basil-blaster

hi yeah what im trying to say is i dont have deer permission, but i want another calibre but what wil the police allow for foxes without having deer?? i can get a 338 lapua for deer and get foxes too but i dont have the deer permission so i cant link it like that to get the use of foxes.

no you just need another gun if you want to have a night vision scope and a normal scope due to not been able to use the nv scope in the day, easy to apply for but if you have endless money there is a nv scope you can use in the day, well i have heard of it not ever seen it but it will be more than my kite was, £4800. lota money like init to shoot a fox.

ohh yeah im not saying that there not good for the job at hand. i just dont want to go down in calibres if i can help it, i use my 243 nearly every night and 22-250 quite alot but if i get another night vision i definatly want another calibre, not just another gun, i might aswell get a bigger one if i can, johnathan

hi i shoot a high number of foxes a year but i wanted to get deer conditions on my liscence as theres deer on our land and the police says i need to get a letter from someone saying that i have been with them and shot there deer rifle and that in there opinion that im safe to shoot them, i shoot 200 foxes plus a year and i have a 243 and a 22-250 and had them for 3 and 4 years so i have plenty of experiance with large calibres. i just need someone who is williing to let me tag along and shoot there gun once so i can get the conditions to be able to shoot deer legally on my own land and other farms as i have a open liscence so i just need it passed by the police then i can get prmission from other farmers and friends and im sorted. obviously i will make it right with you as soon as i get it passed whoever i go with can come shooting on the land wherever i go, let me know if you want to help another shooter out, by the way im in west yorkshire, and willing to travel a bit anywere in yorkshire or close to yorkshire thanks johnathan

hi im just wondered what people have got passed for foxes, now im talking larger calibres but i only really care about what people have without having deer attached to the conditions for the calibre just calibres people have for foxes. now i have a 243 and a 22-250 for foxes but my mate got a 260 passed, im not sure if the police in west yorkshire will alow it. if anyone knows if i could get one, can you tell me how? i have one for foxes but the other i have is for a designated night vision rifle for foxes but i was wanting another night vision im going to get another kite. as my others a bit daft atm its going off all the time but i have droped it a few times. and i have a buyer for it so i was going to get a new one and get a cheaper one too. i wanted to put it on my 243 and the cheaper on my 22-250 so i need another rifle for normal shooting with the lamp or in the day, and i would like a bigger one if possible, i know there plenty powerful what i have already, and never missed or had a runner so very happy with them but obviously i would like a bigger calibre, theres no point going down, let us know what you think thanks johnathan

hi, i have a l200 2001 with big ragging tyres on it (275 70 r16) and a shooting subframe in the back, it is fantatic. i use it nearly everyday and i have only got it stuck once in a bog that you couldnt stand up in, it did pretty well, the only thing i can say about the pickups in general is there not heavy enough on the back end for good traction, we have a nevara two ( a new one ) and that cant go anwhere near as far as my l200. we also have a new disco but it has no ground clearence, the older ones have better ground clearence, and the upside of the disco's you can get a 4.0litre wich is better for foxing as its smoother and the autos dont have to rev alot to pull, also the l200 has loads of power. but the best thing about the older l200's is the ground clearence is great, i have driven over walls that have been broken down and it never hardly catches the underside. but the comment about the vitara was completely true the vitaras have the best grip to weight ratio of all the standard cars. iv had 2 and they are better than all the pickups but there not so big, my mate has a hilux and i have passed him in the l200 and had to pull him out up at the flappits. and once had to pull him out when we went shooting, he got stuck trying to get out of a steep gateway, i got out after a bit of spinning but he had no chance. hope this helps, johnathan

i have battery 2 site drills for my steel fabrication company. both 24v can use them with sds bits in and chuck adapter for screwdriver or twist drill. if you live on a farm like me you always need a good drill for a water bowl or summat. invest in a 24v li-ion battery either ryobi makita or a hitachi, or for the best drill you will ever buy.... period!! buy a HILTI !! and the good thing about these types of drills even idiots like my workers cant break them.

yes i got a serious amount of foxes the year after i got my nightvision it cost me £4800 but its awesome. i was shooting on land in different areas and i used to lay on the top of a hill looking over about 1500 acres to the other hill top and the call travelled a hell of alot and sometimes it took an hour for foxes to come but they used to come every time if i didnt get any set of eyes after 20 mins i used to use a totally different caller like some polystyrene on tile then to a electronic caller with the larger speaker on, bearing in mind there was no streetlights were this land is, it is easy to spot eyes even if they are faint i used the lamp to see the direction for the fox then dont use again after fox was within the land i can shoot on, as usually you can see it when it is clear as the fox is running towards you cos of the caller. also actual fox count as written in my diarys for each year is as follows: 2007-2008 82 foxes from june when got lisence shot with 12 bore and 17 hmr 2008-2009 217 foxes .22-250. 2009-2010 324 foxes open licence granted from dec 2008 and got night vision 2010-2011 436 foxes 2011-2012 281 foxes year my little one was born .243. 2012-2013 26 foxes to date total number of foxes 1366, i did estimate it and i was wrong but thats the proper amount.

i have had my liscence for just short of 5 years what are you on about

i used to go out nearly every single day, i dont now i still go out all the places but not as much and i used to, i used to spend nearly all night trailing round all the farms and our own farms and i have night vision (kite) and a night vision monocular and deben light that has a battery that lets me go out all night. i used to bait them all over and spent hours calling them in, i used to shoot near a naker yard too and that draws loads in even though i use to only go on the first day of the month i used to get 4,5 and 6 every time but i had to shoot them with shotgun depending where they were. anyway i know what i have done i have over 350 pictures all took in 2010 to prove plus all the others i didnt take a pic of and i wrote in my shooting diary.

right, alot of the people at the range prefer the 22-250 for foxing against what others they have not saying they all have 243 also. also i dont want massive power i just prefer my 22-250, i think it is better and with my custom sound mod its just lovely to shoot, if the 243 with a 55 is so fast and flat then thats fine but as i have said i like the 90 gr in it and wont be changing. also the 243 is louder than the 22-250 but i have just bought 4 extra baffles for my sound mod and fitted them so should be quiter than 22-250 now, so may be used more, there are alot of foxes that i shoot on my dads mates farm and they sometimes have shaved areas on legs so what would you say? could that be near were the rspca let foxes out?? and used to go out every day before i had a little one to up to 8 farms a week

if you read what i said, i said i shoot that amount less than 50 yards per year there mostly 150 yards plus and as for the amount of foxes, before i got with our lass and had a baby i used to go out shooting nearly every single night i used to shoot at home and up at my grandads and went out to my dads mates farm once a week whos farm is 650 acres and used to shoot 3+ every week on his farm alone. also used to go to a old chaps up in gisburn and shot a few every week i also used to go to my uncles every fortnight and used to get one 9 times out of 10 i can work out the distance like within 50 yards which is good enough to hit them every time and i only take safe shots actually and only shoot if im sure its a fox i agree you know ballistics or seem to and you obviously know that i dont know about the performance of the 243 with different bullet weights in. i know plenty about shooting mate, knowing about ballistcs doesnt make you a good shooter.

17 hmr cz 453 or 452 either or,varmint barrel with a sound mod that i have forgot the name of now i come to write this. with a 6-24x50 dontop scope illuminated target dot, harris bi-pod shooting hornady v-max works well only ever shot foxes with it, very accurate when not windy.

were the hell do you live? you got a open lisence straight out?? i have never heard of that i appied for mine on our 2 farms and thats hundreds of acres and i didnt get it open for 17 hmr and i even asked! and i had experiance since 10 years old with shotgun and from 14 with 22-250 and 223 and 25-06 and i was shooting 10 foxes a month with my dad.

dependant on the police authority they may want you to get a flat round something like a 204 ruger or a 22-250. alot of people i know had to change the calibre from a 243 to a lesser calibre and a flatter round even though you can get flat shooting out of the 243. thats just the experiance i had when i asked them on the phone which calibre i would be ok with on our land at home. a few people i know had a big problem with over sizing there first centrefire. ( for example my mate dave had a 22 wmr and applied for a 243 for foxes and a 30-06 and he was refused it for both! they said the 243 was to large for some reason, so he had to get a 223 and they let him have 30-06 after he reapplied after he had the centrefire for a bit and did dsc1 they didnt even take the letter he sent in as anything the first time round and it was for pay days too, weird that int it) my dad didnt get 243 for our farm but when he reapplied for a 22-250 he got it no problem but they said that due to the houses at the end of the back feild and the road that devides our land,they said a 243 was too large. i only got a 243 as i have a open lisence. also right a letter with the application and state that if the 243 is too large that you would be satisfied with which ever other you choose. i did it when i sent in for a dedicated night vision but because i had a open lisence it didnt matter land restricts the calibre so apply somewere with large safe backstops then you should be ok bear it in mind about the letter makes the police take more notice of the fact you need a fox calibre and your not too pick you just need to a centrefire.

dont get me wrong 436 foxes isnt record breaking but its a hell of alot more than alot of people. and my birthday is in 3 week actually and i got my rifle as soon as i was old enough i applied for 17hmr and 22-250 and cos my dad had it wasnt hard for me to get it and if you read the other post properly you will see that i shoot around 250 with the 22-250 and about 70 with the 243 and also i do go to the range i have put loads of rounds down the range i go once every couple of weeks and shoot a box of 20, and the gun was starting to be less accurate so i got a new one, and no i havent reloaded a single round ever i wouldnt know were to start well i would i know the basics but i wont be trying it. i would rather buy them as i can get 22-250 sako for £20 a box or £10 for ppu or whatever it is called and 243 sako for £25 so its only either 50p, £1 or £1.20 a round and reloading seems like a long winded thing to do unless your good at it, also putting 70 gr in a 243 is light for what it can take so thats why i wouldnt use them, i dont posses a rangefinder but we have a 16 acre feild behind my house and it is about 600 yards long and i shoot foxes most of the time just under half the length. its very rare i shoot close foxes. wish i did to be honest a few 50 yarders would be nice to see them go down properly not just see it fall or eyes go out. only shoot maybe 30 a year with 22-250 and 10 or 15 with 243. now were not going to agree which is the best as in your eyes a 243 is the best and i think that the 22-250 is better for FOXES i dont shoot deer either so i dont get to see the power of 243 really i see more shattered shoulders with it but i feel more confident shooting a fox in the head with the 22-250. so in my type of shooting i think the 22-250 is better i can see your point if you put lighter bullets in then you will get great flatness. but with 90 gr in the bullet drops conciderably compaired to a 22-250 and the bullets i use shoot faster than 3600 i think there about 3850 ish. i think the 22-250 is better because it is seriously flat and also it is a very accurate cabilbre and nice amount of recoil and great killing power for what it is used for. i still think that the 70 gr 243 will drop more than the 22-250 50 gr as there not much more powder. and like 40% heavier. anyway either way fox is dead either way even shot in the ****! saying that i know a lad that shot a fox in the **** (accidently) with a 25-06 and it run off from the middle of a feild and it was dead right at the far side of the next feild like 400 yards and did not find it till the next day. i know how far the walls ect are, at other land that i only go on at night i arnt so sure, theres some land i have never been on properly in the day and sometimes you dont realise how far it is till you have to go pick it up. anyway im not arguing about this because i cant be bothered with it, i have enough stuff to argue about with my simple lazy late employees (well one got the sack today the usless ***** he was 40 mins late and couldnt even punch 4 holes per plate at 30mm from each edge at the corner properly) and r lass, not about shooting that the only thing that chills me out.

ACKLEY talking about experiance: i shoot over 300 foxes a year and have every year for 5 years and one year i shot 436 one year so thats over 1600 foxes since i got my centrefire so dont tell me that i need more experiance iv shot so many i have had to get another gun because i shot it out!. instead of arguing with people saying this that and the other, my mate has a compitition barrel in his 22-250 which has got the correct twist for that weight, so he can stabalise the bullet. im not talking about the ballistics of the gun im talking about been in the feild and shooting a fox not thinking about shooting one sat on here,its ok saying this and that and the other about calibres but the ballistics dont mean **** if you take a gun into the feild and shoot a fox at 300 yards and it hits it spot on and kills it immediatly that shows how good the calibre is, yes a 243 is better in some ways but like i said we are on about shooting foxes! i know a lad that shoot foxes with a 30-06 and it minces them but whats the point you are trying to control them not blow them up. i dont look at the ballistics and all that. i look for accuracy and killing power and flatness of the round for fox shooting the flatter the round the better the round is for foxing as i have said before which i do not know if you know or not, you cannot judge distances at night properly. if you shoot heavy rounds you get more dropping of the bullet. my mate shoots a 204 ruger with 35 gr bullets in and shoots foxes at 300 yards no problem and has a great flat bullet but drifts more than the 22-250. but like i have said before the 22-250 is the best calibre for fox distruction without a doubt, 80% of people who have a 22-250 and a 243 would say that the 22-250 is better for foxes.

ye dint think but it stuck on yours and i cannot change it,

right first of all you are on about putting 58 gr bullets in a 243 which is going to be as flat as a 22-250 im on about heavy bullets not light bullets and ye let me no next time your up and we can have a shoot, and ya cant get 75 gr but i no of a lad who puts 68 gr (i think somewhere around that weight) bullets into his 22-250, if you shoot the same weight bullets with the tiny amount of more powder there is then you are going to get a really flat projectile, but i am saying heavy bullets, 90 gr plus are going to drop alot compaired to 58 gr obviously. i am not going to say that a 243 with a light bullet can be better than a 22-250 50 gr but for long distance and flatness the 22-250 is better for foxes as you can not always work out the distance at night, 243 with light bullets are perfect for foxes but large heavy bullets like 90 gr plus are going to drop over large distances more even though there will be less wind drift but theres not much wind drift from the 22-250 anyway, im from bradford and when you come up let me know and if the range is open when you come i will gladly meet you for a shoot, i dont want to have a big argument on here, but the facts which i dont think you will disagree with are: 22-250 - flat round, great accuracy, very good killing power for foxes, low recoil for the quality of the kill power. you can go shooting and shoot with the crosshairs on the target not worry about it 243 - more recoil than 22-250, very good accuracy for heavy bullets but the drop lets it down for long distances, it is a 1000 yard calibre but you have to take the time to take the shot, a 22-250 is so flat you can take the shot with no worry, if you put 58 bullets in it it will be great but the 243 is better than that it should have 85 gr plus. i am not saying the 243 is not good its ace calibre but the 22-250 is a great FOX calibre, 243 is mainly used for DEER and deer is larger than a fox and the drop of heavy bullets could cause you to miss unless you are sure of the distance find out the weight of powder in the 243 and the 22-250 its not far off the same, BELLOW THIS IS A COMMENT FROM A TOP RIFLE SHOOTER WHO SHOOTS BOTH THE 22-250 AND THE 243 AND READ IT CAREFULLY THE GUY EVEN SAID THAT IT OUTSHOOT THE 243 AT SHORTER DISTANCES LIKE MEANING UNDER 500 YARDS: Some cartridges are absolutely more inherently accurate than others, but no cartridge is the best at everything. This is probably another moot debate when it comes to hunting though as most any caliber will shoot well in a good gun..specifically by hunting standards. Benchrest standards are a whole nother story. Cartridge efficiency and inherent accuracy go hand in hand IMO. The 6PPC cartridge dominates benchrest group shooting. It's widely accepted as the world's most accurate cartridge. While that's debatable, you are not going to beat it with an identically built 300 Ultra Mag at distances of less than 300 yards(and maybe somewhat more). But at the long range game, the 300 Ultra(and several others) will spank the venerable 6PPC. When talking about all out accuracy,you build a gun for a specific purpose. Anything less is a compromise to suit your needs or wants from the gun as a whole. As for the .243 vs. .22-250...the same applies from factory built guns in particular. The standard twist rate for a .22-250 is 1-14 and will only stabilize bullets of up to 55-60 grains. These bullets are not the best choice for long range. The .243 standard twist rate is 1-10 and will stabilize bullets up to about 100 grains. The .243 has a big advantage at longer ranges, but from my experience, at shorter ranges the .22-250 usually will outshoot the .243. Both are fine calibers though. Now lets put a fast twist barrel on the 22-250. Say a 1-7 twist that will shoot 80 grain bullets at about 3200fps. The playing field is now about even for short and long range between the two and the best shooting gun is probably a coin toss at both short and long range. FWIW, they are both good rounds but neither would be my first choice for an all around varmint caliber. Do a search for 6BR cartridge. It has more accuracy potential and better barrel life than either a .22-250 or .243 and would be my first choice for an all around varmint caliber, and is still plenty for deer size game as well.--Mike Ezell

Next time you come to yorkshire let me no I'll take you to stead hall firearms and show you! I don't talk rubbish. I have both calibres and that is my opinion on both. I have had my 22-250 for a few years now and I shoot full batches of sako bullets through a sako made gun. Even the guy at stead hall couldn't believe that it only slightly takes the edge of the hole out. If you come up let me no you can come out with us lamping and you will see that what I said is true. Also the 243 has the same case and the same powder and the only difference is the size of the shoulder there's no more powder. Yes there is more damage and will have less wind drift but does increase the drop over longer distances. Don't get me wrong I'm not saying the 243 isn't a fantastic round but it is not as good for foxes at long distances as you have to account for its bullet drop with heavy bullets. I haven't shot 70 gr bullets in it only 90 gr. I may change my mind if I did but there's no point in putting 70 gr in a 243 because you can put that in a 22-250 you want atleast 85 gr bullets to have the difference between them. It is obvious the 243 has more killing power but its only a fox you can kill them well with 17hmr and 22 hornet so either of these are definitely going to be the the perfect fox killers in the right hands as them rounds can do the job and there nothing compaired to these.

No chance!! I have both and 22-250 far outshoots the 243. For foxes there is simply no better round (maybe a 20 tactical). I have shot foxes at 300-400 yards with the 22-250 and it didn't move an inch and half from aim to impact. If you match the gun to the ammo and are a good shot you can achieve amazing results with a 22-250 for example a sako/tikkat3 with 50gr sako ammo. Also for fox shooting you want the flattest bullet you can get as when out at night its hard to judge distance. I shoot over 250 foxes a year with 22-250 and about 70 with 243. Never missed or had a runner off either but had some low shots at 300 yards on small foxes with 243. Only upside about 223 is the price and you can get a AR-15 or a bullpop for playing too. If you ever shoot any targets. Think about the matching of ammo to rifle as I said its a key thing!

Yes I went out last night with the 243 few basils about couldn't get any shots off due to safety but back out tonight

hi, if you are looking to lamp in bradford area i could shoot with you few times a week, depends on your land ect, i shoot on our own farms min of once a week family dont always have enough time to go foxing elsewere so bit stuck for the amount i can go out now other than at home and our other farm. i have open lisence and all equiptment. 12 gauge o/u BERRETA silver pigeon 3 10 gauge AYA goose gun .17HMR CZ (MODERATED) .22-250 TIKKA T3 CUSTOM SOUND MODERATOR ULTRA LITE!!! 50gr sako soft points, 100 YARDS 6 SHOTS THROUGH SAME HOLE!! (COLD SHOTS) .243 TIKKA T3 CARBON FIBRE SOUND MODERATOR. 90gr sako sort point 100 YARDS HALF INCH GROUP getting night vision gen 3 scope soon!!!!! NIGHT VISION MONOCULAR 210 DEBEN LIGHT CALLERS GALOR!!!!! NICE PEICE OF POLYSTYRENE!! AND A PEICE OF TILE