stuey Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Evening all, Just started stalking and in the process of applying for my FAC. Although Roe will be my main quarry, I'm unsure/having doubts about the calibre to choose. Is their a claibre that is suitable for foxes right through the full range of deer? I will mainly be shooting Roe and probably foxes so this would be the rifles main purpose, but just wondering if there is calibre that would go right up to Reds? Or would 2 rifles be the way to go? regards Stu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auto culto Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 .243 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tulkyuk Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Same as Auto says, but might not be manly enough for a long range shot on Reds - 6.5 would be the way to go me thinks , if your just gonna have 1 rifle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagleman Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 The Guidance to Police re calibre and quarry options will allow fox and deer on .243 but some Licencing Authorities will start to object for calibres over .243 for fox to be anything other than "opportunistic" which means that if you see one while out hunting deer you can shoot it but that you can't go out "foxing". For example, I have this condition with my .270 which I did get intentionally as a "one deer rifle" which will take any deer even at range. I know several people who shoot more foxes than deer and prefer .243 as a compromise calibre which will put down even red deer ok given moderate range and yet is also accepted as an everyday fox rifle. I think it a pity that the new deer regulations didn't allow .223 for Roe (as in Scotland) which means that .243 remains the main compromise calibre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flytie Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 Try this; http://www.basc.org.uk/ then hit the advice and guidance icon/button thingy on the left hand side of the picture. Then click firearms law. On the little page counter on the tool bar put in 82, press enter and you will come to the Home office guidance on quarry and calibres. Scroll down on the fox column and you will find the calibres they allow plus this "(see also paragraph 13.23)". THIS IS CRITICAL!!!!!!!! Go to chapter 13, paragraph 23 and it will tell you that 6.5 x 55 is allowed for fox too. There is all sorts of good stuff on there that you might as well inform yourself of before they start telling you what you can and can't have. 6.5 x 55 is the calibre I have chosen. ft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuey Posted November 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 Thanks FT, that was very helpful. Think I'll print off a copy at work tomorrow and ring bind it for future reference. regards Stu p.s. what make have you gone for in the 6.5 x 55 calibre? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popgun Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 .270 for everything i'ts a death ray Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flytie Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 Thanks FT, that was very helpful. Think I'll print off a copy at work tomorrow and ring bind it for future reference. regards Stu p.s. what make have you gone for in the 6.5 x 55 calibre? Stu, I have had a real dither over it. Started off thinking along the tikka line, then due to some adverse stuff I read and heard I started looking at other makes. I have been offered a mint Steyr classic half stock with a 6 x 42 S&B for very sensible money. As I am still awaiting my FAC it is not yet a decision I have had to make. I am leaning towards one of the Steyr's. I am very tempted by the 20" barrelled Mountain (handy for my high seat), as at the ranges I will shoot I do not think that the drop in ballistic performance and accuracy would be noticeable. But when push comes to shove I will probably go for the nice wood one, as I'm a sucker for a nice bit of timber I just never learn ft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flytie Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 .270 for everything i'ts a death ray Sorry, you'll have to speak up as a nasty noisy .270 nearlly deafened me, and mind my sore shoulder while your at it ft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagleman Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 .270 for everything i'ts a death ray Sorry, you'll have to speak up as a nasty noisy .270 nearlly deafened me, and mind my sore shoulder while your at it ft No! What a bunch of wussies! I admit that without a moderator it is loud (but so are all of 'em) and I admit that it jumps a bit but it isn't that bad. Last range day I did I shot 60 off before lunch and no bad shoulder effects at all. Not even a mark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilishdave Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 I would go for .243, .243AI or 25,06 bearing in mind you want the rifle specific for fox. Under home office gude lines the largest call that will be granted specificaly for fox is 6.5 and only in areas that tend to be perticularly windy. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 I'd ask for 6.5x55 (I just have!). It covers most jobs pretty well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flytie Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 I would go for .243, .243AI or 25,06 bearing in mind you want the rifle specific for fox. Under home office gude lines the largest call that will be granted specificaly for fox is 6.5 and only in areas that tend to be perticularly windy. Dave Dave, I believe he said, "Just started stalking and in the process of applying for my FAC. Although Roe will be my main quarry, I'm unsure/having doubts about the calibre to choose. Is their a claibre that is suitable for foxes right through the full range of deer? I will mainly be shooting Roe and probably foxes so this would be the rifles main purpose, but just wondering if there is calibre that would go right up to Reds? Or would 2 rifles be the way to go?" And the guidelines state, "In windy areas, where heavier bullets aid accurate shooting, or if applicants wish to use one rifle for shooting both deer and foxes they may choose a rifle in 6mm (.243/.244) or 6.5mm (.264) calibre". ft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilishdave Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 I would go for .243, .243AI or 25,06 bearing in mind you want the rifle specific for fox. Under home office gude lines the largest call that will be granted specificaly for fox is 6.5 and only in areas that tend to be perticularly windy. Dave Dave, I believe he said, "Just started stalking and in the process of applying for my FAC. Although Roe will be my main quarry, I'm unsure/having doubts about the calibre to choose. Is their a claibre that is suitable for foxes right through the full range of deer? I will mainly be shooting Roe and probably foxes so this would be the rifles main purpose, but just wondering if there is calibre that would go right up to Reds? Or would 2 rifles be the way to go?" And the guidelines state, "In windy areas, where heavier bullets aid accurate shooting, or if applicants wish to use one rifle for shooting both deer and foxes they may choose a rifle in 6mm (.243/.244) or 6.5mm (.264) calibre". ft. Flyte, You have completely confused me I have read his post again and can't for the life of me find the last paragraph that you are quoting!! The point I am making is if you want fox a specific on your cert rather than just fox whilst stalking deer then generaly it has to be 6.5 or less. In other words you would not be able to go lamping in England with anything bigger than 6.5 because you would have no legal business being out after deer one hour after sunset or one hour after sunrise. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 6.5x55 its common, its deadly accurate, its easy to get cheap/good ammo, its easy to reload, its got enough 'power' to take down reds at sensible ranges, yet is an excellent vermin calibre. I am working towards getting on cleared for vermin, fox, deer all as seperate conditions. Silence it and get it in a sako 75 and you have the perfect british sporting rifle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oly Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 .243 makes enough mess of foxes. 6.5x55 must make one hell of a mess :unsure: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 not as bad as you might think, our 243 makes more of a mess than 6.5, either way they were killed humainly :unsure: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oly Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 either way they were killed humainly :unsure: I'm not doubting that! Personally I prefer the 55gn ballistic tip for foxes and then up to 105gn for deer - which you get from the .243Win. Whereas the 6.5x55 only starts at ~100gn doesn't it? That said the 55gn of a 243 is around 1200m/s whereas the 100gn of a 6.5x55 is around 750m/s ! Although the 6.5x55's penetration will be much better...you just have to be more careful with shot placement with a .243! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 we use 95grain b/tips in the 6.5 as its mainly a foxing gun, and secondly a stalking gun. The 243 uses 87grain b/tips, again its mainly a foxing gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flytie Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 either way they were killed humainly :unsure: I'm not doubting that! Personally I prefer the 55gn ballistic tip for foxes and then up to 105gn for deer - which you get from the .243Win. Whereas the 6.5x55 only starts at ~100gn doesn't it? That said the 55gn of a 243 is around 1200m/s whereas the 100gn of a 6.5x55 is around 750m/s ! Although the 6.5x55's penetration will be much better...you just have to be more careful with shot placement with a .243! Oly, 6.5 can be loaded from at least 77gn to 160gn, 2725fps to 2450fps. A much wider range than the 243 which is prone to damage the carcass of deer. Cowdray prefer you not to use your .243 because they sell their venison on. You damage it, you buy it is their motto. Dave, "Although Roe will be my main quarry, I'm unsure/having doubts about the calibre to choose. Is their a claibre that is suitable for foxes right through the full range of deer? ". Roe being his main quarry! One rifle for many purposes is I believe his criteria, hence the 6.5 which is legal for deer too! ft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkield Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 It seems to be a common misconception that bigger slower rounds make a mess of things, when in fact the complete opposite is true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oly Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 6.5 can be loaded from at least 77gn to 160gn, 2725fps to 2450fps. That's good to know, cheers mate :unsure: Who does the 77gn out of interest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flytie Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 6.5 can be loaded from at least 77gn to 160gn, 2725fps to 2450fps. That's good to know, cheers mate :unsure: Who does the 77gn out of interest? Oly, i took the data from the info published by the Deer Commision for Scotland which is in the DSC1 handbook (77gn) and from a friend who uses the calibre but loads his own (160gn). I will have a look on the web and see what i can find for you. ft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oly Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 Cheers ft, had a look myself, but couldn't find anything. :unsure: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flytie Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 Cheers ft, had a look myself, but couldn't find anything. :unsure: Oly, here's one link; http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/guns/152560/Sa...nter_rifle.html I will keep trolling. ft here's another; http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp 77gn Nosler, 120gn Speer, 139gn Nosler and 140gn everyone seems to make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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