IanClark

Happy to help Firstly, your reason for possession should be'sporting shooting and vermin control' - that covers everything you might want to do. On both of your applications, where it asks for firearms to be acquired, list both guns and state 'shared possession with XXXXXX at same address' If PSNI are not satisfied with the information you have supplied, they will contact you and ask for more - the local Firearms Enquiry officer will contact you to ask for clarification if any is needed, and a simple explanation of what you are doing given to him should be fine. There is nothing unusual about what you are doing - it happens often, so there should be no problem. If there's anything else you need, just let me know. Ian

Ehm, don't want to be picky, but the ban starts at 00.01 tomorrow Happy new year to you all! Ian URGENT NOTICE TO ALL WHO SHOOT IN SCOTLAND Temporary wildfowling ban You will wish to be aware that Roseanna Cunningham, Minister for Environment, signed an Order this morning, Sunday 3 January, imposing a temporary ban on wildfowling in Scotland. The purpose of the ban is to reduce disturbance to wildfowl in the current severe weather. The ban follows procedure previously agreed for severe weather conditions. The ban comes into effect at 00.01 on Tuesday 5th January and will last for 14 days. It will be reviewed after 7 days and may be lifted then if conditions have sufficiently improved. Please note that woodcock and snipe are included in this ban, and may not be shot even on game shoots. The ban also extends to foreshore shooting below the high tide line. Because the hard weather looks set to continue, it is unlikely that the ban will be lifted after seven days in this case, and in fact a further 14 day ban is likely to be imposed, which will effectively mean that wildfowl and waders may be protected until the end of this season, with the possible exception of foreshore shooting in February if the weather has improved. WARNING - TEMPORARY SUSPENSION OF THE SHOOTING OF BIRDS IN SCOTLAND Due to the recent severe weather Roseanna Cunningham, Minister for Environment, has made an Order prohibiting the shooting of birds in Scotland, below the high water mark of ordinary spring tides. Species covered by the order, listed on Schedule 2 Part I of the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981, are: Coot, Tufted Duck, Gadwall, Goldeneye, Canada, Greylag and Pink-footed Geese, Mallard, Moorhen, Pintail, Golden Plover, Pochard, Shoveler, Common Snipe, Teal, Wigeon, Woodcock. The ban came into effect at 0.01 a.m. on Tuesday 5th January 2010 and ends at 11.59 p. m. on 18th January 2010. This ban is effective only in Scotland. Anyone who does not comply with this Order is committing an offence

Not as simple as it might have looked, Zeb! At 17, both of you have the right to carry air rifles and use them anywhere you have permission. If the rifles are over 12 ft lbs power, they would need to be on a Firearm Certificate - if they are, message me and I'll tell you about that to save space on here. That means you both have the right to own the air rifles, carry them with you and use them anywhere you have permission and at any legal quarry. The bit about your post that worried me was the 'load up the air rifles and head off...' Under firearms law, any part of a firearm is itself a firearm - including sound moderators and magazines. If you load the magazine at home before you go out to shoot, that magazine becomes, in law, a loaded firearm - and it is an offence to have with you a loaded firearm in a public place. This applies even if the magazine is in the car, or in your pocket or anywhere else! The answer is to wait until you are actually on the land where you have the shooting permission before you load the magazine - I know it's a pain fiddling about in the dark, but it's better than a night in the cells! I deal with a lot of cases like this for our junior members - the legal insurance covers the fees for an expert solicitor to fight your case if you are charged Hope that helps, and remember that SACS membership is free until you turn 18...hint hint...

However, £60 would get you: 1. 350 good game carts 2. 3/4 tank of diesel 3. a mid week night out on the beers 4. or 2% of a bargain EELL Diamond Pigeon, hardly used, amazing scroll hand engraved - FOR SALE eh? Or two years SACS membership See! We DO have a sense of humour!

Sorry about the old clunky website, Cloud - it's under reconstruction. Full membership of SACS costs £30 per year - as a PW member you will get a discout to £22 for your first year - just give us a ring on 01698 885206 and you can do the whole thing over the phone in a couple of minutes

Just last night I was talking to a couple of guys of my own age (60s) that I used to shoot a lot with. There were both of the same opinion - "We have seen the best of shooting in this country. The youngsters of today and tomorrow will never have the sport we had!" Sorry guys, I just cannot accept that. It is up to us to ensure that future generations do have the same opportunities as we had. I couldn't agree more, and although I was being lighthearted, I meant what I said - it is good to know that men like you are still fighting our corner, as you have always done. You will know, as I do, that a great deal of the real pressure on shooting comes from the RSPB and their hit men, who I laughingly call the 'Provisional Raptor Study Groups', and it is done behind closed doors, in all of the places where they have cleverly infiltrated their own people over the years. I nearly choked on Saturday morning as I was driving to a shoot - on the radio, Prof. Des Thomson, one of the SNH top advisors on raptors, said on live radio that 'sparrowhawks are a declining species....' With people like him in positions like that, we have much to do! Let's concentrate on working together and see what we can achieve? Best regards Ian

Pinkfooty, you old smoothie! Good to see you’re still alive and well! :look: You still have that wonderful way with words too, suggesting that (without actually saying so, of course) anyone who doesn’t join BASC isn’t interested in the future of shooting – what a Sir Humphrey you would have made! I agree though, that things would be a lot worse if there had been no WAGBI/BASC – of course they would have been worse. Where we tend to disagree is that in my opinion, if BASC had done its job more robustly, we would be rather better off than we actually are now – but that’s just an opinion. David – as I have explained more fully on another forum, I have neither the time nor the inclination to send you a copy of the HUGE file I have here on SACS insurance – if you have any specific questions, I will be happy to answer them either in private or in the forum if you prefer. Like Pinkfootie, you have a wonderful way with words, but in fact SACS has been considering increasing our public liability to £10 million for some time – in fact since the institutions began to ask for it for shooting leases. In practical terms, the chances of that level of cover being needed are virtually nil, and since it does cost more to have the increased cover, we decided to wait until it became necessary to avoid unnecessary expense for our membership. It is now necessary, so we increased it – simple as that. Paul – the discount is still in place – PW members can join at the reduced rate for the first year exactly as before – we have no plans to change that. :look: Monkeyboots – I’m concerned about your friend where is seems we didn’t help him – can you PVT me with some more details and I’ll look into it? I certainly doesn’t sound like the sort of thing we would do, unless maybe it was before I became Director, in which case I wouldn’t know anything about it. Onwards and upwards….

SACS is delighted to announce that as of noon today (14 october 2009), our Public Liability Insurance cover has been increased from £5 million to £10 million at no extra cost to our membership. SACS also remains the ONLY countrysports organisation to provide the vital £100,000 legal fees insurance to all of our members.

Course I wasn't asleep, but I knew David would get that one for me :blink:

Scottish Association for Country Sports Photographic Competition 2009 We know that some of our members are excellent photographers – but can they beat all-comers in open competition? We are proud to announce the launch our 2009 photographic competition – open to members and non-members alike. First Prize in the competition is £500, second prize £250, and third prize £100. Winning photographs may be used as front covers in the SACS magazine and elsewhere, and full publicity will be given both in our magazine and anywhere else they are used. The competition will be judged by a completely independent panel appointed by the SACS Management Committee for the purpose, and their decision will be final. Details of the winners will be published in the following issue of the SACS magazine and elsewhere. The rules are simple: Entry to the competition is free – just send your photograph by email or post to us, clearly marked ‘Photographic Competition’, with your name, address and a contact telephone number. All photographs received will be acknowledged by email or post as appropriate. If you send an actual photograph and would like to have it returned, please enclose a suitable stamped addressed envelope. To qualify for entry, the subject of the photograph must have an obvious connection with a country sport which was legal at the time the photograph was taken. Photographs entered must not have previously been published, and by entering a photograph in the competition, you agree to allow SACS to use the photograph, at our discretion, at any time in the future. Send your entries by post to: SACS Netherholm Netherburn LARKHALL ML9 3DG or email them to sacs@netherholm.sol.co.uk The closing date for entry is 31 December 2009, and any photographs received after this date will not be entered.

Not nitpicking at all, Mr Partridge - easy stuff Our premium is notified each year on renewal by NFU - I just pay it. Our claims record must be pretty good, because the premium is good value for money - in my seriously unqualified opinion, of course The policy covers all existing members AND any all members for the following year, so there is no limit on numbers covered. Of course we have a policy document, and several amendments where we have added even more cover over the years when we found something we had missed when we specified the cover originally. It is deathly boring stuff, as you would expect, and I don't see any need to take up space on our website with it when no one is really interested, and I certainly don't see the point in sending our members huge piles of paperwork (at their expense) when no one has shown any interest in it. If it was required by law, I would of course do it, but until then, it is available for those who actually need it as and when they do. As far as I can see, at the moment the only people who would like to read it are those who would have an unhealthy interest in trying to pick holes in it, but then I'm just an old cynic I'm genuinely sorry to hear about the claim you lost - I always advise our members to let me know immediately if there is a potential problem, so I can try to make sure this sort of thing doesn't happen to them. Finally, David - this is a REALLY bad time to be saying you might not be director material - rumours about Der Bascfuhrer retiring abound, and I wish you well if you have an interest in the post:good:

Sorry to spoil a decent BASC propaganda thread guys, but our insurance DOES cover beating and picking up (for hire or reward), and it would also have covered Partridge if his dog had caused a problem. I am not aware of anything a country sportsman could reasonably do (except competitive horse-riding and competitive husky racing) which would not be covered by our policy - if I found something, I would have it added to the policy immediately if possible - and of course our policy covers ALL country sports, not only shooting. I'm not an insurance salesman, and neither is SACS as an organisation - we are a POLICYHOLDER on behalf of our members, and the insurance, although important to our members, is only one of the many services we supply to our members. I try to explain things clearly, in plain english - if anyone needs clarification of anything I say, I am always happy to do that - it just means that my english wasn't plain enough, not that there is anything being concealed or twisted. On the subject of claims, in my experience members have needed our legal fees insurance to fight certificate revocations and other such difficulties FAR more than the Public Liability insurance - the ratio is more than ten to one at present. Happy to post again anytime, gentlemen

He would be using the 'occupier's' gun - which at all times is within sight and sound of the 'occupier' - who would of course bring it along for him. remember the 'occupier' can be the landowner, a tenant of the land such as a farmer who rents the farm from an estate, or the occupier of the shooting Rights - in fact any person authorised to shoot on the land is the 'occupier' for the purpose of this section of the law.

Butting in again! The LAW is clear - 'a person, not having a certificate, may borrow a gun from the occupier of land and use it under their supervision'. 'Occupier' has been extended over the years by Court definitions so that it now includes a person who has the shooting rights - or permission to shoot over the land, so any person with a certificate and permission to take someone else on to the land to shoot can allow a friend to borrow their gun and shoot with it under their supervision. 'Under their supervision' has also been clarified by court decisions, and the most up to date definition I can find is 'within sight and sound, and with a degree of control if needed.' The fact that some Police forces may try to have their own local version of this is irrelevant - the courts will follow the LAW, not the local police policy. Once again, that is why all of our members have the legal fees insurance!

Sorry to butt in, but I think this is important. When you already have a FAC, you have cleared all of the hurdles except one. The only remaining issue is that for each firearm you wish to acquire, you need to supply a 'good reason' for having it. 'Good Reason' in law, as opposed to how some Forces would like to have it, is that you want to shoot something with it, you have somewhere you can use it with the permission of the landowner or the occupier of the shooting rights (which does NOT have to be in writing), and perhaps that there is a reasonable liklihood of the quarry you wish to shoot being present on the land at some point in the year. That is IT - nothing more. It is NOT a matter for the police to decide if what you want is the best gun for the job, or approve the ground, or have a DMQ qualification - that is NOT in the law and the courts will order the police to issue the certificate if the police refuse to do so. That is why SACS provides the legal fees insurance for our members - so that they do not need to find the thousands of pounds they would need to fight an appeal against a dodgy decision by a Chief Constable. If anyone needs more detailed advice on this, feel free to email me on sacs@netherholm.sol.co.uk.