reddan Posted September 28, 2009 Report Share Posted September 28, 2009 I alway thought that they were both much of a muchness. Both a more or less the same price and both seem to do the job well. For the last 6 months i have favoured Comp X, as I seem to do better with them. I know this is all in my head, but if it works. Anyway on Sunday I was short of Comp X and had half a box left of First. I mixed a box and thought nothing more of it. On the last stand I noticed a huge difference on a few shots, at one point I thought both barrells had gone off at once. These were the First. It turns out that the Firsts have much more recoil than the Comp X. Both types were the same, 7.5 shot 28grm fibre. I have never noticed this before, I assume it must be the difference in powder and/or wad. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted September 28, 2009 Report Share Posted September 28, 2009 I have noticed a harder recoil from Eley First cartridges and mentioned it to a friend who is a "hardcore" clay shooter. He said that he bet I was using their fibre wad cartridge, as they seem to have a harder recoil than the plastic wad. I was using the fibre wad, so that may be the reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter De La Mare Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 Comp X are the slowest of the shells that I know of...1200 fps or something? The Eleys are 1350+ I believe, anything will feel slightly lumpier than the Comp X shells....other than subsonic stuff of course. I realise that speed isn't the be all and end all of perceived recoil, but I believe it to be the main culprit in this particular instance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
libs Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 I have noticed a harder recoil from Eley First cartridges and mentioned it to a friend who is a "hardcore" clay shooter.He said that he bet I was using their fibre wad cartridge, as they seem to have a harder recoil than the plastic wad. I was using the fibre wad, so that may be the reason. I take it a fibre wad weighs more than a plaswad, and as recoil energy is somewhat a function of what mass leaves the muzzle and how quickly said mass does that, a plaswad cart of 28g will kick less than a fibre wad cart with the same shot weight and speed etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 Eley Firsts 28g Plaswad No. 8 : lovely carts - pattern well, breaks all that needs to be broken and easy on the pocket. I don't bother with anything else now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddan Posted September 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 Comp X are the slowest of the shells that I know of...1200 fps or something? The Eleys are 1350+ I believe, anything will feel slightly lumpier than the Comp X shells....other than subsonic stuff of course. I realise that speed isn't the be all and end all of perceived recoil, but I believe it to be the main culprit in this particular instance. I did wonder if this was the case but didn't look at the numbers as Comp X are listed under the HV section on the Hull website. Link Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HW682 Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 (edited) Comp X are listed in the "high velocity" section of the Hull website and have a claimed velocity of 1375 fps for the 28g load and 1425 for 21g Hull Comp X sorry..seems I was a bit slow there. Edited September 29, 2009 by HW682 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddan Posted September 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 They always seem 'cleaner' than eley, does this mean a quicker burning powder? Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddan Posted September 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 Eley Firsts 28g Plaswad No. 8 : lovely carts - pattern well, breaks all that needs to be broken and easy on the pocket. I don't bother with anything else now. After 6 shots I had a headache. I don't get that with Hull. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter De La Mare Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 Comp X are listed in the "high velocity" section of the Hull website and have a claimed velocity of 1375 fps for the 28g load and 1425 for 21g Hull Comp X sorry..seems I was a bit slow there. Really? Where'd I read the 1200fps figure from then ? I'll just sit down and shut up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utectok Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 (edited) less progressive powder in the firsts I think the compx are a faster cart but with less recoil. Both ok but If I had to pick it would be hulls everytime they make great carts. Just looked 28 gm hulls @1375fps and firsts @ 1350ftps so about the same the recoil differnce is because the eley builds pressure in the chamber faster and gives more kick whereas the hull has the same energy but released more progressivly. We'll that a what I think Edited September 29, 2009 by utectok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simmans Posted May 1, 2013 Report Share Posted May 1, 2013 Hi All. Does anyone have the pressure figures for hull comp x vs eley firsts? cant seem to fing them on thye web thanks george Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted May 1, 2013 Report Share Posted May 1, 2013 there are no pressure figures, for shells. the only company that releases that information is B&P. i dont generally go in for the arguments of progressive and non progressive powders, pressure and high pressure application, aswell as speed and speed type figures. weighing wads and comeing up with bull such as total mass ejecta, etc. i recently purchased a case of RC cartridges, rc2 24g #9, as a comparison to my manufactured shells. the differences were, mine recoil less. but they both are very fast. mine is a biscuit under 1500fps, so not really a slow one. i also have the recoil figures comparing that to a 24g steel load at the same 1500fps or so. same recoil numbers come up with N/s. so they recoil the same, (in the test gun anyway.) i am running the doodahs out of the powder i`m using in the lead load, and for the steel, not so, actually quite leisurely pressure peak. this tells me there is no relationship between progressive and non progressive powders. just speed and mass of shot make up the recoil. shell manufacture companys massarge the numbers they want to advertise the shells at, so some will get close to published some dont even get close. thats the key. some companys tell porkies some publish the minimum speed achieved. some the maximum. both are right. none are wrong. these 21g loads need the fastest powder out there just to get them to burn right. thats not the pressures they run at, faster the burn rate for a powder the lower the pressure the powder can burn at. with the shells i have mentioned, one is steel, one is lead and they have near identical speeds and recoil and payload. what is amazingly different is the powders i used and the pressure peak profile. fast powder for lead the lead pressure peak, is a monster, it shoots up and plummets down almost imediatelt, the event is done in a few uSeconds. the peak is needle like, with minimal peak area. this powder is amazingly fast.. slow powder for steel the steel pressure was a cartridge designed for shooting pigeons with steel for raptors. 1500fps of #5 or UK#4. to shoot clean birds. no lead is allowed. the powder charge is high, the peak at 25/30 starts goes high and then the come-down of the peak is very long and slow. in comparison of the previous peak, this whole peak, lasts 6 times longer and the area of the peak is about 15-18 times larger. both shells, are safe, my results are, pressure has nothing to do with recoil. progressive, more progressive, less progressive, non progressive, uber progressive, alfa progressive, facebook progressive, powders mean absolutely have no effect on recoil. speed has a big impact on recoil shot weight has a big impact on recoil. cartridge manufacturers tell porkies. just because something is written down, doesnt mean it is true. cook. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salop Matt Posted May 1, 2013 Report Share Posted May 1, 2013 What ever i compare hull comp x`s to i find them very soft and personally i dont like them, they also are the only cartridge i cant get my semi auto to cycle ! ATB Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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