Legal Advice from BASC

[Maiden22]

I don't wish to tread on anyone's toes, and I can't comment on BASC's service (never having had to call on them) or on their behaviour leading up to the ban, but haven't some of the comments directed at David been a little forceful? I can't see much to object to in the tone of his posts. They seem very mild-mannered if anything.

 

Also, to be fair much of the time he seems to be speaking as a representative of BASC and not in a personal capacity and as such he must be a little more limited in what he can say than most of us are. Personally, I think it's a good thing to have someone from BASC as an active member, and I've found a lot of his posts useful and informative.

 

As I say, I don't intend to offend anyone, and I appreciate that some of the issues are ones on which people have strong feelings.

 

Robert

[Mungler]

It surprises me not that the BASC don't have an in house solicitor - do you know how much one would cost? Oh and what would they do whilst waiting for one of us to phone up and ask if it ok to shoot within 49 feet of a foot path.

 

I know f-all about shooting law. If I had a problem I would actually air it on here and get a diversity of views, opinions and even legislative extracts and at the end there is normally a rational conclusion and a solid chunk of information. That is what I imagine happens at the BASC offices - experience, research, discussion and then issuing guidance and advice.

 

As for "in court" legal representation, out of the 200 active files I have I would say maybe 2 make it to a full blown civil trial each year.

 

I am sure that the BASC have a list of external specialist solicitors and barristers who they can engage for specific jobs and advice.

 

I have come to realise that the BASC can never win outright on these issues. If they were to employ an in house Counsel at market rate, I can just imagine the pis5ing and moaning and the next poll:

 

Do BASC really need to spend £100k a year on in house Counsel? Is that what we pay our subs for?

[Pinkfooty]

The handgun ban debate is somewhat off the topic but maybe I should make some comment. What David says is correct - BASC did make strenuous representations to try to avoid the worst effects of the proposed ban, first of all on all large calibre handguns and then, after a change of government, on the addition of .22 pistols to the ban.

 

Bob is also correct in his recollection that many handgun shooters felt that BASC had let them down - a view promulgated, totally without foundation, by a tiny organisation called the "Sportman's Association" (or something like that) that was trying to make political capital at the time.

 

Basically the problem is this - if government proposes legislation that adversely affects shooting and BASC opposes it, then the perceived efficiency of BASC is based on the degree to which it is successful in resisting the proposals. If BASC fails, then members are disgruntled. What we regrettably have to face up to is that there are some cases where BASC simply has no chance whatsoever of succeeding. The handgun ban was one such case. In the aftermath of the Dunblane massacre there was no way that the goverment would be persuaded not to implement the ban.

 

Another similar case was the ban on lead shot over wetlands. There never was any scientific evidence to suggest that the normal use of lead shot by wildfowlers shooting over coastal estuaries in any way harmed the conservation status of any species in Britain. But European legislation demanded that the British governments instituted a ban on lead shot and there was no way that BASC could have prevented the ban. In fact BASC did delay it by several years.

 

In both cases BASC was seen to fail and in both cases a section of the membership was unhappy. But the outcomes could never have been different no matter what BASC said or did.

 

However there have been many more examples where BASC has been successful at influencing legislation (and sometimes still not always getting the credit for it!). For example, in both the English and Scottish anti-hunting Bills, while other organisations were standing outside the parliaments waving placards and chanting slogans and achieving absolutely nothing, BASC was inside talking to the ministers who mattered and achieving huge concessions that greatly reduced the adverse affects of the Bills on shooting sports. Had BASC not successfully negotiated those concessions, then the bans on hunting mammals with dogs would have effectively crippled all gundog use by roughshooters, all picking up on game shoots and all use of terriers by gamekeepers. But do BASC get credit for their massive victories on those scores? No - we still get criticised for not waving enough banners or chanting enough slogans!

 

Tail docking of gundogs in England (and hopefully soon in Scotland) is another area where BASC succeeded against all the odds. Other examples, such as the continued use of handguns for deer despatch and very significant improvements in the draft regulations applying to general licenses are just a couple that spring to mind from the recent past.

 

There will be future issues where we succeed and, unfortunately, some issues where we have no chance of success - but make no mistake, BASC will always fight our corner to the best of its ability (and there will always be some members who feel that a 98% member satisfaction rate, as shown by last year's survey, is not good enough!). That's life folks.

 

Eric

[steve_b_wales]

I have been a member of BASC for many years. During this time, I have, on occasion, had to contact them for advice. The advice given was always correct, and helped me in correcting a problem. If ever I need legal representation (God forbid) for something (not illegal) I'm sure that I would get all the help I would need.

My only gripe with BASC is that you can't pay membership my quarterly or half yearly direct debit.

I for one will continue to support them.

[Pinkfooty]

I have been a member of BASC for many years. During this time, I have, on occasion, had to contact them for advice. The advice given was always correct, and helped me in correcting a problem. If ever I need legal representation (God forbid) for something (not illegal) I'm sure that I would get all the help I would need.

My only gripe with BASC is that you can't pay membership my quarterly or half yearly direct debit.

I for one will continue to support them.

 

Steve,

 

Phased Direct Debits should be introduced soon. The problem was in getting authorised for what are known as "paperless" Direct Debits that can be accepted online or by phone. Unfortunately a phased DD system will not be suitable for members of affiliated clubs (who probably need it most) as the clubs collect the subs on behalf of BASC. What I would really like to see is BASC (in common with most comparable organisations) offering a small subscription discount to those members who elected to pay by DD. I would also like to see an end to the nonsensical situation where members who are members of several affiliated clubs, having to pay multiple BASC subs and then claim back the duplicates.

 

In the words of Frasier Crane, "We're listening!"