Fellside
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Posts posted by Fellside
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30 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:
I'd guess you'd know from the thickness of the thing, yes. Length is about right but for sure for dapping brown lake trout there'd be no need for the thing to be double built, steel cored or similarly thick. The only other thing I'd think is for dedicated roll casting or Spey casting? The late Terry Thomas would have known!
Those beasts were used for spey casting on big rivers like the Ness and Tay. 20ft wasn’t unknown. Shooting any line was very limited, so practically the whole length of level-line to be cast was airborne. The common practice of ‘mending’ also called for a long rod.
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6 hours ago, Blackpowder said:
I can say it is exciting, especially if you are 15 years old and this is your first ever salmon on the first ever outing with a new rod. I do it think that greenheart rod was made by Forrest, in fact it did not carry a makers name. Drew once told me that Forrest greenheart rod's blanks were split off the log with wedges ensuring that the grain was followed all the way, whereas this would not be the case if the blank was sawn off.
Blackpowder
Marvellous! Great to hear of your first salmon on greenheart.
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37 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:
It must be our age!
I don’t have them carried for me yet….😄
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Yes I too use the hard travelling cases - very useful.
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9 minutes ago, Blackpowder said:
Forrests was like an Alladins Cave when still at school I visited to make my modest purchases of worm hooks , a dozen flies and a few yards of nylon. Then it was owned by Andrew (Drew) Porteous a nephew of the Forrest family. Drew came from Coldstream and was assisted by Bill Anderson who had worked alongside him in a previous employment. Even as a boy I was always treated with great courtesy in the shop even although my purchases were modest, later as a wage earner all my tackle would be from Forrest. After Drew's untimely death I think Bill Anderson ran the shop for a while prior to Dickson ownership.
Greenheart was still a rod making material in the 1950s. In April 1957 Drew dropped of a 10ft 6in greenheart road at my house. Straight to the river where the first fish on it was a illicit 7pound salmon.
Blackpowder
Fond memories for us both - although mine were mainly the latter Dickson’s phase. Interesting that you had a greenheart rod made in 1957 - the main era for split cane. There were a few who still liked them and had them made - even though the text books tell us that they fizzled out in the early 1900s. I have come across a few of these later examples - usually with brass ferrules rather than the spliced type. I never dared fish with them, as they were dry as a bone. More pub wall memorabilia than anything else. I’ve often wondered what it would be like to play a fish on one….?
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3 hours ago, Old Boggy said:
I did research the owner of the gun (Mr.N.Gratton Doyle) and found that he was Conservative MP for Newcastle.
OB
How fascinating. I think in those days, MPs predominantly made their money then went in to politics afterwards. It would be interesting to know what business he was in. Coal merchant…?
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14 minutes ago, Shadowchaser said:
Beretta have started to supply their semi -autos (not sure about O/U and SxS) with cardboard boxes rather than a plastic carry case.
Budget guns have been coming like this for years. Many have a moulded polystyrene inside which fits the gun and all the bits in. The Beretta box I have just received is all cardboard.
This isn't a complaint - for the most part the cases sit in the loft until such time you come to trade the gun in.
I was wondering if it's worth keeping the box (as I do the plastic cases) so that if or when I sell the gun it comes as it did originally.
What are you folks doing?
I bought a Yildiz 410 with packaging as you describe. I only kept the box in case the gun developed a fault and needed returning. The gun has been great so the box got binned after a couple of months.
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While inflation/income are the main determinants, there are other factors which can skew our figures. For example in 1906 the average house price was only 3 x salary….!! Also, while most goods were more affordable, food was disproportionately more expensive than today. A lot to consider. However, comparing like with like as enfieldspares has done, and using the inflation/income approach, we can achieve reasonably accurate figures.
As mentioned however £ value is only one aspect. If it’s a joy to use, that is perhaps the gun’s real value.
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57 minutes ago, Old Boggy said:
The attached information obtained from the current owner of the Pape records shows that the gun was finished in 1901 and sold in 1906 for £36-10s-0d. Not sure what the figures under left and right refer to but assume that it was the number of shot within a 30 inch circle for each barrel.
Also, not sure why the `pellet count` if that`s what it is came out several times. That`s my technophobia kicking in again I`m afraid.
Hopefully someone can tell me what £36/10s would be worth today. I think £1 then would be worth about £100 now, so on that basis the gun would cost £3600. Not sure if that is right though.
OB
This is a bit geeky I know, but I’ve run the figures re what the gun would cost in equivalent average salary today. It works out at just over £26,628.
The average income back then was only £42.70 (per National Archive), so easy to do the maths relative to the current average.
In summary, it would have been quite a well off person who originally bought your gun.
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25 minutes ago, clangerman said:
facts are thin on the ground but one consumers won’t miss is our now trying to blame them by claiming they asked for steel so there will be even less sales pretty ironic
I respectfully disagree. The average consumer has no clue re the steel/lead issue. They are too busy worrying about the Russia situation, the cost of living and fuel costs. Some will be more concerned about what their favourite trash celebs are up to. For the most part, what kind of shot people kill birds with, won’t even register.
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Both very fine indeed. I would love to own a classic old gun. However, if the truth be known, I shoot terribly with a sxs. No idea why, just do…..?!
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11 hours ago, enfieldspares said:
When my father died my brother got all his tackle and I don't think ever cast with a single of his salmon rods ever. Not from sentiment but from having little actual interest in that type of salmon fishing. I've no idea where they all went to...the salmon rods...but they were never used (in this family) again. The trout rods were used by my brother but the salmon rods never.
Such is the way of life. Sad when it all has to go somewhere else. You probably wouldn’t want to fish with the salmon rods anyway. The trout outfits could be pleasant enough on small streams - if that might be possible. I know a few people who like the ‘feel’ of light kane rods.
Just now, Fellside said:Such is the way of life. Sad when it all has to go somewhere else. You probably wouldn’t want to fish with the salmon rods anyway. The trout outfits could be pleasant enough on small streams - if that might be possible. I know a few people who like the ‘feel’ of light kane rods.
Meant ‘cane’
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Just now, Fellside said:
Sorry - I also meant to reply to enfieldspares. I have tried those big old rods. I actually bought a Hardy Palakona a few years ago. Actually ended catching a salmon with it, but didn’t enjoy the casting at all. I sent it to auction after only one day out with it - and went straight back to my carbon comfort zone.
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47 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:
Yes. My late father's Hardy and Foster's of Asbourne cane trout and salmon rods looked joyous. But were heavy, eventually, took a "set" and in truth carbon fibre (which he never used he died in 1987) were far around
2 hours ago, billytheghillie said:Eric Black was the last man to run Forrests.
I remember him - he sold me a nice shooting jacket.
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7 minutes ago, ditchman said:
no i havnt...i have cleaned them rewhipped the eyes and laquered them........i red somewhere before the fishing season started the rods were "put up"...the older green hearts were whipped together ..and they were left in the stables to draw moisture into them prior to being used.......
the salmon rods are utter beasts...
Spey casting a greenheart salmon rod is heavy toil. I don’t know how they did a week on the Tweed with one…!
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2 hours ago, ditchman said:
these are the old forrest rods
I thought they would have been split cane, but they appear to be greenheart, which makes them very old. Most greenheart rods were made in the nineteenth century, so a nice piece of history. I like the reels particularly. Have you fished with them?
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19 minutes ago, ditchman said:
i have a complete collection of forrest&son salmon and trout rods for male and female.........posted some pics up on PW a few years ago
i think Hardy ventured into guns as well
They will be lovely old rods to fish with. Watch out for them getting too dry though. Yes Hardy’s sold game guns - I was told by a chap in Hardy’s they were made by Armstrong’s. They had one displayed in their Alnwick museum until a few years ago.
The Scottish Herald reported in 2005 that the famous Forest’s, “trading since 1837 etc.. had been rescued and was to continue in Kelso.” I remember that reincarnation, but it sadly went the way of most high street tackle and gun shops a few years later.
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10 minutes ago, ditchman said:
are they the same forrest and sons kelso ...that used to make bepoke salmon and trout tackle ?
Yes they are the same. I remember going in to their shop as a boy. By then it was more fishing than shooting really. It was like Aladdin’s cave to me.
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15 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:
It ought to come with a single perforated hole in the top left corner. As it's little all else purpose I fear. Lost its way long ago.
😄 👍
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51 minutes ago, Penelope said:
Yes, but Willock, Humphreys, BB et al, have all passed on.
Yes I used to enjoy BBs contributions particularly.
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18 minutes ago, clangerman said:
sssh your supposed to ignore that part and scapegoat the hse lol
Hey Clangerman, have you filled in the HSE questionnaire yet?
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P.S This from the NZ Fish and game Dep’t:
Who's exempt?
- ALL hunters of upland game (all quail and pheasants) are exempted. That's because research has shown these birds are not affected because the shot "in the uplands" is so widely dispersed
- Users of a .410 bore shotgun
- All hunters who pass the "200m rule test" (see below)
My add’:
* 200 meters is distance from open water.
* 410s are exempt as they are important for teaching children and are non significant re national % shot volume. -
For those completing the questionnaire (the more the better!) - it is worth emphasising the conclusions and reg’s in New Zealand. They have ‘evaluated’ and state no significant terrestrial impacts. NZ is well respected re environmental policy. They have only banned lead shot over wetlands….!!
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47 minutes ago, Dave at kelton said:
I have a few comments on this thread and all the others about this subject.
Firstly before you comment please read HSE report….all 227 pages of it. Don’t rely on what you have read or heard from others.
Secondly, don’t leave everyone else to make your case, do it for yourself. If you are going to leave it to the shooting organisations don’t complain about the result in due course.
Lastly, don’t assume a template response will have any traction as it will be seen for what it is. If you are going to comment make evidence based representations in your own words.
By all means lobby MP’s although I rather feel that they have other things on their agendas at present!
Good points well made. However please bear in mind the HSE report relies, in part, upon biased data generated by certain interests shall we say. Junk science and wild guestimates in places. It would seem that the HSE have poorly evaluated much of the so called science and it’s source.
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Old North East gun makers
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P.S Alexander Grant’s famous record breaking ‘Vibration’ greenheart rod was 21ft. Can’t precisely remember the distance he cast a level silk line, but it was sixty something yards…!