Airguns

[Rabbitbowler]

Can any one quote what the max psi that can be achieved on a a/gun with f.a.c and the sort of yardage for taking out rabbits with that power.....?

[roblade]

how longs a iece of string?

 

but am going to assume you mean F/lbs not PSI?

 

springer .22 up to around 20 F/Lbs

gas ram .22 up around 35F/Lbs (eliminator)

PCP up to 220F/Lbs YES 220!!!!! (am sure have heard of one being beyond 300 as well.)

 

thought the above are the maximum poower levels achioevable with variouse calibers and rifles the majoroty of PCP rifles go to a max level of about 35F/Lbs and can be used on vermin out to about 75 yards. The biggest advantage oif power is a very flat trajectory which illiminates the need for so much hold over/under.

 

 

ROB

Edited August 4, 2005 by roblade

[old rooster]

Tried a 50 ftlb rifle the other day, all I can say is it was AWESOME !!.

 

Energy retention is a requisite for longer range shooting, as I mentioned in another thread my Axsor with Accupells will put the pellet right through the bunnies head at 65 yards.

 

A few considerations for long range shooting:

 

The ability of the gun to shoot tight groups, without that you ain't going to cut the mustard however good you are.

 

Good quality pellets that suit your gun, I'm an Accupell user (can't touch you for it) but Daystate apparently make a good pellet which you can buy in a range of .22 sizes to suit your gun. Springers need a tighter fitting pellet than a pcp as it allows the pressure to build up behind the pellet when the piston moves forward, the pcp using a looser fiting pellet needs less energy to overcome the friction. (Words of wisdom from a friend who designs guns for a well known manufacturer).

 

The ability to hold the gun steady, sounds obvious but it's something you can give a lot of thought to. Some use bipods, some shoot prone, there are all manner of ways of getting stability. I also practice reducing pulse rate as this can make a hell of a difference, get your pulse rate down to less than 50 bpm and learn to breathe shallow. Sounds potty but it all helps. I defy anybody to regularly hit a bunny in the head at 50 yards while standing without a rest of any sort.

 

One last thought, if you can't hit a rabbit head sized target consistently at whatever range you choose then you shouldn't be shooting live quarry at that range. If you can hit the target and have enough residual energy in the pellet to give a clean kill then you're set for some fair shooting.

 

Practice makes perfect is a good adage, get to know your gun and it will make all the difference.

[Axe]

Rob - 220ft/lb's wow thats damn high and well over a sub sonic rimmy. I kind of imagine that the shots per charge are going to be countable on 1 hand though. What about reliability, seals etc.?

 

OR - BPM down to 50, you didnt star in the late '60's films 'Our Man Flint', did you? Its funny but when im standing and looking to keep the recticle in a fixed position on my target, my pulse actually starts to race!! I favour using Bi-Pods as much as possible as my free standing skills are not yet honed. I have to say that I am working on this and beleive it or not, ive found using bi-pods, yes bi-pods, in the standing postion can help. I extend one leg and rest it on my side!!. Still cant beat a good rested shot though.

 

Regards,

 

Axe.

[old rooster]

Going to try and get some photos of stance and maybe video of shots at bunnies next time we go out if that's of interest to anyone ?.

 

Might try to do some video of target shooting at the same time to show the kind of grouping you can achieve.

 

50 bpm easy to achieve, just imagine you are watching Coronation Street and you actually approach a comatose state

[blackthorn]

why wont all that power when all it takes is a legal limit air rifle fieldcraft and accuracy done the power mad bullsh?t afew years ago back to legal limit eney takers on this one gentlemen

[Axe]

OR - pics and vids would be great. Its always a good thing to take on information form others, no matter how good you think you are!

 

As for the coronation street method, I dont think this will work as either I would fall asleep or be pounding the ground looking for the remote!!!

 

Regards,

 

Axe.

 

PS how did the pigeon shoot go yesterday?

[old rooster]

PS how did the pigeon shoot go yesterday?

Had an enjoyable few hours in the countryside, looked promising to start with, plenty of pigeons coming from out in front from woods miles away, dropped right on the deeks and I actually shot a few. Ended up with just 20 as they all of a sudden stopped coming, just converted them to pigeon burgers using the recipe in the lates BASC magazine. Excellent fodder old boy, highly recommended

 

Having another look round tomorrow, picked up some more rabbit shooting this evening, adjacent property to the one we went to recently.

 

Have a good weekend.

[pete k]

stalker rifles make them over 300flb and in .50 cal

[lurcherboy]

Going to try and get some photos of stance and maybe video of shots at bunnies next time we go out if that's of interest to anyone ?.

 

Might try to do some video of target shooting at the same time to show the kind of grouping you can achieve.

 

50 bpm easy to achieve, just imagine you are watching Coronation Street and you actually approach a comatose state :unsure:

Do it O/R I would like to see that.

 

 

LB

[roblade]

stalker rifles make them over 300flb and in .50 cal :unsure:

yep and they are based around the falcon and BSA S10 :yp:

 

ROB

[Axe]

just converted them to pigeon burgers using the recipe in the lates BASC magazine.  Excellent fodder old boy, highly recommended  :unsure:  :yp:

Alas, we only see the odd one or two pigeons on our shoots. That receipe did sound rather tastey.

Incidentally, did you read the airgun & rimfire article. More over the comments regarding FAC airguns not being a compromise between a rimmy and 12ft/lb airgun.

Whats your opinion on that, and anyone else for that matter?

 

Regards.

 

 

Axe.

Edited August 8, 2005 by Axe

[old rooster]

Incidentally, did you read the airgun & rimfire article. More over the comments regarding FAC airguns not being a compromise between a rimmy and 12ft/lb airgun.

Whats your opinion on that, and anyone else for that matter?

 

Regards.

 

 

Axe.

Didn't read the article to be honest. My own purpose in having an FAC air rifle would be to get flatter trajectory and more energy, looking for cleaner kills at reasonable ranges. A lot of the places I shoot don't suit a rimfire and they are more expensive to run. I believe there is some restriction on the amount of ammunition you can store but don't quote me on this.

 

To some extent I just like using an air rifle, the one I'm getting next is so quiet it is totally unobtrusive, they kill perfectly well if properly used without smashing the quarry to pieces. There is something altruistic about a weapon making it's power from compressing the same air that we breathe.

 

Downside of going FAC is that (apparently) once uprated the air rifle can't legally be put back to sub 12ftlb so the market for resale is severely limited.

 

Horses for courses, different folks, different strokes.

 

I have no issue with rimfire just no real use for one on my shoots.

[Axe]

Downside of going FAC is that (apparently) once uprated the air rifle can't legally be put back to sub 12ftlb so the market for resale is severely limited.

This is something that I have been aware of for some time but, the BASC article explains that this only applies to barrel lengths under 24". Mind you, I dont think i'd want an airgun with a barrel length over 24".

 

It was also saying that there are so many different types of ammo available that this enables a rimfire to be bought down to FAC airgun powers. Don't quote me on it but it think they said around 36ft/lb with 27ft/lb at 50 yards.

[old rooster]

Hmmm so where is the advantage ? bet the ammo for the rimmy costs more than the air rifle.

 

Going to try and get some shooting in with the camera and video this afternoon, bunnies everywhere !!!.

[Axe]

I think the point they are trying to make is that if you have the rimfire you can control the power output by chaging the type of ammo you use. Then if you want to take longer range shots or bigger quarry, you simply up the ammo type. The cost of the ammo is more expensive but then the rifle, of which you only need one, is far cheaper than a decent FAC Air Rifle. I guess its swings and roundabouts and as always, personal preferrence. But may well offer insight to those of us who may be considereing the next rung of the ladder, like me.

 

Look forward to the pics and tips.

 

Regards,

 

Axe.

Edited August 8, 2005 by Axe

[old rooster]

Another moderately successful foray, got 10 last evening but my camera lady needs more training and missed most of the action. To be honest they were (as expected) far more wary than last time.

 

Going again early next week to have a go at an adjacent field which is swarming with bunnies, will try again for some footage from a strategically placed hide.

 

fired an 8 round magazine at a knot in a solid post at 45 yards range and the grouping would have fitted on a new 1p coin so plenty good enough to kill bunnies all day long. Did a quick experiment at 100 yards with no holdover and the pellets were hitting about a foot lower, wasn't able to sit in such a stable position but even so with holdover would have hit a Coke can every time at that range. Interestingly the pellets were still fully penetrating a solid wooden post at that range, still enough energy to kill bunnies with head shots.

 

Will do some more experimenting with the longer range grouping when I've more time to see if it can be imoproved with a more stable position.

[Axe]

will try again for some footage from a strategically placed hide.

Do you use hides alot (for rabbits) ? This is something I have been considering on some of my shoots.

 

I have in trouble getting close in to them because of the lay of the land. Its either a road or foorpath and sometimes tree lines and wind. This is where I think the hides would come in useful. Though I have never seen a rabbit shooter mention using a hide!

 

Regards,

 

Axe.

[Devilishdave]

I have used a few hides in the past to shoot rabbits with vareying success, some times just in the hedge line and in one case whare I got the best results was on top of a small water tower, only about 10 foot high by 15 foot square. The next door neighbour climbed on it and topped him self with his shot gun which put a bit of a damper on it!! But it did work always found lamping to be the best form of control for rabbits.

 

Dave

[Axe]

The next door neighbour climbed on it and toped him self with his shot gun which put a bit of a damper on it!!

:unsure: :yp:

 

I can see how that might discourage you from using it again!!!

 

On one shoot that I have been trying to control, the rabbits are getting pretty wise. When we first walked the land they were pretty ignorant. You could stalk in and take an outsider, then find a good spot to hold up while waiting the 15-20mins for them to appear. Now they bolt before getting a chance to take any of them and laying up stops them coming out, until dusk!!

 

Regards,

 

Axe.

[old rooster]

will try again for some footage from a strategically placed hide.

Do you use hides alot (for rabbits) ? This is something I have been considering on some of my shoots.

 

I have in trouble getting close in to them because of the lay of the land. Its either a road or foorpath and sometimes tree lines and wind. This is where I think the hides would come in useful. Though I have never seen a rabbit shooter mention using a hide!

 

Regards,

 

Axe.

Don't use hides that often, just fancied a lazy afternoon (nothing new there then) and wanted to try and get some video footage which is pretty awkward when stalking the bunnies. It can work really well but on this occasion the little blighters came out to play everywhere except where the camera was pointed. One obliged but my novice camera lady forgot to press the record button until after the fatal shot had been placed so all we ended up with was a short film of a dead rabbit.

 

We've a much better place to set up on the adjacent land next week while the owners are away and the horses removed from the paddock. Will try to get some footage then if the weather isn't too bad.

 

As you say, the bunnies soon wise up to the dissapearance of their mates and link the sight of you with your gun and a reduction in their social circles. Always a good idea to make the most of the first shoot on virgin territory IMHO, that way you've demonstrated to the land owner that you are a valuable commodity, you also get a cracking days shooting.

 

We will only shoot this venue once more this summer as we want to ferret the area and do some video of that, it lends itself to a variety of methods, one bury in particular is going to be great to long net !!!

[Guest Mr Pieman]

OR,

 

if your heartbeat is close to 50 you need to see a doctor - you are probably dying :( B)

 

The best you could hope for is to lower your heart rate to near your resting rate - in most adults this is taken between 60 and 70 beats per minute. However, your heart does slow down as you get older though!! I do, however, agree with the sentiment of keeping your breathing and heart rate steady and low if you can.

 

In the airi rifle/rimfire debate, is it possible to get hollow point ammo for an air rifle. As it is a legal requirement to use expanding ammunition on live quarry with a rim fire, I presume its the same with air rifles. Solid pelets don't deform in a predictable manner which is why we can't use solid slugs (not even leasd) through our FAC weapons. How does this hollow point ammo (if available) hold up on accuracy over longer distances?

 

PP

Edited August 11, 2005 by Mr Pieman

[Devilishdave]

Had my resting heart rate as low as 40BPM when I was extreamly fit and a few years younger. My brother in law has a resting rate of less than 40 but he is a maraton runner so it is all to do with fitness.

 

Dave

[roblade]

In the airi rifle/rimfire debate, is it possible to get hollow point ammo for an air rifle. As it is a legal requirement to use expanding ammunition on live quarry with a rim fire, I presume its the same with air rifles.

Nope not the same, any type of pellet can be used to shoot vermin using an FAC air rifle (as far as im aware!!!!) i think the main reason for that is that the reason for going FAC is to improve the hunting range of the rifle, but using the available hollow point pellets in an airgun, accuracy is effected a lot more. As well as airgun pellets weighing a lot less than a standard rimmie bullet . 25 grains would be a heavy pellet for FAC airguns, most would be happy with about 16.5 garins. have no idea what the average rimmie weighs but have been told about twice that of the airguns.

 

ROB :(

[old rooster]

OR,

 

if your heartbeat is close to 50 you need to see a doctor - you are probably dying :( B)

 

The best you could hope for is to lower your heart rate to near your resting rate - in most adults this is taken between 60 and 70 beats per minute. However, your heart does slow down as you get older though!! I do, however, agree with the sentiment of keeping your breathing and heart rate steady and low if you can.

 

In the airi rifle/rimfire debate, is it possible to get hollow point ammo for an air rifle. As it is a legal requirement to use expanding ammunition on live quarry with a rim fire, I presume its the same with air rifles. Solid pelets don't deform in a predictable manner which is why we can't use solid slugs (not even leasd) through our FAC weapons. How does this hollow point ammo (if available) hold up on accuracy over longer distances?

 

PP

Are you sure it's pigeons you are putting in your pies old bean not mixing a few magic mushrooms with it are you.

 

It's amazing what you can train your body to do, depends if you can be bothered, go and practice breathing and heart rate control and you'll see it can be done.

 

Suppose you are right in saying that i'm dieing, we all are, it's just a matter of time innit B)