Not being taken seriously.

[Jamie_]

Hi all. First post but have been reading the forums for quite a while.

 

Now the topic I am going to raise here is about not being taken seriously when asking for permission and how I can rectify this.

 

First of all a little about my shooting. I am 22 years old and I feel I am a very responsible shooter, I have been shooting air rifles since the age of about 10, I currently use an Air Arms S400 with hawke SR6 optics. I do not own a shotgun/SGC nor do I have FAC. I feel this may actually be part of the problem, the farmers and land owners in my area do not take Air rifles seriously I think they think of them as toys that are not capable of supplying effective pest control. I feel this is unfair as they are perfect for vermin.

 

I currently have one permission, a small commercial greenhouse. This is all very well and good and I feel lucky to actually have somewhere to shoot after not having anywhere except plinking in my garden for quite a number of years, mainly due to losing contact with the lad and his family I used to go shooting with.

 

When I go to ask farmers/landowners I do dress smart/casual I don't turn up with camo etc on. I speak politely and apologize for interupting them but I feel they never take me seriously because all I use is an Air rifle. I have sent letters, I have knocked on doors and I am running out of ideas, I only ever get one answer, No.

 

So I guess what I am asking is how could I improve my chances of getting some more land to shoot on. I don't kow how to make farmers/landowners realise that an Air rifle is more than capable of effective pest control. Should I not mention the fact that I would be using an Air rifle unless they ask?

 

Sorry for the long winded post but I am having trouble trying to get my point across.

 

Cheers for any ideas.

[Wesman]

Get a SGC anyway but you can use the air rifle if you want. It may help you get the foot in the door

[Ozzy Fudd]

When I go to ask farmers/landowners I do dress smart/casual I don't turn up with camo etc on.

 

i always wear camo, etc, when asking for permission, never had a problem - think of it like a job interview, the impression you give matters. i wouldnt walk up to a farmer in his yard wearing a suit, same as i wouldnt go for an interview in an office wearing scuffed combat boots and a dpm jacket. dont dress like rambo, but let the guy see you know what youre talking about

 

we dont have as big a problem over here as air rifles are all held on a fac (even sub 12ftlb) but the impression ive got of some people on here (and i mean no offence to the vast majority of airgun users who arent like this) is that they use air rifles because its less hassle than getting a sgc, etc. could be wrong, but i reckon holding a gun licence shows commitment (by having to jump through hoops all the time), and most farmers want someone who'll be there when they need them, not twice a year when theyre bored, so maybe it would be an idea getting a sgc - even an old single barrel shotgun that can be picked up for £50

 

good luck

Edited March 30, 2010 by Ozzy Fudd

[Jamie_]

It is something I have been thinking about and I have used shotguns in the past. But there is just something about using Air rifles that appeals to me, whether or not its the fact that you have to "stalk" your prey or the fact that you have to be so accurate, I don't know.

 

I will most certainly look into getting SGC though, thanks.

Edited March 30, 2010 by Jamie_

[Jamie_]

i always wear camo, etc, when asking for permission, never had a problem - think of it like a job interview, the impression you give matters. i wouldnt walk up to a farmer in his yard wearing a suit, same as i wouldnt go for an interview in an office wearing scuffed combat boots and a dpm jacket. dont dress like rambo, but let the guy see you know what youre talking about

 

we dont have as big a problem over here as air rifles are all held on a fac (even sub 12ftlb) but the impression ive got of some people on here (and i mean no offence to the vast majority of airgun users who arent like this) is that they use air rifles because its less hassle than getting a sgc, etc. could be wrong, but i reckon holding a gun licence shows commitment (by having to jump through hoops all the time), and most farmers want someone who'll be there when they need them, not twice a year when theyre bored.

 

good luck

 

Thanks for the reply Ozzy. It is something I will bare in my mind, I don't dress overly smartly when visiting a farm normally just jeans, jumper and boots.

 

I also think you are correct about the fact that having a SGC etc does show that you have taken things more seriously as you have outlayed effort on more things than if you just buy a Air rifle.

 

The main reason for me for using an Air rifle is the fact that I enjoy using them more than I do shotguns, I don't know why I just do.

 

Thanks again.

[Ozzy Fudd]

Thanks for the reply Ozzy. It is something I will bare in my mind, I don't dress overly smartly when visiting a farm normally just jeans, jumper and boots.

 

I also think you are correct about the fact that having a SGC etc does show that you have taken things more seriously as you have outlayed effort on more things than if you just buy a Air rifle.

 

The main reason for me for using an Air rifle is the fact that I enjoy using them more than I do shotguns, I don't know why I just do.

 

Thanks again.

 

dont worry mate im not knocking it, everyone has their own preferences all i meant was if you had a sgc it would possibly open up a few more doors for you, as at the mo youre limiting yourself to one type of shooting. one area i shoot on i only got because the farmer had a major problem with crows and needed them cleared from around barns, because of that i also got another place that needed cleared of rabbits, so the 10/22 came in handy

[Jamie_]

I think I am going to apply for SGC next month. Nothing ventured nothing gained, as they say. Cheers.

[stubby]

dont mention air rifles when you ask, just offer to do pest control, although you enjoy the "stalking" with farmers, they are interested in numbers, as the pests are normally eating their wages, a shotgun can account for alot more pests, than an air rifle, in the farmers eyes

[Jamie_]

Oh I agree, a shotgun is a more effectice tool to take out large numbers of vermin. However I do feel that sat under a sitty tree, hidden, with a silenced Air rifle can come up with big bags, not the hundreds that some shotgun users can produce but still big bags.

 

Another thing I have just thought of, I am a labourer/groundworker (currently not working). Do you think it would be worth mentioning this to the farmers? As I would be more than happy to help about the farm in return for a bit of shooting. I currently help the chap that has the greenhouses, planting, tractor driving and doing any other bits and pieces that he wants. Quick edit - That wasn't how I got the permission, more he found out about my recent redundancy and offered me some work.

Edited March 30, 2010 by Jamie_

[Ozzy Fudd]

why not do it the other way around then - look for work from farmers, then once your in mention shooting...

[Browning]

Jamie where in South Warwickshire are you?

 

I know a keeper who would possibly be willing to let you have some vermin shooting if you're sensible and safe....and willing

to put in a few hours helping out on work parties during the off season, and beating during the season.....

 

PM me if you're interested.

[Jamie_]

Ozzy I like your thinking, something I will be trying as it is a busy time of year for them.

 

Browning I have sent you a PM, thank you very much for the offer.

[ross16689]

Do you have insurance? Just a thought that its always a good thing to mention, most places prefer it these days.

[Jamie_]

Currently in the process of renewing it. Undecided as to go with BASC, BASA or the countryside alliance. I know BASC is the most comprehensive and does the most for the sport but seeing as I am currently unemployed (hate saying that!) the other two are quite appealing especially the CA, as they do a discount for under 25's.

[ross16689]

Currently in the process of renewing it. Undecided as to go with BASC, BASA or the countryside alliance. I know BASC is the most comprehensive and does the most for the sport but seeing as I am currently unemployed (hate saying that!) the other two are quite appealing especially the CA, as they do a discount for under 25's.

 

I wouldn't worry about it too much- but the basc is probably the most widely recognised amongst farmers, at least te ones I know. Are you a member of young farmers? Thats probably got to be one of the easiest ways to get permission, they made a £70 million loss last year so are desperate for new members at the moment! Always worth a try.

[HDAV]

Jamie i am no expert i only shoot clays but from what i have read it seems farmers and the farming community are a bit wary of new faces especially when it comes to access to land and its probably only gotten worse with the "staffordshire hoard".

 

There are lots of tips on how to approach farmers avoid meal times, be polite and courteous and accept the knock backs with good humour. Local farming pubs and feed merchants are worth a shot as well farms directly I would suggest having an SGC may help you wouldn't need to buy a gun but having the cert does prove to an extent your safe etc as you have the cert. Your FEO may be able to suggest some avenues to try they may know farmers in need of control as they check and certify the land locally for FAC use so may know of land deemed unsuitable for FAC which would ideal for Air. As you have useful skills it worth offering to assist with labour for general duties especially as things get busier heading into spring.

 

http://www.meridenyfc.co.uk/index.php might be worth a look.

 

If you hold any plant qualifications that could be a good in (or if not try and get some while out of work) hope that helps and you find a job soon

[Jamie_]

I wouldn't worry about it too much- but the basc is probably the most widely recognised amongst farmers, at least te ones I know. Are you a member of young farmers? Thats probably got to be one of the easiest ways to get permission, they made a £70 million loss last year so are desperate for new members at the moment! Always worth a try.

 

Yeah after doing some more research I think I may go with BASC again, as you say it is the most recognized. I am not a member of young farmers but that was something myself and a friend discussed, I went to school in a very rural area and ALOT of the people I went with were/are young farmers. Somthing to definitely think about.

 

 

Jamie i am no expert i only shoot clays but from what i have read it seems farmers and the farming community are a bit wary of new faces especially when it comes to access to land and its probably only gotten worse with the "staffordshire hoard".

 

There are lots of tips on how to approach farmers avoid meal times, be polite and courteous and accept the knock backs with good humour. Local farming pubs and feed merchants are worth a shot as well farms directly I would suggest having an SGC may help you wouldn't need to buy a gun but having the cert does prove to an extent your safe etc as you have the cert. Your FEO may be able to suggest some avenues to try they may know farmers in need of control as they check and certify the land locally for FAC use so may know of land deemed unsuitable for FAC which would ideal for Air. As you have useful skills it worth offering to assist with labour for general duties especially as things get busier heading into spring.

 

http://www.meridenyfc.co.uk/index.php might be worth a look.

 

If you hold any plant qualifications that could be a good in (or if not try and get some while out of work) hope that helps and you find a job soon

 

I think you are 100% right about people being wary and rightly so. I wouldn't want someone walking around my land without me knowing and trusting them and trust is something that needs to be built over time, not just when knocking on someones door.

 

I remember one of the first farms I knocked on he told me that he didn't need anyone as he had a group of lads already but he gave me some tips about asking for permission and they seem to be that same that have been posted on this board and many others. All well worth knowing.

 

I will remember all that you have said about the FEO when shotgun time comes around (when I find work) Thanks very much for all the advise, it is much appreciated.

 

 

 

Thanks again all that have contributed.

[salukiwhippet]

There are other methods of pest control that don't need a ticket....snares, traps. ferrets....I've found ferreting permission the easiest of all to get. Maybe worth considering. Whereabouts in South Warks are you? Might not be too far from me, happy to help if I can. I help run a little shoot and am a self employed wildlife manager.

 

James

[Jamie_]

Hi James. I am just outside of Stratford upon Avon. This morning I have recieved some fantastic news. Permission to shoot on a very large golf course. I e-mailed them along time ago and have just had an e-mail back so there rabbit problem must be getting a little to much. Just got to have a meeting with the owners and hopefully it will be sorted.

[salukiwhippet]

Well done chap! PM sent!

 

 

James

[vulpicide]

Try a differrent approach ask if they need a hand with feral pigeons or rats in the sheds/barns tell them that is what you are concentrating on to build up some goodwill with farmers up here its a bit easier because we can clear starlings as well (Scotland) Mikey and his dad help us out we do foxes and pigeons they do ferals and rats/rabbits.

[Jamie_]

Thats a good idea and one I will be trying. For the minute I am going to concentrate on this new golf course permission and see if I can impress there. Cheers.

[Jamie_]

Just a quick update on this for anyone who may be interested. I have been shooting on the Golf course most evenings now and have been told that I am doing a very good job and that they would like me to turn my attention to the foxes that are causing a problem with some of the waterfowl that live and breed on the lakes and in general being a nuiscance by digging up bunkers etc. Which means they want me to apply for FAC!

 

It is something I am considering but feel it maybe to soon? I have been shooting for 12 years but theres something about owning a FAC rifle that I am unsure about.

 

Oh, and I am also employed again.

[albob]

if you can get someone with an open ticket,to come and help and show you the ropes with fac rifles,then this will be a way forward for you.

you will learn a lot and that person may even help you get your ticket without possible mentoring.

nothing to lose but,plenty to gain.

 

al

[Ozzy Fudd]

congrats! its never too soon to get an fac might be an idea to get someone to go out with you a few times and show you the ropes, even if they dont bring a gun it can be useful having someone take a look and pointing out safe shots, etc