Northern Ireland - section 1 shotgun?

[Ozzy Fudd]

Ozzy I am not anti fun when it comes to shooting. Quite the contrary in fact. There's nothing I would love more than an armoury full to busting filled with every conceivable weapon known to man (except rugers) lol. This thread has gotten a little side tracked, but I for one cannot understand the restrictions on shotguns. I understand the theory behind the restrictions, but if a crime was to be committed it only takes one round to do the damage. How long does it take to reload a semi anyway?

 

I would be interested in knowing if you have any luck in sourcing and aquiring a Section 1 shottie, because PSG is something I'd love to do on a frequent basis. It's just unfortunate that it's a terribly underadvertised division of shooting sports over here.

 

dammit i like rugers ive found section 1's on guntrader, benelli m3's, shouldnt be too hard to get them shipped over here to an rfd, just pay the extra charge

 

Ozzy, I know for certain of a guy with a section 1 semi auto in NI (I shot with it about 10 years

ago). I'm _fairly_ sure he's still got it and as far as I know he's never shot PSG.

 

 

Nial.

 

thanks nial

 

i think guys you`ll find i`m not as ignorant to practical shooting as you think.again sorry for my sensible and safe attitude to firearms and the responsibility that comes with it i wonder how some of the threads on here are perceived by the antis and the psni if they do frequent this forum. surely a more mature attitude should be taken?? babby as for the hi capacity shotgun,you will get one for vermin control if you ask for it so no need for joining psg clubs. just ask and knock yourself out.

 

when it comes to a sensible and safe attitude to firearms i agree with you 100%, however i do think we should be allowed to have a laugh and a wind up on here without fear of being seen as unsafe

 

 

right heres the situation. i didnt want to come right out and say this until i'd looked into it all and decided on it 100%, but to alleviate any doubts or suspicions from anyone i will. im not much of a game shooter, neither are most of my shooting friends, were usually pest control and the odd day on the clays. winter time for us gets quiet, so ive been thinking of taking up psg as something to do; last winter i was going to go for it but i bought a 17hmr instead ive been saving up since then and im now starting to look into psg again; i can probably muddle through with one of the mossbergs until i manage to get a section 1 shotgun on my licence, thats why ive been asking a few things lately - like how many dual mode shotgun makes are there, do you have to do the ukpsa safety course before becoming a member, and finally if many people have a section 1 shotgun. tbh if it was only for vermin i wouldnt worry about it too much, the guns i have do the job, and i couldnt be bothered with the extra paperwork (and feo interrogations) that would go hand in hand with it just for an extra few shots

[neil smith]

i think guys you`ll find i`m not as ignorant to practical shooting as you think.again sorry for my sensible and safe attitude to firearms and the responsibility that comes with it i wonder how some of the threads on here are perceived by the antis and the psni if they do frequent this forum. surely a more mature attitude should be taken?? babby as for the hi capacity shotgun,you will get one for vermin control if you ask for it so no need for joining psg clubs. just ask and knock yourself out.

 

Hi tweedledee

 

Believe me when I say I'm not looking for a confrontation, I would like a sensible conversation, arguments serve no purpose & do not advance shooting sport.

Ozzy clearly asked about a S1 shotgun for PSG.

 

I would like to get some clarification, you say you have some experience with practical shooting, was that through UKPSA/IPSC or with a club that was unregulated or unsanctioned making up its own rules ?

 

If it was with IPSC you will be aware that safety is the primary concern in all aspects of the sport & why all competitors take a safety course prior to competing, something you don't have to do when game or vermin shooting, so you can see our attitude to safety is a very responsible one by comparison,

IPSC shooting has grown into a sport shot in 86 countries worldwide, its all timed against the clock & is great fun to shoot, no cammo, no wannabes, no rambo types, its simply a speed shooting sport.

 

As for the psni the UKPSA has very good relations with them & many of our members are serving police officers, also the UKPSA holds a charity PSG shoot for the disabled police officers association of NI every year in mid April.

 

To suggest he should "just ask for one" and then "knock yourself out" is not what I would consider a sensible, safe, responsible, or mature attitude & im sure any "anti" would agree, I would appreciate a clarification of your thinking with regard to that point ?

 

From your comments I can only assume you disaprove of IPSC shotgun shooting & only wish to promote the vermin option for a S1 grant, why should he not persue a safe sport which requires some safety training before he enters ?

 

IPSC sanctions & regulates, national, continental & world championship matches all done with a perfect safety record, something other branches of the shooting sports cannot claim.

 

Regards

N

[tweedledee]

Hi tweedledee

 

Believe me when I say I'm not looking for a confrontation, I would like a sensible conversation, arguments serve no purpose & do not advance shooting sport.

Ozzy clearly asked about a S1 shotgun for PSG.

 

I would like to get some clarification, you say you have some experience with practical shooting, was that through UKPSA/IPSC or with a club that was unregulated or unsanctioned making up its own rules ?

 

If it was with IPSC you will be aware that safety is the primary concern in all aspects of the sport & why all competitors take a safety course prior to competing, something you don't have to do when game or vermin shooting, so you can see our attitude to safety is a very responsible one by comparison,

IPSC shooting has grown into a sport shot in 86 countries worldwide, its all timed against the clock & is great fun to shoot, no cammo, no wannabes, no rambo types, its simply a speed shooting sport.

 

As for the psni the UKPSA has very good relations with them & many of our members are serving police officers, also the UKPSA holds a charity PSG shoot for the disabled police officers association of NI every year in mid April.

 

To suggest he should "just ask for one" and then "knock yourself out" is not what I would consider a sensible, safe, responsible, or mature attitude & im sure any "anti" would agree, I would appreciate a clarification of your thinking with regard to that point ?

 

From your comments I can only assume you disaprove of IPSC shotgun shooting & only wish to promote the vermin option for a S1 grant, why should he not persue a safe sport which requires some safety training before he enters ?

 

IPSC sanctions & regulates, national, continental & world championship matches all done with a perfect safety record, something other branches of the shooting sports cannot claim.

 

Regards

N

 

 

answer by pm mate

[neil smith]

like how many dual mode shotgun makes are there, do you have to do the ukpsa safety course before becoming a member

 

 

Ozzy

 

When considering your options it is always worth taking into account just how far you may wish to go in pursuit of the sport, believe me when I say its very addictive & other types of shooting will seem boring after.

 

You can take the UKPSA safety course without joining the association, all are welcome, you would need to use a S2 gun though.

 

The course covers many aspects of the sport, predominantly safety but also includes sections on gun choice & associated equipment & methods of use, in the videos I posted earlier you will notice each one shows a different loading method & the pro's & con's of each are also discussed on the course, along with lots of other helpful bits of information that will help you prepare better for a match.

 

IPSC splits competitors into "Divisions" depending on your gun type....

 

There is...

Standard Manual (Pump Guns)

Standard (Semi-auto)

Modified (barrel compensators allowed + some other modifications & an increased magazine capacity over standard division)

Open (Red dot sights & box mag guns like the saiga 12)

 

That is a very simple outline of how things are split, there are some other points but I wont go into them now.

As I said be sure to consider how far you may wish to go with it, if you dont intend to compete at an international match then gun choice is not that important & you can press anything into service & still have fun, if however you want to join many of us shooting across europe each year then you need a gun that can keep up with best out there.

 

To help here is a guide to what the top IPSC champion shooter are using, it may save you money in the long run to buy the right gun first time, the top guys are using these guns for a reason.

 

In Standard Manual the Benelli nova & Supernova rule without exception.

 

In Standard the Benelli M1 & M2 are top & are way more reliable & lighter than the M3 which is prone to stoppages, easy to clear but will cost you time.

 

Modified is again the domain of the M1 & M2 but the Russian guys do well with their Baikals

 

Open is now the domain of the Saiga 12 & Melot, it used to be the Benelli M1 using the speed loading sticks but the magazine fed guns now dominate.

 

Hope that helps you.

N

[Ozzy Fudd]

Ozzy

 

When considering your options it is always worth taking into account just how far you may wish to go in pursuit of the sport, believe me when I say its very addictive & other types of shooting will seem boring after.

 

You can take the UKPSA safety course without joining the association, all are welcome, you would need to use a S2 gun though.

 

The course covers many aspects of the sport, predominantly safety but also includes sections on gun choice & associated equipment & methods of use, in the videos I posted earlier you will notice each one shows a different loading method & the pro's & con's of each are also discussed on the course, along with lots of other helpful bits of information that will help you prepare better for a match.

 

IPSC splits competitors into "Divisions" depending on your gun type....

 

There is...

Standard Manual (Pump Guns)

Standard (Semi-auto)

Modified (barrel compensators allowed + some other modifications & an increased magazine capacity over standard division)

Open (Red dot sights & box mag guns like the saiga 12)

 

That is a very simple outline of how things are split, there are some other points but I wont go into them now.

As I said be sure to consider how far you may wish to go with it, if you dont intend to compete at an international match then gun choice is not that important & you can press anything into service & still have fun, if however you want to join many of us shooting across europe each year then you need a gun that can keep up with best out there.

 

To help here is a guide to what the top IPSC champion shooter are using, it may save you money in the long run to buy the right gun first time, the top guys are using these guns for a reason.

 

In Standard Manual the Benelli nova & Supernova rule without exception.

 

In Standard the Benelli M1 & M2 are top & are way more reliable & lighter than the M3 which is prone to stoppages, easy to clear but will cost you time.

 

Modified is again the domain of the M1 & M2 but the Russian guys do well with their Baikals

 

Open is now the domain of the Saiga 12 & Melot, it used to be the Benelli M1 using the speed loading sticks but the magazine fed guns now dominate.

 

Hope that helps you.

N

 

 

thanks neil, it definitely does. im really sorry for you having to post on this so much, it wasnt my intention to open a can of worms or a general discusssion on psg i was hoping to make a few subtle enquiries (like i did here and here) and look into everything a great deal more before i make any decisions and started threads - as you said im not sure how far i want to go in the sport, but i think ill definitely be doing the safety test

 

as for the gun i like the look of the m3, plus i reckoned with dual mode it would mean i could enter standard manual and standard comps (could be wrong); then again i havnt got my hands on one yet to try it out so cant say for sure - though i am tempted to get a tricked out mossberg 500 just to prove the nova's arent the best....

 

[neil smith]

as for the gun i like the look of the m3, plus i reckoned with dual mode it would mean i could enter standard manual and standard comps (could be wrong); then again i havnt got my hands on one yet to try it out so cant say for sure - though i am tempted to get a tricked out mossberg 500 just to prove the nova's arent the best....

 

Ozzy

 

No problem, if you like the M3 then go for it, you wont be able to enter it in standard manual division however, only in standard where the lighter M2 usually gives faster handling & loading.

 

As regards the pump gun a mossberg is OK for psg, not sure what you mean by tricked out but the gun needs to hold at least 9 or you will be giving away a big advantage to the competition, the Benelli pumps tend to win simply because they have a huge loading port & the fast guys load two shells at a time or 4 from the shell caddies like the method shown in Robs video I posted.

 

If we all liked the same stuff it would be boring, I could also have saved myself a fortune & a lot of variations if I had found out what works best before I purchased all my guns which is all im trying to do for you here.

 

You are of course free to do your own learning

 

ATB

 

N

[Ozzy Fudd]

Ozzy

 

No problem, if you like the M3 then go for it, you wont be able to enter it in standard manual division however, only in standard where the lighter M2 usually gives faster handling & loading.

 

As regards the pump gun a mossberg is OK for psg, not sure what you mean by tricked out but the gun needs to hold at least 9 or you will be giving away a big advantage to the competition, the Benelli pumps tend to win simply because they have a huge loading port & the fast guys load two shells at a time or 4 from the shell caddies like the method shown in Robs video I posted.

 

If we all liked the same stuff it would be boring, I could also have saved myself a fortune & a lot of variations if I had found out what works best before I purchased all my guns which is all im trying to do for you here.

 

You are of course free to do your own learning

 

ATB

 

N

 

 

dont worry mate im just messing, i remember talking to you before about my dislike of the benelli nova's as for the m3, thats the perfect example why i wanted to keep this all quiet til i checked everything out, oh well!

[Pastiebap]

Right, off the top of my head;

 

The current restrictions on magazine size are I believe a hangover from wildlife legislation (local and european I think), anyway, it is designed to give birds a "chance".

 

To get a shotgun that would be "unrestricted" you need to be in a gun club that shoots practical shotgun or "western" shotgun, the club must be affiliated to one of the recognised associations that shoots these disciplines, I think the associations are listed in the "guidance" notes (which also contain the appendicies and conditions not specified directly in NI Order). Like rifles and pistols, you must serve a probationary period of 12 months in the club and shoot the discipline using club guns, before your club secretary can sign you off (for your good reason) for an unrestriced shotgun.

 

And I would advise your mates to get their firearms restricted (or at least keep mum). If caught out FEB will direct guns to be seized, and FAC's revoked. And the PPS are starting to prosecute more firearms offences, even when PSNI recommend no further action or caution.

[Ozzy Fudd]

Right, off the top of my head;

 

The current restrictions on magazine size are I believe a hangover from wildlife legislation (local and european I think), anyway, it is designed to give birds a "chance".

 

To get a shotgun that would be "unrestricted" you need to be in a gun club that shoots practical shotgun or "western" shotgun, the club must be affiliated to one of the recognised associations that shoots these disciplines, I think the associations are listed in the "guidance" notes (which also contain the appendicies and conditions not specified directly in NI Order). Like rifles and pistols, you must serve a probationary period of 12 months in the club and shoot the discipline using club guns, before your club secretary can sign you off (for your good reason) for an unrestriced shotgun.

 

And I would advise your mates to get their firearms restricted (or at least keep mum). If caught out FEB will direct guns to be seized, and FAC's revoked. And the PPS are starting to prosecute more firearms offences, even when PSNI recommend no further action or caution.

 

thanks mate, very helpful info

 

as for the guns, myself and anyone i know who buys a semi/pump always checks theyre restricted (just incase), especially with 2nd hand guns - its not worth the hassel if theyre not right