JR111

It is crazy what people are using these days. I actually get quite ****** off as some of the birds are almost usable. On my last shoot, ( very similar to what you said), a young gun was using 36g #4's. Average bird was 30-40 yards with a few at 50. ( very few!) Not surprisingly, he had no interest in taking any birds. Something else that ****** me off! With my last few shoots coming up I will be using 30g #6 and if a high drive might drop to a #5. Bit like I previously said, pattern is king!

Sorry, I should have been clearer. I'm aware that Webley and Scott made a huge number of guns for London gun makers, however, other than the likes of W Evans. They were never intended to be true "best" guns. Purdey's, Hollands used Webley due to the vast numbers of guns they required for the London showrooms. The quality was not "best". I have seen Webley shotguns which were marked up as Hollands on the barrels. These are still considerably more expensive just because of the name! I still believe that true London "best" guns were made to a standard. Yes, a price for variations, but still timed served gunsmiths making them. I believe that W Evans had a great working relation with Webley. I believe ( might be wrong) that they could make any model of W Evans shotgun to their desired quality. The guns would be marked as William Evans on the action and ribs. Webley made some great guns and I think the 700 series are a great buy if you are looking for an older s/s. one of my favourite guns is a single barrel 12 bore hammer gun by Wembley and Scott. This was my first shotgun at the age of 11 that my father let me used. The barrel on the gun is immaculate and due to the thickness, I'm sure it will still be around in 1000 years!!

Agreed. As a relatively young English s/s fan (40), I know I could listen to you talk about your trade for hours on end. It's refreshing to listen to the likes of Simon Reinhold talking about the craftsmanship of proper skilled gunmakers, which I'm sure you were. As Reinhold always said, " guns were made to a standard, not a price" I'm sure this has been posted a number of times, but here is a very good link to Purdey gun making. Obviously it is Purdey based, however it shows a modern old school barrel making viewpoint I would love to have seen the gun making ability of gunsmiths of the 1900era. The number of time served gunsmiths will never be matched. @Filkeep sharing your knowledge. I for one will always be happy to hear your opinion Ps going back to my original OP, I still feel £6k is good for workmanship of this quality.

Thanks for your reply and sharing your knowledge. I'm not requiring another gun as I have several other guns which are my go to ( all s/s from about 1900). I think that this is a good deal and would be nice to add to the collection. I do think the money seems about right, however that is with working ejectors. This season I have been using a 1906 Atkin on the original barrels. They are at .736 and .734 on the bores and shooting like a dream. Like you I get a lot asking what cartridges I'm using to reach the high birds. 30grm 6s Purdey paper case and 29 grm 5.5 Gamebore grouse extreme. They are all using cartridges, which in my opinion are far too heavy. I think people are now compensating for lack of ability with more lead in the air. As I keep telling them, shot pattern is king over anything else. Friends laugh at my gun cabinet as no o/u to be had. Maybe one day...

Thanks for your reply and Interesting read. I always spend a considerable time cleaning guns with the correct solvents. I still have 2 litres of original Youngs 303 if I'm wanting that old school smell! Some very good new products about at the moment also which I will use as much safer if it gets near the woodwork. With regards to the gun in question, it is still exactly on the stated bore/proof size so should have plenty of life left. From the family that are selling it on behalf of their late family friend, the gun was never fired since 2002.

Agreed, it's not something I intend doing a lot of!

Thanks for replying. I really appreciate your time. I'm not sure if you can see the proof marks well enough from the poor upload quality. It has the manufacture date of 98 from Purdey. The flats have two bore sizes on them. Both 18.5 and 18.7. The 18.5 bores are proofed london and the 18.7 from Birmingham. The 70 mm stamp appears to have replaced 65 mm. I have checked all of the marks and I'm happy with them all. spoke to the current owner (inherited) and the gun was purchased 2001. Also of note, £8000 was paid at that time. The owner did not alter the barrels, or actually fire them. So the timescale between manufacture and alteration is a max 3 years. I'm more than confident there would not be pitting in this timescale. without removing the mechanism you can never really tell what it's like behind the plates. However, the old gentleman who died was an avid gun collector and his guns were spotless. From paperwork, it would appear he had three Purdeys. ( one of which was a pigeon gun). Two were unfortunately sold before he passed away. His collection consists of browning b25 d5g which has never been fired. This again is worth a considerable amount. this is the tightests gun and the wear on the external is spotless. I personally agree, £6k is a good deal. I have spoken to a few gunsmiths who deal in guns of the era and they advised me that " it is cheap as chips" I would be interested to hear when back boring a gun became a popular thing. I know Browning over bored their guns to 18.7 and it is something many still do. Back then people shot plastic wads more commonly and I could see the benefit for them. It would certainly help with recoil. I would be surprised if someone would be doing that about 2000 and with a Purdey.

I measured the LOP and with the pad it is just under 14 3/4. That is about perfect size wise for me. The pad seems to be an addition at some point and the original stock length of the wood seems quite reasonable for that year. I had a good play about with the ejectors when I looked at the gun. Both eject well when individually fired. What is happening when both are fired, the first ejector is firing fractionally before the left barrel. This is slightly pulling the left ejector forward and therefore the left extractor lever is not hitting the extractor. We fired light snap caps and this was always happening. Thankfully, I had old heavy brass snap caps. They obviously took more force than the light caps and therefore the ejector did not move and they both fired. However, with a 1/4 second delay on the left barrel. Timing is out just enough to cause this issue. Thankfully, the springs all appear to be working fairly strong. Do people think that the gun would be serviced by Purdey when the barrels were being made. It would seem crazy not to be?

Hi everyone. New to pigeonwatch forum and recently posted asking for advice with regards a s/s. Lots of good advice. I was informed about the s/s club and thought I would show some of the old guns I'm currently using. No monetary value these days but a joy so shoot. I'm a fan of old guns and look forward to seeing other old guns people have. ps, I hope that this is where I am to post. ( I was asked!)

Not sure where to post. These are my main two guns I use which I'm happy to use in the rain. In the summer won a local clay comp against the over and unders. The Atkin has been flawless all season and has had some big days. Injectors were slowing a bit after a big drive, but never missed a beat. Cant beat the old ones...

Thanks for all the info. Once I find more about the ejectors I will make a decision. This will be a working gun. My criteria for a gun is a fast handling and feels right. Which this does. My preferred option is 30" barrels, but the gun is quick. Aesthetics and name are not important to me. Shootability is. So do I need to join or do I just post on the group. What sort of things should I post which would be of interest?

On it....

Appreciate all opinions. I am fairly well versed with regards to the old guns so I can differentiate between bad advice. But always keen to hear opinions and keen to learn more.

Nice looking gun. I have nicer guns than the Purdey I am looking at, however the new barrels was the big seller for me. Still making up my mind. Barrels were probably a year old when they were opened up, so I'm not concerned about the barrel condition. The original chokes from Purdey were 1/4 and 1/2, however with this opened up it has tightened them. I was hoping this would be for when I needed to shoot standard steel. I have several original barrels from 1900 and some have been lapped out and it is noticeable. These barrels are as good as I've seen. But the ejector issue has changed my mind. Thanks again for advice and opinions Very glad I have joined this forum. Nice to be able to talk old guns to people. I was hoping to stop another gun heading across the pond!

I am confident that there would be no wear in that timescale. ( 3 years max). Definitely will have a think about purchasing it. Not sure I need another gun to the collection but then again...,