What size should i get :S:S :(???

[dunganick]

i know what your both saying, but my point is this, at his age, he is more likely than not in a situation like me, where his old man is paying for his shooting, and is happy to support it if it is of no inconvineance to himself, for this reason 12 would be a good choice, means 1 size of cartridge in the house (granted you might have different loads) however this stops the safety problem which a mix of 12g and 20b produce.

 

i have no problem with 20b, when i used it i broke stuff with it, i found recoil to be no different, and found next to no difference from the 12

 

but this is my point, 12g is generally cheaper, guns are easier to obtain, so are cartridges, the old mans brushes and cleaning kit will be the same, and at the end of this there is precious little difference in the end result, any difference in ability with the cartridge is more likely user than equipment

 

i see what your both saying, and you are both much more experianced than me, maybe the 20b is something i will come around to in time, but for now, i cant see the point in spending more money on cartridges and components, when the end result is no different (say for example the person you know cranfield)

 

i am biast, i dont own one, but hey thats life at least we are giving the young man a good argument to read which after all is what matters, he can make his own mind up from our squables

[bunnybasher100]

the only other thing anyone has forget to mention is that if your looking to shoot on beater days they may not let you on with the semi as it if frowend apon to use them for shooting game, it may just be the safety factor that some people think its hard to so if the gun is unloaded. soz to put another sapnner in the works but its well worth thinking about

[mossy835]

you could allways have a semi auto and use light load to start with.

[potshot]

1st

if you were to look into the workings of a semi to an over under, the complexity of a semi is nowhere near that of a break open gun ,as an example you could compare a petrol engine to a sloppy deisel the later being the semi .

 

2nd

safety issues,please explain to an obvious rookie in shotgunning as to what makes one gun more dangerous than any other, and dont say it wont open angry.gif it ticks me off if the correct training and control is shown and given there is no difference ,please stop differentiating between guns ,they are all designed to shoot, its the missuse that needs fixing not the guns .

 

3rd

 

20 gauge are avery common gun and not as stated by a few as knock you on your *** guns , I have trained many junior shooters on a 20 gauge woman as well none of them complained of recoil bruising or being hit around,start with the right combo and get it right the first time.

 

Thanks but next time read the post as a whole and try reading it - it was about the choice of gun not the mechanics of the gun, which clearly would not affect a learner.

 

1) Safely using a semi in a learning context is more complex.

 

2) same as number 1 - and I never said one gun was more dangerous than another simply one was more complex and therefore go for the simple option a 20b o/u

 

3) I said 20 semi's are not commonplace - I own and use one but found it difficult to buy one that would regularly recycle 24gm cartridges and having failed to locate one on this forum or guntrader bought a new 391.

 

 

Finally it is nice to know that you actually completely agree with me that the 20b is the right choice provided you use the correct cartridges......................

[the last engineer]

did the best i could in reading ,even the joined up bits

glad to see we have differing opinions .

 

still disagree with the semi being the harder to learn with less to do and an easier platform to shoot i fail to see the more difficult senario, i have had many new shooters with double guns and autos training, personaly i find the auto an easier gun to teach with .

 

my apols to you for the obvious mistake on gun saftey (one more than the other)

my interpretation was the semi being labled by many as the most dangerous being its hard to tell if unloaded, i think the auto gets a rough deal in the UK.

 

my understanding is that the 20 gauge is as common back in the uk as is here ,i may be mistaken and if so i doff my cap again :*)

 

in closing yes i do agree ,as posted i spend a lot of time instructing/teaching gun saftey and use ,the clubs 20g's get more use as do all of mine.

 

glad of the differing veiws Potshot, as Nick says thats what make the site worth while , no bridges burnt i hope

 

Martin

[potshot]

No bridges burnt Martin, discussion is healthy - argument isn't...

 

You are right that 20's are popular here - even something of a fashion over the last few years jus like longer barrels - but that's not true in semi's. I wanted a 20b semi to coach with as the grip and foreend is narrower which is better for the fairer sex and youngsters there were dozens of 12s but very few 20's. However personally I do feel uncomfortable coaching, whether truly justifiable or not, with cases and hot powder/gases ejecting just in front of my face.

 

When teaching youngsters I want to teach the whole package with safety first, not just actually hitting targets, which is why my preference is an o/u for novices My mentors taught me that safety is a 'state of mind', an awareness and not just a set of rules. If you think safe you should be safe.

 

And just for Nick - the price of Eley First 28 gm and 24gm is identical so no premium for using light loads - the problem generally is getting your supplier to stock them - so try phoning the cartridge maker and tell them who your normal supplier is...... However it is a shame that the cartridge manufacturers still charge such a premium for 20b when they are now so popular.

Edited October 23, 2005 by potshot

[Maori Haz]

Thanks guys, kind of confusing but that's life, i'll post up if i get anything!

 

But Many thanks to everyone who replied and commented, it has been a great help.

 

MH

[the last engineer]

Potshot , I use a Franchi 20gauge semi (2) for training purposes the reasons are apparent, shorter stock and length of pull, easier gun to hold and control in younger hands, a lighter package inccuring little or no fatiuge, softer recoil on light target loads, being of europeon decent are there any there ?? we (club) picked up both for under $1500.00 (around 700 sterling) .

 

Martin

[potshot]

The new 391 20g complements my Beretta 687 game 20g, a nice short stocked Zabala 20g sbs, a Beretta 686 28g with a much shortened stock (I keep the original stock handy for me to use) and a 12g Miroku Mk38 sporter, So a gun for all seasons,

 

I do have a CPC .410 single barrel which I really should exchange for folding 410 for the really young but somewhat selfishly I like using it for vermin, in particular the grey tree rats, as it takes 3inch magnum's

[the last engineer]

the only Berretas i own are auto's AL391 URIKA 20 GAUGE for her indoors,i keep it busy and dust free, AL391 TEKNYS 12 GAUGE 3" X WOOD , AL 390 sporting ,now sporting a purple finish :*) sorry couldnt help it , i do have an old Berreta O/U 30" FIELD ,rarely use it , Miroku 4 barrel set for skeet ,good teaching set that one 12g 20g 28g .410' a bunch of Browning citoris 325s/425/525 great guns for longevity.

 

i recall an old gun i shot back home years ago, modeled on the colt navy revolver, chambered in .410" i remember a friend bought it and we had a great time droping squirrels ,quite the tool realy those were the days a 36" bolt action Marlin a Savage 5 shot pump and a Biakel .410 poacher gun.

 

 

Martin