Evilv
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Posts posted by Evilv
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I expect you'll treasure that knife now. I certainly would.
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The rifle found with the bodies was a .22, the BBC four o' clock news has just announced. Probably not the surest caliber for committing suicide.... I'd hate to wake up slavering, and dressed in a nappy with half my brain missing.
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Thanks for that! I'll try to word it similar to yours!
I cant honestly think of a reason why i shouldnt be granted a certificate,but im cacking myself!
It will be fine i have just had my FEO visit two weeks ago and all was fine my advice wil be , when you send off the application leave it two weeks then chase it. When the feo gets the applicaton tell him that you are due to shoot in a competition, and hopefully he will put it at the top of the pile thats what mine did and i should get mine next week . All done and dusted in 6 weeks
great until the FEO enters into friendly banter, you stumble over your story and he finds out you lied about it.... :yp:
I agree. Telling lies is a mugs game. Apart from the fact that liars are dogs, most people fall over when they try to lie to people who are cleverer than them which for lairs is most people.
The Northumbria Police are really quick at issueing certificates. You couldn't ask for a faster service. maybe if you have some problems in your application, it will take them longer to decide.
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evilv,
yes, it is different for a referee (FAC) and a countersignatory (SGC), though the difference isn't much. The Countersignatory calls for someone of standing. They list doctor, lawyer, or anyone who would be listed in a public record. However, in talking to my FLO when I applied, anyone of good standing would be fine. He said anyone who has completed University (he might have said college since I didn't know the difference at the time), who is a manager, or similar would work.
For the referee, it can be anyone who has known you for 2 years and meets the residency requirements.
Thanks,
Rick
That's very 'classist' isn't it. Half the world goes to university these days so I'm not sure how long that will stand as an indication of good standing and since I regularly see university students staggering about drunk and peeing in doorways in Newcastle where there are 30,000 students, it doesn't look like a good training for being 'of good standing,' anyway.
Well, since my bird is a doctor, I can get any number of her colleagues to sign me off as insane.
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Touché, Evilv, not that those absolutely, indisputably vital 4/100ths of a millimetre were really what I was getting at.
Naa - I know - I should stop wasting time hanging around here and get out with the 172 HMR - LoL.
have a good day Baldrick mate and take no notice of my provocations. It's only a lark after all.
Drat - it's started raining here. I do hate wet scopes, so I'll just take the dog out instead.
:yp:
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Although where did you hear that semi auto centerfires are not allowed ? Yes Im fairly new to shooting but I HAVE tried and made an effort to read up on regulations and such. I dont think I ever encountered this particular regulation so my appologies! :yp:
Before you start jumping to conclusions, why don't you have a read of the Home Office Guidance to the Police, pinned as a sticky on this forum? It'll hopefully enlighten you on a few important issues relating to fireams ownership and use, such as no semi-auto CFs, no rail-launched missiles, flamethrowers being strictly frowned upon etc. It might even help you with your application.
Evilv, having done my time following the flag, I added the 'civilian or military' comment to minimise any potential for ambiguity: I have spoken to several deluded youngsters who think that military service equals ownership of a military weapon, or acts as a quick route for ownership of civilian firearms. Incidentally, you're not just subject to identical regulations as a soldier/sailor/airman, when compared to a civvy - you're subjected to additional regulations. And the SA80 is 5.56mm.
Thanks for the correction Baldrick - 5.56mm indeed. I'll remember that. You are absolutely right and that four-hundredth of a millimetre is important I am sure, and in keeping with your exactitude, I propose that we stop being sloppy and call the 17HMR by its proper name, the .172 Hornady Magnum Rimfire, or better still, since we live in the EU and should be using the metric measurement system, it should be called the 4.36879 Hornady Magnum Rimfire, or for the lazy and slipshod, the 4.37 HMR.
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Just wait for Labour numbskulls to start bleating about private gun ownership and why it should all be banned.
Matches too then eh!?!
Of course you are exactly right. That's the joke about the calls for gun control that will surely follow when he is officially named as the suspect. He could just as easily have used a kitchen knife, a hammer, or a rock to kill his family and then he could have hanged himself. Maybe they should add a ban on rocks, kitchen knives, hammers and all manner of other objects. This will not occur to the New Labour lunatics though. The propagandised fools have their sights on guns, if 'sights' are still allowed that is.
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How the hell have you worked out he did it from that news story
1. He owed money to large businesses, not tow rag money lenders and underworld figures. Banks don't kill people.
2. People he owed money to, would have every reason NOT to destroy every bit of property he had from cars to horses, to a Georgian mansion full of antiques. All that stuff would have been sold and paid at least a proportion of what he owed to debtors. This incident shows a systematic destruction of everything of value that he owned. Cartridges from his rifle, spent and unspent were scattered around the property and surrounding open spaces.
3. The rifle found beside the bodies was his legally owned weapon. which had he been attacked by gangsters would have been an irrelevance as well as locked up.
I think you will find that my conclusion is the one that will be accepted by the authorities. The motive - 'If I can't have it, no one else will.'
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Millionaire business man Christopher Forster - the guy whose family are missing and whose mansion has been destroyed by fire, appears to have shot his wife and himself with a legally held rifle. His wife's body, shot in the head was found beside an as yet unidentified man and Foster's rifle. The daughter has not yet been found.
My bet is that about to lose all he owned because of business debts, he shot his family, destroyed every asset and shot himself so that if he couldn't keep it all, no one else could have it either. He also shot all his animals - horses and dogs.
Maniac!!
Why we will face even more scrutiny over gun ownership.
Just wait for Labour numbskulls to start bleating about private gun ownership and why it should all be banned.
:yp:
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Members of the Armed forces and Police are issued their weapons, they don't own them.
Since out of uniform, a military man is a private citizen like any other, and subject to identical regulations, it would serve no purpose to mention 'military' in the context of a discussion of gun ownership rules unless you were discussing the rules imposed on the armed services as military organisations. Nobody here could possibly have had the idea that an ex-soldier, airman or sailor would have different rules applied to his private possession of firearms. Hence my interpretation of the post.
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Nobody, civilian or military, is permitted to own a semi-auto centrefire rifle in the UK. Semi-auto .22RFs are permitted, nothing else.
Before I applied for my SGC and FAC, I made sure that I knew the law, and knew what I was talking about, so that the FEO and fellow Shots wouldn't think I was lazy, or thick.
Better tell that to the British Forces then. After all they have been equipping their guys with assault rifles - the L1a1 (SLR 7.62) from the late 50s to mid eighties and since then, the 5.62 mm SA80. So do the cops (semi auto carbines at least). I don't see either going back to bolt action somehow.
On the topic - the only advantage I have found to th e HMR is that it costs about three times as much. On the other hand, .22LR has a long and noble pedigree going back to the black powder .22 short of 1857. The versatility of being able to shoot cheap .22LR subsonics at 1080fps that are almost silent, or a 1640 fps stinger from the same gun can be very useful. For small game and vermin you have to be able to work out holdover at different ranges, but for the HMR that isn't an issue at practical ranges which is nice if you're a lazy *** like me.
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I'm not exactly sure of how the medical record vetting procedure goes, someone else might know, but it might be that they talk with your GP. I can't imagine that they just get an abstract of your medical record without explanation and interpretation. Maybe they ask set questions about you. Anyhow, I was thinking it might be possible to talk with your GP and find out his or her opinion of your medical position in relation to the application. If the GP feels there is a risk, then you ought to be guided by that, if they think not, they may be prepared to say so in writing which may help an appeal, or a reconsideration of the matter. This is all groping in the dark, because I don't know how it goes exactly, and of course, I have no insight at all into how your health is.
Good luck anyhow, and at least it seems you can maybe continue at the clay shooting club if you want.
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Make a bipod. Get an A*, then sell it to me for a fiver.
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So the two people who agree, both admit they have little or no experience of moderated centrfire rifles.
strange?
Quite a few people agree on both sides of the argument.
I was quite impressed by the comment that moderated centre fire when heard from the butts on the range sounds pretty much like un-moderated centre fire. I was also impressed by the point that one shooter said it allowed him to shoot in the early hours without causing too much grief in the neighbourhood. Any edge taken off the sound would be a great asset in that circumstance I can see. Target marking on a full bore range is noisy work even when you can't hear the muzzle report at all. I've done it plenty and the crack of the bullets is loud. Certainly any quarry species in the vicinity of a shot will hear that and be spooked if it wasn't shot itself.
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Barcelona is a six hour bus ride from Pamplona. I went there at the end of April because I am walking right across Spain. So far I have walked from France to Burgos.
The fare from Barcelona Sants station on the bus to Pamplona was E35, which was ok because it's about 300 miles. The buses are very good standard and painless.
On Oct 6th I'm flying back to Barcelona and getting bus back to Burgos. This time I'll walk maybe to Leon or a bit further.
Easyjet fly to Barcelona from Newcastle which is not all that far from Stockport. My return fare in October is costing me the princely sum of £40 with Easyjet. Book well ahead and get massive discounts.
Pamplona is an interesting place. The San Fermine festival is absolutely insane. That whole area of Northern Spain goes in for bulls running in the streets. the first time I saw it, I was walking along in Puente la Reina carrying a big back pack and wondering what all these half crazy people were doing milling around in white clothes and red bandanas. 'It must be some kind of a festival,' says I. Then a loud fireowrk went off and the mood of the crow got sort of frenzied and my son grabs me and points out there is a bull running down the road behind us. We got moving pretty quick I can tell you. The bags did not help much.
If you want to stay in Pamplona during the July festival it will cost a bit and you will want to book up now. Accomodation is pretty scarce then because it is very popular. There is a lot of bull running on a smaller scale all around the villages near Pamplona. I have seen it in Puenta la Reina and in Estella on different weekends in summer late july and early August. I also saw 'bull games' in St Jean Pied de Port just over the Pyrennese in France. It's a Basque thing in general and the Basques are over the border in France as well. Crazy people. At Estella and Puenta la Reina, they had a small temporary bull ring and all the local chavs were jumping in and being chased about by the bulls. Some of them got what they deserved - pretty funny. Some hal;f drunk people misjudged their speed and the bulls with predictable results.
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I apologise if my views have caused anybody any upset . Harnser .
You only said what you thought. I wouldn't apologise for that. You are always polite and constructive. People have different views and they are entiltled to them. You don't rate moderated centre fire and some people do. That's fine both ways. In the end, 98% of what is on this forum is just people's opinions. A guy with fifty years of varied experience has opinions that are worth hearing about, I'd say.
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Is the law different on this for shotgun and firearms certificates? It used to be doctor lawyer and that stuff for all at one time, but when I did my firearms cert application a while back it was anybody of a respectable sort. I just got one of my farmer chaps to do it, but his wife took over and said he was a tow rag and she was of better character than him. Anyway it passed muster.
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Thanks for the replies guys, I think.
The reason i ask is, I have a PC running in my loft 24/7 which my ISP uses (a private broadband supplier), in return I get unlimited internet access on two computors and an offer of reimbursement on my electric bill which i've never claimed, instead whenever i have a putor problem it is fixed buckshee.
Last year i had one rebuilt an upgraded which would've cost around £170 in parts alone and now I have a graphics card gone down on the other one.
The reason for the original question is to find out if I should offer to pay for the card or take it in lieu of the electric, bearing in mind what i've already had out of him.
LB, you are in for a hiding at the MM if it occurs this year.
Chard, just remember the Alamo
TP
Some of those power supplies use several hundred watts. That adds up these days to a lot of ammo money.
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Personally I'd be VERY careful about making an admission that you have shot someone elses rifle. I looked this up myself because I have grown up sons in their twenties who come with me the odd time. It looked to me that the landowner or occupier can allow someone unlicensed to shoot IN THEIR DIRECT SUPERVISION, but not anyone else. Now the term OCCUPIER might include someone who has shooting rights, but it might not so BEWARE you may be confessing to a criminal offence.
If I were you, I would say that you have for a good while been accompanying a man who is a shooter and have watched and discussed his shooting with the rifle. This would be a good experience to have anyway since a sensible experienced shooter can pass on a lot of good experience without you ever shooting the rifle.
I'm sure that a lot of FLOs being practical men may well tut and turn a blind eye to the fact that Joe Bloggs had fired off two shots at a rabbit under direct supervision, but they might not. If it is an offense, you could be charged on your own admissions.
To my lads annoyance, I made them shoot with the air rifle since it looked like it was probably illegal to shoot the rimfire rifles. They asked but I wouldn't let them shoot the others. I think that one of them may well get himself licensed and use my rifles. It doesn't cost a lot and he can meet all the requirements. He will say that he has accompanied me many times and that we spend a lot of time pointing out the safe and unsafe shots and discussing what makes the difference. Even if he had shot the thing, I would warn him not to say that he had. There is not the slightest need to have fired a rifle anyway - what counts is that you have had an experienced older hand showing you what is safe and what is not, and that you thoroughly understand it.
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Is it the same as going for a shot gun license?
Or was that a dumb thing to ask?
Feel free to take the p**s as you will anyway
All firearms are dangerous so they take a careful look at who is asking for them. They need to know that you are responsible and not a criminal or a person with 'issues' that might make it a risk to the public. The same security requirements apply as to shotguns. After that, they need to know that you have a good reason for a rifle and that the land you intend to shoot on is suitable and that the farmers are ok with you using a rifle. They grant you permission for each rifle, like one .22 rifle, whereas with a shotgun you can get more than one without a number of them being specified as happens on a firearm certificate.
That's my take on it anyway. Whether they grant it might depend on how old you are and whether you have experience. Rifles obviously are dangerous at much longer ranges than shotguns, so they need to be sure you are fully aware of that. My first firearms were in the context that I had had a shotgun used on farms for years and that I was a member of a shooting club. Back in the end of the 1970s I had black powder and full bore rifles used at the club under supervison and .22LR and .22MAg at the farms I shot on. Then I gave them up for a good while and started again in 2006 with .22 rimfire, and now HMR. I never had any problems, but I never asked for anything daft. Back in the seventies and eighties it seemed like you oculd get anything you wanted. Loads of guys had a cupboard full of assault rifles and pistols. I always had black powder rifles, pistols and bolt action rifles like my old .303, so there was no reason for them to think I was taking the mick. I knew people who had small canons which I thought was just stupid stuff and some of those guys wanted to have a lot of high power military semi autos which by and large were granted to them.
It's all about character, good reason, and reliability of the person.
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What i mean is,
what the lbs limit on a fac air gun or does it go on the gun you have.
Or do they give you a limit ie 20 lbs?
I don't think they specify a limit on air rifles. They just put air rifle on the cert and that allows you to go above the 12 ft pound limit.
I have FAC AIR on my certificate as well as .22 rifle and .17 HMR. It used to say '.22 Air rifle', on my certificate before I got my HMR variation. I just went up and looked at my new certificate and for some reason it says '.22 UNKNOWN' in the Type section, and 'NONE' where the number would be. I think I'll ring them up and ask about that. I have an old Webley Axsor which is in standard trim and I had thought I'd send it back to webley and get it worked on for work around buildings and maybe the odd squirrel on a tree truck that I wouldn't want to fire at with a 100 ft pound Eley in case I missed and sent a rifle bullet hurtling off for a mile or two. That's why I had air rifle on the certificate, but I never did anything about it. However, it seems a bit wierd what they have written on there just now since I got it back after the HMR variation. I'm glad I went up and looked carefully at it.
To be honest, since I got the rim fires, I've never felt the need to get the axsor worked up above where it is. I've shot a few rabbits in the farmers garden with it and that's all and it was well powerful enough for that. If the rimfire rifles are too much for a particular shot, I basically don't take it except for the garden job I mentioned.
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If you have suitable land and permission to shoot it with a rifle, and if you are a respectable chap without wierd mental issues, a bad record of crime, or drug and alcohol problems, and if you can satisfy the security requirements and have a referee who can vouch for your good sense with firearms and character, they virtually HAVE to grant you a firearms certificate for suitable firearms. You can get a .22 rimfire or HMR for sure if you satisfy the above and are of age and have some shooting experience which assures them you are safe.
People sometimes get the impression from somewhere that it is all dependent on the whim of the local firearms department - it isn't. The way the law is written a person has to be granted a certificate for a firearm if they can show a good reason and meet the other requirements. Having said that, my local police force operate a very sensible and efficient regime. In my experience, they are beyond reproach in seeing the sensible shooter is OK and has a good service. If you have a decent sort of land to shoot on, do yourself a favour and buy a rim fire rifle like a CZ instead of an air gun. You will save money, have a far more effective piece of kit and it is no harder to get certificated for than FAC Air. If it's a tiny patch right next to a village, you'll not get permission for a rimfire though.
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That is unless you work for the forestry commission who I believe insist on staff using moderators to comply with Health & Safety and do not wish to be sued for hearing injuries which their staff will suffer if they don't use one.
Ear muffs are cheap and light weight and they really work. I can still hear a bat and I shot tonnes of full bore rifle back in the eighties alongside people who were blazing away with assault rifles of every kind. There was so much hot lead and brass flying at those sessions that I got a bad burn from a hot case that was spat down my shirt neck by the next door shooter's mini 14. Really stung that did.
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I doubt a centre fire is made much quieter with a mod really, though I never tried one. I'm sure an expensive meter would show some difference, but I doubt the old lug holes would notice it much. I don't even have a mod on the HMR. Just listening to the difference in a silenced .22 between Elye subs (silent) and stingers (loud as owt) you know there's no point. The sonic crack is outlandish.
As for hunting African big game with a scope on - I'd hate to be trying to knock over a charging, close quarters buffalo or lion and groping around in the scope looking for it. Give me a nice military peep sight for that any day. Sometimes, I can hardly find a rabbit in my x14 scope that is obvious with the naked eye. If it was shooting back or charging, I'd be dead meat.
Another nail in the shooter's coffin - Foster shot his wife.
in Off Topic
Posted · Edited by Evilv
Well we'll have to see won't we.
I'm pretty sure he did it. Those supposed gang members wouldn't have any reason to destroy everything - kill him and even his wife, yes, but not the torching of every asset in the place. That was him, I'd put money on it.
As for the horse box at the gates. He had set fire to a lot of stuff, cars, stable block and had to go back to where his dead wife was and shoot himself after lighting up the house. He wouldn't want the fire brigade and police interrupting him mid torching and committing suicide - hence the horse box at the gate.
Let's have a vote -
A.) It was done by gang figures he owed money.
B.) He did it himself with his own .22 rifle.