Has anyone here trained a NSDTR as a gun dog

[Starman]

Just out of interest really as I am not a serious enough shooter to spend the time train my boy as a gun dog but would definately be interested in some training. He is 12months old now and I would like him to listen to whistle commands, not necessarily for shooting but we go out walking a lot in places where dogs are allowed off the lead and I would like to still have control of him from a distance.

[PWD]

I think regardless of breed...the whistle is a very good tool to use for training any dog..its simple clear and excact in what you want..given your probably only after a few commands stop,recall etc should be a very easy to teach ..use it sparingly and posativly and it will be far more effective , dont nagg the dog with it ..use treats to instill it if nessesary ..once you have it masterd you wont leave home without one...Acme 210.5 is a good all rounder , though others have different opinions like 210 .211.5 but pick one and stick to it . Once the dog has it sorted..its a reasuring tool to know you can recall your dog from distance . Then try direction with it to...adds to the fun best tip I could give is if you blow a recall...complete it that is get the dog right in close..dont be lazy and ignor it when its on the way back otherwise it will start to ignor it too..get it up close and personal..treats ,fuss nude pics of other dogs whatever..just so it gets the idea a recall is a very good thing to happen in its life as its often used to stop the dog doing what it wants to be doing . Age wont matter for basics..I have a 6 yr old JR that learnt if from the other dogs

Edited January 8, 2010 by PWD

[Starman]

Thanks. I assume the 210.5/210/211 etc are slightly different pitches?

 

Also my daughter will need training to train him

[PWD]

She,s doing a grand job ...least it aint ignoring her and its fun mate ...good thing the whistle is multi user to a point...we all blow em different but the basics are the same ..unlike spoken commands were we all use different words ..like come back, here , you liitle sod which just aid confusion

 

yep all diff pitches..the 210.5 is pea less ..good allrounder ..should cost around a fiver

[dick darstardly]

sort of .................. My girl Lilly is a nova scotia x choc lab. Very pretty girl and a great gun dog. She seems to of captured the best of both. They are very responsive to good training and she often atracts comment. I have only had her since she was 1 and a half but she has progressed really quickly.

Edited January 8, 2010 by dick darstardly

[Starman]

Bin up the gun shop lunch time and got a couple of 210.5 whistles.

 

You can really see the Toller in Lilly, her face is very much like Sonic.

[dick darstardly]

What a beaut!! i use a 210 1/2 for lilly

[cracker]

Just out of interest really as I am not a serious enough shooter to spend the time train my boy as a gun dog but would definately be interested in some training. He is 12months old now and I would like him to listen to whistle commands, not necessarily for shooting but we go out walking a lot in places where dogs are allowed off the lead and I would like to still have control of him from a distance.

 

 

Not a slam, Starman, but tollers want training and regrettably all too often get next to none of it. And thus get short shrift as gundogs. They are meant to be gundogs, whether for tolling, flushing, or for non-slip work. I train for all three,

almost 13 years into this one

 

 

and tollers train just as easily as any of the other retrieving or flushing breeds--if you put in the time to train them. The sobering thing about bringing on the breed is how few of them are actually worked. Especially in the UK, but likewise in the States. Hope you follow through on your idea of training, which could go a ways in changing that perception and maybe even encourage you to have a gundog not just a gundog breed. Nice looking pup by the way.

 

MG

[Starman]

Cheers for the comments, I agree Sonic needs to be trained. He is so intelligent it would be a real shame not to do something with him and he gets bored easily.

[cracker]

Cheers for the comments, I agree Sonic needs to be trained. He is so intelligent it would be a real shame not to do something with him and he gets bored easily.

 

Bingo, Starman. The boredom is directly proportionate to how smart tollers are--and indicative of how much you need to challenge them. Training your toller as a gundog would bring much-needed structure and work ethic if you will to the dog. If I may be so brash, it would be most helpful to you as handler of the toller, too.

 

Here's my nearly 13-year-old last evening

 

 

later in the shoot, her much younger protege replete with toller eyes.

 

 

 

Now go to it with training--you won't regret it. I suggest you also challenge in addition to your toller and your self, a professional retriever trainer who probably has never seen a toller, much less trained one. Again, benefits for all.

 

MG

[cracker]

Moved up for the other query about working tollers. Understand a topnotch toller from the US for field tests is working in the obedience ring at Crufts this year; you might go out and have a look.

 

Incidentally, they weren't bred for retrieving so much as for waterfowl "having a look"--i.e., tolling (luring) (decoying).

 

They retrieve perfectly well too--if taught. And trained.

 

 

All too often not, to be candid, on either count. http://www.retrievertraining.net/forums/sh...ead.php?t=49925 The UK particularly lagging in that regard insofar as the NSDTR as a working gundog.

 

MG

[Spaniel]

Nice looking dog Starman.

 

Thanks for some good info Cracker, i was watching a prog on the Sky box yesterday and it was about Foxgrove kennels and their dogs which they breed.

 

My interest was from a Wildfowling point, i have a couple of Spaniels which work well on the Pheasant shoot but when i seen this prog i thought what a great dog to use for Wildfowling.

 

I also noticed their is a breeder near me in Taunton which offer pups and training etc,

 

I was reading yesterday on the web that these dogs would be used to trot along the edge of the pond and due to their colour the ducks think they were foxes and would come in to the shore to chase them away....is that correct ?

 

Cheers

[Wesman]

Cracker - what is special about their eyes? I noticed the reflection in the photo? Does that mean they have great night vision like foxes?

 

I'm obsessed with dogs but I don't know much about tollers.

[Wookie]

If you have a toller and want to work it, you really need to be talking to Philip at Fallowfen Gundogs. He breeds them and specialises in Tollers. Ok, I'm biased because he trained my Springer, but he's a very good trainer and knows the breed very, very well.

 

PM me and I'll send you his contact details. Or, you could search for Fallowfen on the net.

[Spaniel]

I did have a look at his web site yesterday, i think i found 3 sites (UK) ref these dogs and breeders/trainers etc.

 

The site in Taunton actually do training days where you can go down and visit them if you have an ineterest in the breed etc but no dates for this year was on their at present, which i thought was avery good idea

 

www.foxdownweb.com

[cracker]

I was reading that these dogs would be used to trot along the edge of the pond and due to their colour the ducks think they were foxes and would come in to the shore to chase them away....is that correct ?

 

Sort of, but that's the antithesis of how it works. What kind of bottle's a retriever got if a duck or goose can chase it away? I have seen tollers that would run from waterfowl, however. That's not the idea, though. Ducks are drawn to a toller for their own safety--as in the old saying, "The devil you know's better than the devil you don't." So long as their focus is on the dog's movement the dog (or fox) cannot surprise them by ambushing them for dinner.

 

If you have a toller and want to work it, you really need to be talking to Philip at Fallowfen Gundogs. He breeds them and specialises in Tollers. Ok, I'm biased because he trained my Springer, but he's a very good trainer and knows the breed very, very well.

 

I'd be interested to know since this chap trained your spaniel how he "specialises" in tollers? Perhaps trains them as spaniels instead of nonslip? Not a right or wrong approach, just taking the easier way with a toller for having a gundog. Tollers are retrievers,

 

 

which is a little at cross purpose with tolling, which is a form of questing or quartering. Very, very few have been trained to any significant level as nonslip working dogs. I'm wondering if a toller has ever been run in even a novice field trial in the UK. Maybe you can set me straight?

 

MG

[Wookie]

Cracker,

 

Philip can train pretty much everything, however, he breeds tollers. I chose him to train my spaniel because, when I visited him, I was impressed with how he interacted with Ted (my dog) and him personally. Like I said before, I'm biased, 'cos I think he's a genuine, nice chap that has a serious talent for training.

 

With regard to your specific questions about nonslip and questing, I'm going to have to back out. I really don't know, but I am sure that, if you phoned him and asked him, Philip would be able to set you straight on all of those points. Like I said, he's a good bloke and know Tollers very well.