sethb Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Exactly what told you the barrel was shot out? would it not shoot a group at 100 yards? and if so was it just that the group opened up or was it key holeing etc? Regards, Gixer Rifle use to bug hole groups,then started to open up,more so at 200 to 300 yards,bore scope down the barrel and vast amount of fire cracking around the throat,so had a border barrel fitted,due to have a new barrel fitted again in 243 ackley version,4100 fps with the 55 grain heads. :o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 (edited) How many among us have actually experienced a shot out .243 for themselves? Iam on my 3rd barrel fitted only last week but I have had the rifle a good 8/9 years Edited March 13, 2012 by Ackley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 The main reason won't be barrel life. It is a lot more likely to do with the 7mm magnums pushing a much higher BC a fair bit faster. Yes they made an impact though it was a fact that nobody realy follwed it BEFORE the 7mm Magnums came about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Rifle use to bug hole groups,then started to open up,more so at 200 to 300 yards,bore scope down the barrel and vast amount of fire cracking around the throat,so had a border barrel fitted,due to have a new barrel fitted again in 243 ackley version,4100 fps with the 55 grain heads. :o Dont be too suprised std .243" can get there or thereabouts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Dont be too suprised std .243" can get there or thereabouts but with greater throat wear and the case stretching more,never seen a std 243 match an AI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Logic Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Yes they made an impact though it was a fact that nobody realy follwed it BEFORE the 7mm Magnums came about Back when it was 6.5mm...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveK Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Iam on my 3rd barrel fitted only last week but I have had the rifle a good 8/9 years Yeah but you're DERBYSHIRE DESTROYER. The guy who makes the rifle work to it's maximum potential (and quite right too) . For us mere mortals I think a barrel would last a lot longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Yeah but you're DERBYSHIRE DESTROYER. The guy who makes the rifle work to it's maximum potential (and quite right too) . For us mere mortals I think a barrel would last a lot longer. no point driving a sports car like a 3 wheel van Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham M Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Iam on my 3rd barrel fitted only last week but I have had the rifle a good 8/9 years Blimey Dad, you must be shootin' a lot of deer. G.M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Blimey Dad, you must be shootin' a lot of deer. G.M. a lot of everything Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 but with greater throat wear and the case stretching more,never seen a std 243 match an AI Well "you wanna get out more" . The .243" is already carrying to big a case capacity for most common barrel lengths, this capacity alied to the relitively small bore is why barrel life is so short. i cannot see how you figure less throat wear at all as for case stretching yes the ack has improvements BUT you need to fire form the thing 1st, this uses up shot count and wastes time- for what? to get less case stetching????? The std .243 win is one of the best feeding rounds there is and has been highly favoured in tactical/sniper matches. Today it is being over taken by the .260 (a case with similar qualities). If you like you .243 AI then go at it but it aint gonna get to be my own choice unless i had a blooming long barrel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) Well "you wanna get out more" . The .243" is already carrying to big a case capacity for most common barrel lengths, this capacity alied to the relitively small bore is why barrel life is so short. i cannot see how you figure less throat wear at all as for case stretching yes the ack has improvements BUT you need to fire form the thing 1st, this uses up shot count and wastes time- for what? to get less case stetching????? The std .243 win is one of the best feeding rounds there is and has been highly favoured in tactical/sniper matches. Today it is being over taken by the .260 (a case with similar qualities). If you like you .243 AI then go at it but it aint gonna get to be my own choice unless i had a blooming long barrel I "get out a lot" with many different calibers I reload for 3 std 243s so I would like to think I know a little about them anyway read this you may find it interesting The .243 Winchester parent case has always stretched brass, almost as bad as the Swift. Even though you get more velocity with the improved .243, I've also found that the improved version gives a bit more throat life than the parent case does. The .243 AI delivers more velocity by virtue of enhanced case capacity--roughly five grains more H20 capacity than a standard .243 Winchester. The .243 AI has a water capacity of approximately 57 to 58 grains, compared to 52-53 grains for the standard .243 Winchester. and as to "you have to fireform" dont we all fireform all calibers ?? its no different with an AI you just shoot it in std 243 form to start with Edited March 14, 2012 by Ackley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 I "get out a lot" with many different calibers I reload for 3 std 243s so I would like to think I know a little about them anyway read this you may find it interesting. The quote comes from the Marx brothers, i think it sailed over your head. In context try and not be so self important The .243 Winchester parent case has always stretched brass, almost as bad as the Swift. Even though you get more velocity with the improved .243, I've also found that the improved version gives a bit more throat life than the parent case does. There is nil reason for this in deed the reverse due to the extra capacity The .243 AI delivers more velocity by virtue of enhanced case capacity--roughly five grains more H20 capacity than a standard .243 Winchester. The .243 AI has a water capacity of approximately 57 to 58 grains, compared to 52-53 grains for the standard .243 Winchester. It has to burn all that powder effeciently though- in most hunting length barrels it cant indeed the .243 can struggle in some and as to "you have to fireform" dont we all fireform all calibers ?? its no different with an AI you just shoot it in std 243 form to start with No we dont and contrary to the obsession with neck sizing only in the past the BR guys are prooving it was all a myth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) you obviously know a lot more than the experst that actually use and test these calibers.have you ever owned a 243 AI everyone fireforms no matter if you neck size,full size or bump the shoulders,si as I said it makes no diference what caliber one uses the resulst are still the same "fireforming from new brass" as to barrel length and powder burning,surley you know one can use different speed powders to compensate for barrel length example I can pick up a brand new box of 243 brass load a std powder charge and go out and shoot 100 cases off at vermin,deer or paper,thge rifle will shoot shoot perfectly exactly the same as you would do with a std only diference is the AI chambering will be a lot more accurate due to the match tube fitted against a std factory rifle (unless you have had a std 243 built that is) anyway matters not the AI is better than the std version,theres enough evidence out there form people a lot more clued up than you or I. the std 243 is a great caliber by the way, Edited March 14, 2012 by Ackley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 you obviously know a lot more than the experst that actually use and test these calibers.have you ever owned a 243 AI everyone fireforms no matter if you neck size,full size or bump the shoulders,si as I said it makes no diference what caliber one uses the resulst are still the same "fireforming from new brass" as to barrel length and powder burning,surley you know one can use different speed powders to compensate for barrel length example I can pick up a brand new box of 243 brass load a std powder charge and go out and shoot 100 cases off at vermin,deer or paper,thge rifle will shoot shoot perfectly exactly the same as you would do with a std only diference is the AI chambering will be a lot more accurate due to the match tube fitted against a std factory rifle (unless you have had a std 243 built that is) anyway matters not the AI is better than the std version,theres enough evidence out there form people a lot more clued up than you or I. the std 243 is a great caliber by the way, By your definition of Fireforming then yes its un avoidable. However as full length sizing returns the brass to size and shape of std. Whats your point??? Fireforming an AI involves blowing the shoulder out to increase the capacity, thats quite a difference. Yes of course you can use different powders to compensate for length some, yet only to a point The .243 is a barrel burner because it burns too much powder for the bore and zips them out pretty fast. I wouldnt personally own one in a Hunting rifle why should i burning more powder at higher velocity can only shorten the life of a tube and faster powder aint gonna improve things non in that regards. Pesonally and it is personal, i dont think the .243 needs more speed or more powder and i aint going to pursue it just to be different Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) By your definition of Fireforming then yes its un avoidable. However as full length sizing returns the brass to size and shape of std. Whats your point??? Fireforming an AI involves blowing the shoulder out to increase the capacity, thats quite a difference. Yes of course you can use different powders to compensate for length some, yet only to a point The .243 is a barrel burner because it burns too much powder for the bore and zips them out pretty fast. I wouldnt personally own one in a Hunting rifle why should i burning more powder at higher velocity can only shorten the life of a tube and faster powder aint gonna improve things non in that regards. Pesonally and it is personal, i dont think the .243 needs more speed or more powder and i aint going to pursue it just to be different as I said we ALL fireform with new brass,when you correctly full length size you are only knocking back the shoulders a couple of thou max so ALL the brass will be to a consistant size,but Iam sure you already know that. there are all manner of modern powders and primers which enables us all to tune a load to out equipment,so no your wrong it "isnt up to a point" you didnt amswer my question . ,have you owned and reloaded a 243 AI or a 243 come to that Edited March 14, 2012 by Ackley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 as I said we ALL fireform with new brass,when you correctly full length size you are only knocking back the shoulders a couple of thou max so ALL the brass will be to a consistant size,but Iam sure you already know that. there are all manner of modern powders and primers which enables us all to tune a load to out equipment,so no your wrong it "isnt up to a point" you didnt amswer my question . ,have you owned and reloaded a 243 AI or a 243 come to that Are you trying to get this thread closed aswell? Again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) Are you trying to get this thread closed aswell? Again! obviously you cant answer the question,why would it be closed cant you answer in an adult manner ?? I dont know how some of you get on in life,do you do the same when having a conversation face to face "close it down" if you have never used fireformed and reloaded an AI you cant really say what is better now can you. I enjoy and respect your veiws but your so wrong on this one Edited March 14, 2012 by Ackley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) Erm....wasn't this thread about 223 vs 243.... Maybe need to start a seperate one entitled "egomaniacs ball" Edited March 14, 2012 by gixer1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 Erm....wasn't this thread about 223 vs 243.... Maybe need to start a seperate on entitled "egomaniacs ball" you should be in the CID quite right Sherlock it was and still is,apart from when someone decided to change it slightly and needed to be given the correct information Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 you should be in the CID quite right Sherlock it was and still is,apart from when someone decided to change it slightly and needed to be given the correct information correct info or an opinion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 correct info or an opinion? well you will have to do your own homework and then decide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 well you will have to do your own homework and then decide. Nah, I'll just base it on what I know and you do the same mate.... as for the OP, it seems the general opinion is the 243 over the 223 as a general do it all gun... Regards, Gixer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) Nah, I'll just base it on what I know and you do the same mate.... as for the OP, it seems the general opinion is the 243 over the 223 as a general do it all gun... Regards, Gixer the 223 AI is also a lovely caliber by the way I always "base" on what I know Edited March 14, 2012 by Ackley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveK Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 No reply yet as to what the OP will be shooting. if the application doesn't include the word deer, then many FLD's will laugh at .243. So what .223 should maybe be the next question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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