Evilv
-
Posts
817 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Calendar
PW Shop
Posts posted by Evilv
-
-
Finally got the variation through I see, good looking guns
is it just .17hmr they make those leaver actions in? Thought I saw Winchester or someone makin a leaver action . 410. At one point?
looks fun to shoot!Yeah.
They make these guns in .22lr, .22 WMR and in 17HMR. They also make a lot of larger caliber guns in the same lever style. Other manufacturers also make lever guns. The Henry is quite similar in appearance, but the receiver is not steel like the Winchester. The Winchester also allows you to remove the barrel and scope rail part of the receiver from the rear part containing the trigger, loading and ejection mechanism all attached to the shoulder stock. This has the advantage of allowing you to put a rod up from the rear end. This obviously helps maintain the perfection of the barrel crown. Helps fr cleaning and oiling the works too, I'd say. The winchester comes apart after removal of a single large screw and because the scope stays with the barrel, there are no issues regarding the zero afterwards. Marlin also make levers (39a) and so do Miroku.
This gun seems to need constant cleaning. If I don't clean about every 9 shots, I get extraction problems. The old 9422XTR that I had years back never did this. I'm going to try and have a good look at the chamber to see if there is anything sticky in there, and also take a magnifying glass to the bolt face and extractors. I don't think it is the extractor - the cartridges are tight as hell when it happens. I was reduced to wiping a drop of spit onto the neck of the case before I closed the lever just to lubricate it enough to get it out smoothly. After cleaning, all went well, until another 9 or 10 shots had been fired and then it started again. Hopefully this will be resolved. i can't be dropping a snake down the bore every magazine. That's hardly practical is it?
On the bright side, the gun is very nice to handle. My off hand shooting has improved no end and I was easily able to shoot 110 yard rabbits even with a rather cheap Nikko Sterling 4x32 scope. I know that 110 yard rabbits with an hmr is no big deal, but I didn't even have it properly zeroed at the time. I now have it set dead on at 110 yards and everything I pointed it at after was hit hard and in the right place, give or take a bit of miscalculated windage.
-
What took you so long?
Well done mate - looks a nice bit of kit, I've never tried that kind of action.
I dunnow - I had the CZ two years and it seemed and is a fine tool. Very good out to about 80 yards, where I'm probably starting to be the cause of the failures rather than the gun. For that rifle, maybe I should think about a bipod and really learn the ballistics of the rounds to work out drop. But it does become a bit like artillery after about 70 yards with its great big drop off and the way you have to lob the bullet at the target. Great on a range where you know the distance, but **** out on a rough and windy hillside in the Pennines. None of that with he new puppy though - point - bang - pick up the wabbit.
looks a fine rifle, how do these compare to normal bolt action rifles?It's early days with only half a box fired, but I did have a 9422 XTR which is the 22 magnum version of this gun back in the late seventies and early eighties. That never let me down once - not one problem in about five years of use. I had a 10/22 as well at the time, and I never fired it once after I got the winchester. The action is very quick, but it is old fashioned with a half cock safety like a cowboy gun. You can see that it is based on the old western winchesters, although the action is different. You don't load it on the side of the action like those and the bigger 94 series winchesters. Its a very nostalgic style of rifle - harking back to the western frontier days. You can't just unclip the magazine either if say you meet somebody on the shoot and you want to unload the gun while you pass the time of day. You have to empty the tube. It's perfectly doable, but not as convenient.
The guns are supposed to be very accurate. My old .22 magnum one would shoot groups of about an inch or inch and ahalf at 100 yards if I did my job. I think that is about typical for the cartridge in other rifles too, so I don't think there is any inherent inaccuracy in the action. Form a layman's point of view, it just looks like a different way of working the bolt. It is completely locked up when you shut the lever, so I expect the action won't affect the accuracy. Bob would know better and plenty of others among you maybe.
One thing - and I'd appreciate any comments from people with experience of this round, In half a box of ammo, I got one extraction failure. The case seemed pretty tightly stuck. I had to pry it out with the point of my gutting knife - it really didn't want to come out - then it moved and out it came easy as pie.
The barrel was also pretty fouled up after 24 shots. The tiny little boresnake weight wouldn't go right down and I had to spend about five minutes fishing up and down to make it go through. A rod would probably be better, which is a disappointment since I appear to have paid £20 for a boot lace with a tiny weight on one end. That must be a high margin business selling laces for £20.
Do the fragile little 17gr V-Max rounds receive any damage in the tubular mag?They are quit well protected I think. The spring in the tubular mag isn't that fierce, so I suppose they will survive ok. Time will tell I suppose, but I can see what you are thinking about - will the plastic spire point be knocked off as they slide along the mag tube? The rounds used in the centre fire versions of this rifle (they even made it in 45-70 (which must knock your head off because it is pretty light weight) (* see note) can't have spitzer shaped bullets. They have to be round or square nosed in case the recoil causes the point on one bullet to set off the primer in the next.... What a nasty shock that would give you eh? With rimfire ammo, that's not a problem obviously.
*Note
I hired a .45/70 trapdoor springfield carbine repro at the gun range twice. It was a light gun, about six pounds and the first time we bought 25 reloads with 50 grn black powder. It was a beauty to shoot, plenty of bang and smoke and a good kick, but harmless enough. The next week, I brought along a mate and we hired it again with nitro factory loads ---- Jeez - what a beast. I fired about eight and my head was aching. Each shot was like a kick in the face and the violence of the report left me reeling. There was a horrible shock wave every time you pulled the trigger. I handed it over to my mate who was full of bravado and he ended up with a nose bleed. Light gun - big cartridge - nasty time at both ends of the rifle. I wouldn't want one of these little winchesters with a big fat round like that. It's probably great with .38 pistol ammo. 357 magnum might be ok. They come in that too. I think you may be able to fire 38 special and .357 out of the same gun in the same way as you can fire .22l and .22lr. Not sure, but I believe that's right.
Article on Winchester .38 carbine
-
I use SAK : cheap & I find easy to clean.That quiet never looked for anything else.As has been said before noise of sub hitting rabbit is the biggest problem.
That point about cleaning reminds me how filthy the thing gets. Mine was coated with a thick hard deposit all over the insides. I had it apart after about a thousand rounds and gave it a good scrub and wash. Took some getting off actually.
-
I looked at th PH but went for the SAK, shorter and doesn't have as many bits, I ahve shot side by side with friends with PH mods and there is no difference sound wise.
This will probably draw some flack, but on my CZ I am using an old Parker Hale airgun silencer with just the perforated tube inside it (not the springs and plastic disks. I made the outlet hole about 1mm bigger and with Eley subs the sound is quieter than any of my old air rifles were. Obviously, I won't part with it to anyone else because it is not proofed, but its fine with stingers and cuts their racket tremendously. I just had it lying around and it does the job. It's on my ticket of course.
-
Big smile on my face today when I sighted in the Winchester 9417 and tried it on a few rabbits.
The gun is very handy, light and pointable. Easy to shoot offhand and to hit 50 yard rabbits right on the nut with a snap shot as they run in from the corn as long as they stop for a second. I know 50 yards isn't the caliber's forte, but I took what chances I had. I stuck a little scope on it that I had lying around - a 4x32 Nikko, cheepo jobby. Not great for 130 yards, but I've left my big scope on the CZ. The rifle wouldn't suit a great big 12x50, in my opinion. Anyway, it's early days. A bit more effort on the sighting in would help, I just set it up a centimeter high at 50 yards and got cracking on the conies. More care in setting up will pay off, but I just wanted to try it out after I got it yesterday.
I'm really going to love shooting this rifle for sure. Came back with a bag of rabbits with great big holes in them too. Not a twitch out of any of them.
BANG - WALLOP - FLOP.
It's very loud too. Much more than the stingers were in the .22.
-
As I recall the 10/22 I had twenty five years ago worked ok on HV ammo but not on subs - at least not reliably.
It was never as accurate as my CZ is though - but I said that earlier on in this thread.
See if he'll give you the CZ back. That would be the best thing all round except for the gunsmith, so he probably won't.
-
maybe its time for juries to be up of professional people i.e. lawyers, psychiatrists etc . Just a thought ??
is common sense ,limited to "professional " people then ,i take it you put yourself in this group.
No it certainly isn't and neither is intelligence as measured by tests. The problem with juries now is that people get on them who are stupid, idle and bigots. Look at the case where the juror was found to be playing an ipod into her ears while supposedly listening to the evidence and thinking about it. I've never been a juror, but like most people I know enough people who have and they have sometimes told me they were appalled at the stupid bigotry that has been spouted in the jury room - really stupid, illogical stuff. You have to hope that for every one of them, there are two sane and sensible people who are strong minded enough to counteract them, but it's a lottery isn't it.
Innocent of Dandos murder he may well be,but,if you were the CPS officer in possession of all the facts, responsible for deciding whether he was put before a court would you honestly have said "No."?Nick.
Yes I would, and I'll tell you why. There was only circumstantial evidence and a 'fishy' speck of so called firearms residue in favour of the case. Against it were all the facts that people have brought up about Barry George - mainly, that a very proficient hit was supposedly carried out by a guy who is a hopeless, and socially inept buffoon. Barry George was very good at getting caught - you already pointed that out. He couldn't drive, and he couldn't plan things. The real problem here was the pressure to catch someone for this high profile murder. I think that got in the way of good judgement in this case. We depend on the mass of honest policemen, but we are too often let down by some of them and when we are, there is usually no comeback against them.
-
You are forgetting the CPS in all of this.....Don\'t forget its the lawyers that prosecute ....the police gather evidence. The barry George case was always very iffy......and apears to be a full on \'carraige of misjustice\'. That term has been branded wrongly in the past but is right in this case by the looks of it. I remember the pressure at the time to bring to justice dando\'s maurderer. There was an almost \'lady Di\' type of mulshy reporting on the woman. It was sad that she lost her life but she was no superhero.
Beware the women of Fulham, you never know when the next grope might be coming.
What I would like to know and it isn\'t just about this particular case is; time and time again the Police have circumstantial evidence that may convict a person but at the same time they have evidence that proves their innocence. This evidence is time after time supressed and never passed over to the defence. What gives gives these officers the right to play God and break the law. It makes them liars, immoral, and have no place in the legal system but what happens to them. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!! It seems to be more about the need for a conviction the relieve the pressure (the BBC played a big part in this case) and not finding the guilty party.My wife says, bless her, the Police must think he\'s guilty or they wouldn\'t have charged him. Naive I know, we had the same argument about the Sally Clarke case and her being convicted on a statistic and not evidence (another case where some medical evidence was suppressed). My point is just how many people on a jury think the same way and actually believe all the hype that\'s put in front of them without reservation (the CSI effect). They interviewed one of the original jurors in the Barry George case last night and she was adamant that the evidence wasn\'t enough to convict him and stood by her assessment. How right she was and probably the only deep thinker on the Jury. I wonder how the other eleven feel now? I can imagine the scene in the jury room with the eleven thinking she\'s a trouble making idiot and just wanting get it over and done with and go home. Those eleven are the one\'s to blame as it all hung on their vastly flawed \'assessment\'. On another day Barry George would have been unanimously acquitted. So where do we go from here? The jury system obviously isn\'t working and the public would mistrust a bench of legal experts due to the fact that they may be subject to undue influence. Any ideas? Juror interviews to assess the individuals capability of making a rational and informed assessment and not just any person on the electoral roll? There are great many people I can think of who are just not capable of sitting on a jury and coming to a rational decision having listened to some of the absolute drivel I\'ve heard them come out with.
God knows - we\'d be in trouble without the police and security services - a pretty pickle and no mistake.....
But. to paraphrase a remark up top there, the CPS decide to prosecute and at times the police \'fit up\'.
The Barry George case is one of the MOST disgraceful travesties EVER, and that is saying something.
From the start it was clear that the murder was a professional hit job. No one saw, no physical traces were left. The victim was a high profile crime fighter in a funny way. Her programme and the millions of viewers it got put away many serious villains. So - after a whole year of no hope investigation, the cops chance on a loner half wit with odd social behaviour and difficulties in expressing his interest in women. What happens? Nobody saw him, he has left no physical evidence at the scene at all. No gun is found. He denies ever seeing the lady concerned in the flesh but they pick up one speck of firearms residue on his clothing a year after the event and after firearms officers have searched his house, no doubt hot foot from the gun range, and bingo - he loses his liberty for eight years.
That is really disgusting. The guy has an IQ of 75 but ten jurors thought he could pull off a professional hit job. Justice in this country is a lottery and at least half of that is due to cynical and dishonest policemen with the attitude of, \'We can\'t find out who did it, so this nutter will do.\'
Time and again this happens to guys like Barry George. Stephan Kishco was another one. He was known by the police to be sterile and the rapist murderer had left live sperm on the poor little girl that was murdered. They knew Kishco couldn't have left that sperm, but they persuaded him to confess and let him go tp jail for sixteen years until DNA advances dragged up Ronald Kastree who was the real killer. Kishko died not long after he was let out and pardoned. The court never heard the evidence about Kishco's sterility, because it was never given to the defence and he was too simple minded poor b*gger to tell anyone.
-
All the Weihrauchs are back home in Cornwall. I'dlove to get them out here but i'd cost as much as buying a new gun here.
Jealous .....
Big country and plenty of game.
I don't expect you have to go cap in hand to get some shooting out there.
My eldest son is living in Melbourne just now. Loves it. The missus is going out there to see him next week for a while - I''m gonna love that too.
Woooo hooo!
-
"What MV do you get out of the Career and what weight pellet does it shoot? "
Career is unusual as it is a Target model in 0.25(converted as Target only made in .177or.22 AFAIK).Now use Barracuda @30.9gn as Dai Sung @37?gn unavailable. MV variable up to 1050fps,best accuracy 850-900fps.
That's virtually an Eley Sub equivalent - lower, but not by much. 40 grn and 1080 fps. They group really well and are quieter than any airgun I have owned.
Thanks for the info drut.
-
"Winchester 9217 I'm going to have me some fun with that next week.."
That looks SERIOUS fun
Can't wait Drut. They phoned me from Ponteland a few days ago to say the variation was going in the post soon. I sealed the deal for that gun on guntrader and three days later the bluddy thing still hasn't come. Drat! I felt sure I would be down the motorway today to get it.
I used to have this gun in 22wmr twenty five years ago. It was a beaut, but I sold it on in a daft moment. The HMR will shoot even flatter. Watch out Roger Wabbit.
What do you think of the Career? Is it in .22? I think they do a 9mm one, though god knows what the trajectory must be like. Probably, it would follow the contours of the arch on the Tyne Bridge... LOL.
What MV do you get out of the Career and what weight pellet does it shoot?
-
Webley Axsor .22
CZ452 2eZKM 24inch barrel
I just bought this too in 17HMR, but I haven't picked it up yet. I'm going tomorrow to get it.
Winchester 9217 I'm going to have me some fun with that next week...
I've also got an old boxlock Essex that I bought thirty three years ago, but I can't be bothered to take a picture of it just now.
-
just wondering how much an 1863 enfield snider from 1863 is worth.
cheers
flash
This geezer on here (Bill Curtis) is an expert on this kind of thing. He can probably tell you where it was made and who fired it how many times.. What he doesn't know about Enfelds isn't worth knowing.
Muzzle Loaders Assoication Of GB
Have you fired it ever? I had a Parker Hale repro of the muzzle loading version and it was a blast - literally. We also had some repro sniders in the club which were also good fun.
-
I'd buy the farm you can see in my photo. Then I wouldn't have to drive miles to go up there and shoot on it. I might even blaze away from my bedroom window. I'd look after the sheep and hens and maybe have a few wild boar wandering about the place to ginger things up a bit. As for cars - nah - I'd keep the one I have. It's guns, land and women that I'm interested in.
-
Unfortunately the term 'cowboy cops' in my humble opinion doesn't really apply to either of these scenarios you refer to, some objective and impartial research suggests otherwise. In the case of Jean Charles Menezes the officers involved were responsible for dealing with a proven and very real threat, the decision to shoot was not one they had to take as individuals, this was apparently made by a senior officer with a complete overview of the whole operation, they were simply told to shoot or not and as such when that order was given they were to believe that the person they had (in this case pinned to the floor underneath them) had an explosive device on his person... would you do that? I know I couldn't. The failings in this instance it seems were not of the officer responsible for pulling the trigger.
As far as Harry Stanley goes, there was a whole series of events leading to the fatal shooting, a good number of people for different reasons had real concerns that it was indeed a firearm and the decision to shoot or be shot had to be taken by an individual, not from a rooftop 200 yards away, but in close proximity, with the honest held belief that your or someone elses life was in danger. Again, an equally unenviable position to be in.
Regards
John.
Hi John. I can argue with most of that and will very happily, if you indicate you want to discuss it further. The fact is that two wholly innocent men were shot down by police in circumstances in which they had the right to expect to be left alone. No one has been held accountable in either case. It is not threatening, or an offense to be in possession in the street of a table leg that's been repaired by your brother, and nor is it a menace to society to be in possession of a sun tan on the tube. These are not my arguments by the way. The behaviour of police in both these cases is well documented to be deeply flawed and full of crass misjudgments. If you or I made a mistake with a .22 rimfire and through a ricochet hit someone in the head, you can be sure that we would be in the dock. Not so if you're a cop and put seven into an electrician's head on the tube though - oh and one in his shoulder. That's OK. You just need to get the Met Chief to apologise.
Regards
EV
-
Thanks for the tips Evilv
I didn't buy the XS78 from the first (local) gun-shop - they did not have a CO2 rifle in stock, and I would have traded in the Crosman against it if they had.
I sourced the best deal for the XS78 and scope on line and, even taking into account petrol costs, the saving was worth it.
As for using my local shop again - well I can buy ammo and CO2 on-line at good prices
I have tightened up the scope fixings and am now reliably getting 1/2" groupings over the length of the garden, and indeed my first pigeon yesterday.
I still like the Crosman as a target pistol - I might try it against rats if I ever see any (and if it doesn't work against them have the dealer/Crosman under the Sales Description Act as the pistol is described as a "Ratbuster"!!!)
Ah - so you've solved the scope issue. That's good then.
Rats are quite tough, and I doubt that you'll 'bust' many with a legal air pistol. They have to be less than 6ft pounds of force and I wouldn't think that was enough to kill any rat I've dealt with. I would take the gun back unless you want it for plinking and are happy with that.
Good on your pigeon. I think you'll do just fine with that gun now at the ranges you are interested in.
-
Go wandering about like that with a gun and you are likely to be shot by SO19 or any passing farmer. Never forget that Jean Charles Menezes was shot seven or eight times in the head by SO19 for having a sun tan and black hair and being on the London Underground. Harry Stanley died for carrying a table leg in a plastic bag and being a little drunk.
Why is it that the cowboy cops are always exonerated?
-
A couple of things Amateur:
Mind out when shooting at a wooden backstop. Sometimes pellets can rebound pretty hard right back at you. I was once hit on the head by one such. Surprised me MUCH. Better hang up some thick old carpet to absorb bouncers. It will make your practice quieter too.
Also, if the gun is having to be resighted all the time, are you sure the scope is firmly fastened to the gun? This may sound a naive and foolish question, but I've used quite cheap scopes on my old TX200 springer that stayed in zero for months of use. Check out the mounts are firmly tight, but don't over do it and strip the bolts as they are pretty small.
If all else fails on the scope zero problem, you could use open sights at that kind of range anyway. If the scope is firmly mounted on a gas rifle and it loses zero without being dropped or knocked, it is faulty. Take it back.
You were VERY badly advised at that gun shop by the way. They wasted your money for sure on the pistol. You went in with a problem and they sold you something entirely unsuitable. Sounds like they also may have supplied a rubbish scope. I wouldn't go there again if it were me, once you have sorted out this problem and seen them about the supply of inappropriate guns for pest control I would keep out of there. They don't deserve your business.
EDIT:
This post has been edited and reference to recoil was removed when I re-read the original post and realised that it was a co2 rifle.
-
Is that first video the mark of a failed state or what?
'You can take this with you when you put out the garbage.' 'When things get nasty, you can just flip it out like this.'
-
My old 452 is for keeps.
All the good 10/22's i've read about are so tricked nothing original is left.
My CZ modded a little though so I can talk.
Lighter stock, Timney trigger, 14" barrel, that's it, don't need any more.
I allso prefer the shot & safe 'till the bolts worked aspect of my CZ.
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh316/D...EA/DSCN4954.jpg
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh316/D...EA/DSCN4953.jpg
Jeez - that's short. Mine has a twenty four inch barrel. Not exactly handy in scrub, but then I'm not hunting wild boar with it, so if I don't get the barrel on target quickly enough, I don't get stamped into the ground and eaten.
-
It would be good to contact the local falconer's group. What if that jesse gets snagged up somewhere and it starves while tied to a bush or something?
-
And one for the opposition, why would you want to swap a rifle for a toy?
I can see why the dealer is keen though - he is no mug
I could not have put it better.Mind you having both would be tempting
My first .22 was a Ruger 10/22 in 1979. It worked ok, but it couldn't shoot the kind of groups that my CZ can. Mind you, I wasn't using the subs then so that could be why is seemed less accurate. The CZ will shoot fifty yard, cloverleaf groups of a centimeter or a touch over on a good calm day with a rest, like off the top of the car. It isn't a glamorous kind of a gun, but I don't see it letting anybody down. Also, the ability to just pull out the bolt and clean with a rod from the breach end is good. Preserves the crown so they say - just repeating what I've been told there. The CZ doesn't make my heart beat faster like the Winchester 9417 I'm picking up later in the week, but it is a simple, workmanlike, reliable tool.
-
There is a lot more paper work on what and where and how many they shoot,unless your an indian and then you can mostly do what you want....Even shoot badgers
Comparing us to America is just plain silly. Their land mass is far greater than ours which allows them to have areas of wilderness. The British countryside is a place which is the way that it is today because of farming and humans managing it.
FM
Yes - I know this is true. As for the managing thing, I think that sometimes we idealise the current state of the countryside as if it was perfect. There are parts where it is pretty good; where traditional field patters survive and there is high biodiversity and there are other parts where huge fields, loss of hedgerow and high impact farming has produced something else altogether.
Only a fool would think it can be all wild and natural in such a crowded island as this one, so yes - this isn't America and never will be.
I'm about done with this topic. There are those who want badger eradication, I don't. Ireland's experience where they have been virtually eradicated shows it doesn't work. TB in Ireland where badgers have been decimated is still more than twice the level of the UK. They abandoned pre movement testing for TB in 1999 and TB rocketted right after. Ireland has been slaugtering badgers for twenty years and there are supposed to be 60,000 badger snares set every night across the land.
In Britain, Badgers may need licensed control in some places. I am not against that. As for my remarks on subsidy and baling out businesses, I am totally against it. Far from being a left wing veggie, I am a right wing carnivore who shoots for fun. Subsidy and food mountains of produce bought when no one wants it, are a socialistic nightmare that distorts the market. I pay for food in the shops. Why should I pay more again in taxes to support businessmen who can't compete in the free market? We don't do that with cars anymore like we did in the 1970s. Remember how **** the British made cars were then? I do - they were total rubbish because of government subsidy and interference. If a business man can't make a living, he should do something else. That's how the rest of the economy works chaps - live with it. It is coming soon to the countryside.
Whatever we do in managing wildlife, I believe must be dictated by the need to preserve the species we have in adequate numbers. We have already extinguished wolves, beavers, bears and wild cats from most of this island over the last few hundred years and in the past hammered raptors to such an extent that they were virtually gone from large parts of the country. Farmers have to coexist with wildlife - there may be need for control of some species - that is fine. Eradication is not, and for any but legally defined pest species there must be control on how many can be taken. History shows us what happens without controls. These were once common until they were exterminated by farmers and landowners. I want them all back.
-
all that tourism business is a hell of a lt more important to the countryside economy that the feather bedded farming industry is - by far.
Well if it wasn't for farming in the British countryside, there would be no British countryside.
Ths tourism industry in the countryside that you talk of would go to pot quite quickly would it not?
FM
What? You think it would disappear? Well, I don't know. Maybe we would have more wilderness to shoot in - like in the States. Wouldn't that be grand, all kind of wild things to shoot at - wolves even, feral cattle and pigs - whooo hooo. Just imagine. I envy those Americans who can 'hunt' as they call it all over the place.
Whoop de do - HMR :-)
in Guns & Equipment
Posted · Edited by Evilv
That's very important. Thanks for clearing that up. Sorry about my dangerous waffle there.