aris Posted December 20, 2013 Report Share Posted December 20, 2013 Petrol is as dangerous maybe they should restrict that too? True, but anything related to firearms is much more at risk of severe knee jerk reaction legislation. It has happened before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted December 20, 2013 Report Share Posted December 20, 2013 (edited) Didn't realise that. I find that quite odd, and somewhat worrying. Why is it worrying? Ever heard of a terrorist using smokeless powder? Petrol is as dangerous maybe they should restrict that too? LPG gas, Diesel, fireworks, plenty of stuff sold at the local supermarket is just as lethal if not more so! Edited December 20, 2013 by HDAV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poontang Posted December 20, 2013 Report Share Posted December 20, 2013 (edited) 2.50 A shotgun certificate is not required to possess or acquire shotgun cartridges containing five or more shot, none of which exceeds .36 inch in diameter. All ordinary shot cartridges are covered by this description. However, a shotgun certificate (or firearm certificate authorising possession of a section 1 shotgun) is normally required to purchase shotgun cartridges. All single bulleted ammunition, for example solid slug, spherical ball or projectiles for birdscaring equipment, is subject to the requirement for a firearm certificate. Just point them to section 2.50 of the guidance I printed above - where it states the case quite clearly. The problem is it's not very clear at all. What is stated is that it's ok to possess or acquire cartridges. Acquire and purchase are not the same thing. To purchase cartridges it is normally a requirement to hold a shotgun certificate. The word normally would, I should think, put the onus on the seller as to whether he wants to sell cartridges to someone without a certificate. In which case Spandit's post was spot on. Edited December 20, 2013 by poontang Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aris Posted December 20, 2013 Report Share Posted December 20, 2013 I think the 'normally' is because of the exceptions - namely when you are are a club with an 11(6) exemption. But you are right - the law isn't clear - if it were, you would not need 'guidance'. Why is it worrying? Ever heard of a terrorist using smokeless powder? Not yet - but don't give anyone any ideas. LPG gas, Diesel, fireworks, plenty of stuff sold at the local supermarket is just as lethal if not more so! Correct, and it would be much easier and politically acceptable to the populace to ban or highly restrict shotgun cartridges and/or powder than heating fuel - even if it is just so politicians can be seen to be doing something'. As I said, it has happened before - and it only takes one idiot to kick off a knee jerk reaction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted December 20, 2013 Report Share Posted December 20, 2013 I think the 'normally' is because of the exceptions - namely when you are are a club with an 11(6) exemption. But you are right - the law isn't clear - if it were, you would not need 'guidance'. No your wrong its "normally" as its RFD practice too.... and probably laid on thick by the issuing force. Fact is you don't have to be an RFD to sell carts.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aris Posted December 20, 2013 Report Share Posted December 20, 2013 No your wrong its "normally" as its RFD practice too.... and probably laid on thick by the issuing force. Fact is you don't have to be an RFD to sell carts.......... With all due respect, that's not the way I read it - but granted there is room for interpretation. I don't doubt that you don't need to be an RFD to sell, but to purchase it seems pretty clear in the guidance that you need an SGC. It's not something i'd like to personally test in court Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 AFAIK cart manufacturers don't need to be RFD or SGC holders governed by separate legislation. Shotgun carts are not really mentioned in firearms act except for minimum shot count and sizes to be " shotgun carts" certainly aren't controlled like section 1 ammo... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Bull Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 So do your have to be 18 to be in possesion of shotgun carts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 (edited) So do your have to be 18 to be in possesion of shotgun cartsYou do to buy even if you have an SGC, not sure how it works with 16 year old with SGC goes to shop with an 18 year old that doesn't Under 15 need to have an 21 year old present to shoot iirc I can't think of a law that stops a 14 year old walking downs road with a cartridge, certainly not illegal on private premises. EDIT: perhaps there is a limit on under 15 possessing cartridges unsupervised. Edited December 21, 2013 by HDAV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Bull Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 Ok cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 From BASC guidance UNDER 15 YEARS OF AGE In this age group if you hold a certificate you are only allowed to borrow a shotgun. There are two ways to do so; firstly for 72 hours according to certificate instructions (i.e. without completing any written transfer or notification to police), and secondly by written transfer by the lender onto table 2 of the recipients certificate and a notification to police by both parties (as per certificate instructions) . You may not purchase, hire or be gifted a shotgun or ammunition. Additionally; in all circumstances you may only possess an assembled shotgun when supervised by an adult aged 21 or over, or if the gun is in a securely fastened gun cover so that it cannot be fired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike737 Posted December 21, 2013 Report Share Posted December 21, 2013 May be but aren't all of the components available to load a cartridge without a cert? Powder, primer, wad, case, shot? Is powder sold without a cert? Back when I used to shoot target handguns, I loaded all my own .38 and .357. You could buy all the components, powder, primers, bullets, cases, presses, powder measures/scales, etc. without ever producing your licence! In the many years, and thousands of rounds I fired, not once did any full-bore ammunition appear on my licence. Only .22LR for the Ruger that my wife used to shoot. Happy days... Mike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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