difference between a telescopic bouncer and a telescopic floater? How does a decoy or a dead bird act different when attached to a bouncer rod versus a floater rod? Can a bouncer rod or floater rod also be used when hunting crows? I need a rod that collapses to a length of 4 foot so that I can fly it with me on a plane. Thank you! Ron L

I had never scrolled to the bottom of the list to discover the windsocks for pigeons. Thanks for pointing that out! Has anyone tried using windsock pigeon decoys and what were the results? We have had good luck decoying geese but I am looking for a pigeon decoy that would collapse for traveling on a plane. Thanks again. Ron L I live in the USA (North Carolina). We have little pigeon shooting around here but I do occasionally travel to Argentina for wingshooting but it is mostly pass shooting. I am interested in trying to decoy the pigeons. I am wanting to make up a "pigeon decoying kit" that would travel with me when I fly. Ron L

Is there anyone that makes a "windsock" style pigeon decoy? Thanks. Ron L

I have a couple of questions for the pigeon hunters that frequent this forum. I travel occasionally to Argentina where we pass shoot pigeons but I would now like to try decoying pigeons. The pigeons are typically unpressured and have responded sometimes when we place dead birds in the fields. I am interested in the best pigeon decoys that could easily fit into my luggage when flying. If they were collapsible, it would be helpful. I was considering one dozen flocked shell bodies and 1 flying decoy on a bouncer rod. Can I use EZ Wobbler rods with shell decoys? Can you buy or make a 2 piece bouncer rod so that it would fit into my luggage when flying? Any suggestions for cradles that I could make or buy for the dead birds to give them a more life like appearance when used in the fields as decoys? When using kebab sticks on dead birds, do you simply use the kebab stick to hold up the head or is it placed into the body, through the neck, and into the head? Thank you in advance. Ron Liljedahl rrliljedahl@mchsi.com

I live in the United States and I have a mixed species birdhunt schedule for July of 2004 in Argentina. The outfitter asked me to bring him some pigeons decoys. I can not find a source for pigeons decoys in the US. I will have to order them from your side of the big pond. In searching the internet, I find pigeons decoys that sit on the ground, clip to limbs, fly in circles, flap there wings, or hold dead birds in various positions. What decoys would you recommend and why, remembering that space is at a premium when flying? Thank you in advance.