Does a gun have to be re-proofed

[tulkyuk]

Does a gun have to be re-proofed after a screwcut ( FAC )

or is this just a thing thats been put about by the proof houses to make more money ( so i have been told but may be wrong )

[2shots]

once you screw cut it without a proof certificate you cant sell it

on until you proof it again.

[Dunkield]

Blatent rip from Jackson Rifles site:

 

Proof testing of rifles and/or suppressors in the United Kingdom - legal and technical considerations

 

A. Summary and recommendations

 

B. Background

 

A. Summary and recommendations:

 

In the absence of any court decision to the contrary, we are advised that a suppressor or sound moderator, which is a freely removable accessory, designed to be interchangeable between weapons of different types and calibres, ought not to be considered to be a "part of a Small Arm". Such an accessory is not liable to fall within the definition of a "Barrel" in the Gun Barrel Proof Act 1868. We note, however, that the English proof houses have expressed a different opinion which is consistent with their own interests as private companies.

Whether or not a suppressor is really a "Barrel" for the purposes of the Proof Acts, there can be no legal requirement to submit any "Barrel" for proof unless and until it is fitted to a Small Arm which is to be sold, exchanged or exported, etc. There is no offence in the Acts of selling an unproved "Barrel" on its own.

Similarly, there can be no UK legal requirement to submit muzzle-threaded rifles for re-proof unless/until the entire rifle is to be sold, exchanged or exported.

In view of the wide range of firearm types and calibres (even air guns) to which reflex suppressors can be fitted, submitting bare suppressors for proof before sale would not be practical.

Reflex suppressors are produced in a CIP country by Europe's largest manufacturer of high-power rifle suppressors.

Noting that non-CIP countries like Switzerland and the USA manage very well without compulsory proof, we conclude that CIP proof is no substitute for modern workshop quality assurance procedures.

Although a number of suppressors have been proof-marked by the London Proof House for calibres larger than the baffle hole diameter, we warrant that firing an appropriate CIP proof cartridge through a correctly-fitted reflex suppressor will not harm it in any way.

In principle, we neither recommend nor advise against the proof testing of rifles after they have been fitted with reflex suppressors.

In the past, some perfectly good rifles have destroyed due to incorrect proof loads or other errors. Other rifles have suffered the sort of minor or latent damage which is to be expected when a vital component (the cartridge case) is subjected to an unknown pressure at or above its yield stress. Subject to our warranty given in point 7. above, any proof or re-proof is carried out at the owner's risk, particularly with regard to any possible loss or damage to the rifle.

B. Background:

 

On 31 August 2000, the London and Birmingham Proof Houses issued a circular entitled "Screw cutting of rifle muzzles and the fitting of sound moderators and other items". A further circular entitled "Conversion of Barrels and the Fitting of Muzzle Accessories" was issued by the Proof Houses in October 2001.

 

The contents and inferences of these circulars have been hotly disputed by the gun trade, and we consider that they are misleading to the extent that they convey the impressions:

 

(1) that there may be a legal requirement to submit all sound moderators for proof and,

 

(2) that there may be a legal requirement to submit all rifles for proof or re-proof after the cutting of an external screw thread at the muzzle.

 

Section 122.(3) of the Gun Barrel Proof Act 1868 ("the 1868 Act") creates an offence of selling or exchanging, or attempting to sell or exchange, a Small Arm the Barrel or Barrels of which are not duly proved or marked as proved.

 

However, the terms "Small Arm" and "Barrel" are separately and distinctly defined in the Act and from these definitions it is clear that there is no offence of selling, etc. an unproved "Barrel" on its own. Therefore, even if sound moderators were deemed to be "Barrels" as defined by the 1868 Act (a suggestion which is hotly disputed), there is no legal requirement to have them proved unless they are sold as part of a "Small Arm".

 

Similarly, with regard to the cutting of a screw thread on a rifle muzzle (or for that matter any other repair, replacement or modification of a Barrel), there can be no offence committed unless or until the entire Small Arm is subsequently offered for sale, exchange, export etc. Even if/when this were to happen, the requirement to submit a barrel for re-proof only arises if the barrel has been "unduly reduced in Substance or Strength".

 

As professional engineers, we reject any suggestion that a threaded rifle muzzle with a factor of safety against failure of more than four (as in the extreme case of a 1/2" UNF thread on a typical 7.62 mm rifle) is "unduly reduced in Substance or Strength", just as similar suggestions were dismissed in written evidence for the case of Regina v Beatham (see R-v-Beatham_evidence.pdf - 986 kB Adobe Acrobat file). We note that on receipt of this evidence, the Crown abandoned its case and the Defendant was duly discharged with his costs awarded from the public purse.

[2shots]

A. Summary and recommendations

 

B. Background

 

 

Similarly, there can be no UK legal requirement to submit muzzle-threaded rifles for re-proof unless/until the entire rifle is to be sold, exchanged or exported.

 

thats right

[tulkyuk]

Thanks boys

 

looks like it need to be refroofed if its sold on then.

[tulkyuk]

What happens if you give it away rather than sell ??

[Dunkield]

IIRC the trick is to have the thread removed and the barrel re-crowned and then you are OK

mry was your man on this question, pity he won't be about to answer this . .

[2shots]

What happens if you give it away rather than sell ??

 

The law covers sold exchanged or exported and I had to smash an

old anschutz up while the FO watched me do it after giving it

to a mate that pxd it to the dealer that screw cut it for me,

he found out from his records eight weeks later,and cost me £80

that he gave my mate for it px.

[bob300w]

What happens if you give it away rather than sell ??

If only life was so simple....the wording of the Proof Act is; No small arm may be sold, exchanged or exported, exposed or kept for sale or exchanged or pawned unless and until it has been fully proved and duly marked. Also there is no provision in proof Regulations to permit the sale of unproved arms as ornaments.

The only exception to the rules are with antiques or collectors items, not for use or which cannot be proved, as where no ammunition is available. In this case a certificate must be obtained from the Proof house to this effect.

That pretty well covers all bases, and it should be noted that what the Proof Houses refer to as rules are in fact law.

[bob300w]

What happens if you give it away rather than sell ??

 

The law covers sold exchanged or exported and I had to smash an

old anschutz up while the FO watched me do it after giving it

to a mate that pxd it to the dealer that screw cut it for me,

he found out from his records eight weeks later,and cost me £80

that he gave my mate for it px.

It would have been cheaper to have it proofed, it's only 30 quid or so!

[2shots]

What happens if you give it away rather than sell ??

 

The law covers sold exchanged or exported and I had to smash an

old anschutz up while the FO watched me do it after giving it

to a mate that pxd it to the dealer that screw cut it for me,

he found out from his records eight weeks later,and cost me £80

that he gave my mate for it px.

It would have been cheaper to have it proofed, it's only 30 quid or so!

 

I offered to pay the bloke Bob but the fo said Id allready done the nasty bit

by giving it away so he made me pay the dealer who called him,then smash

the gun to bits to get out of it.Pretty lucky I suppose as he said I could have

lost my ticket.

[tulkyuk]

Thanks