20g reloading

[fuzrat]

Reloading gurus,

 

Now I'm not shooting registered clays anymore and can use homeloads at strawbalers I thought I may have a bash at reloading for my 20g.

 

Thinking along the lines of a fastish 26gram no7 fibre load that I can use for clays and game thus being able to stick with exactly the same cartridge for both.

 

I am using RC20 sipes at the moment in the above configuration and would like to get the same kind of performance (without the price tag!)

 

First question is, I have been looking at different loading suppliers and worked out I can reload for approx £125 per thou. Have I got my numbers right? is this price realistic?

 

Secondly can you recommend anything I should be reading on reloading, websites, books etc?

 

Thirdly, Which machine? leaning toward a loadall at the moment as cheaper and has more options as standard should I want to change shot load or powder charge.

 

Lastly, (thank god you say) Has anyone had any dealings with Reloading Solutions in Oxford? They are just up the road from me so might have to pop in there for a chat.

 

Thanks for toiling through to the end

 

Fuzrat

[sitsinhedges]

I think you'll struggle to get a 20g reload that you can describe as fast, both my 24 and 28gram fibre load are under 1200fps. Recrimping 20gauge has proved to be problematic for me and I just cut 70mm cases down to 65mm and RTO them.

 

Costs me about 10p each but I do make my own shot. You have to do it because you enjoy it rather than to save money though.

[mcw65]

never had any problems recrimping on a pacific 366.

[sitsinhedges]

never had any problems recrimping on a pacific 366.

 

I found that most 20gauge cases just weren't good enough to recrimp well and a lot have small splits in the crimp after the first firing which makes them splay.

 

It could be done but they generally looked tatty and there were too many failures. I found that although using an RTO was a little slower I knew I could start with say 25 empties and end up with 25 new cartridges instead of 20 and 5 that need taking to bits again.

 

I tend to use an auto and the rolled turnover reloads feed really well and look cool but it is a case of use once and chuck.

 

I use a Pacific 260DL to do all the other operations

Edited December 16, 2010 by sitsinhedges

[seeker]

Reloading Solutions an excellent place to drop in on ... just make sure you have a card for impulse buys ...

I load 28g .. same problem Sits in Hedges has with the 20 .. the Lees probably fine for most but get an RTO head for when you need it.

[Guest cookoff013]

rto tools save alot of screwups. i had a load for a 3" case and it wouldnt fit, basewad was too tall by 5mm or so.

roll turn saved the day.

 

as for your reloads, i`d recomend getting some data first, try and emulate a cartridge you like first.

 

i hear it all the time, just keep your feet on the ground.

 

"i want to fire 2oz out of my 12g 2" chamber"

"with no recoil"

"at 1800fps"

"no pressure"

"cheap"

 

when loads get -

fast, and larger, pressure is the main concern. try not to force a 20 to do what a 12 can. you will be very disapointed. it is expensive to get a 20g to perform as a 12gauge. the powders are more expensive because they are slower, and you use more of it !

 

we`ll dig out some stuff to help.

 

i`ve just been pricing up a 20g load and 130 is bang on the money. but that is excluding delivery.

[Guest cookoff013]

*cough*

 

http://www.siarm.it/product_info.php?cPath=96_101_109&products_id=466

 

*cough*

http://www.siarm.it/product_info.php?cPath=96_101_109&products_id=522

 

these are the same equivalence as the sipe.

i would recomend a #8 or #9 for clays. its clays not competition. if you were competing you`d be using a 12gauge.

i would recomend a #5 for game, there may be some discrepency with the shot sizes you are used to. i think sipe #6 is actually english #5.

 

apart from that they seem to be a nice cartridge. nice pressure and speed.

[sitsinhedges]

rto tools save alot of screwups. i had a load for a 3" case and it wouldnt fit, basewad was too tall by 5mm or so.

roll turn saved the day.

 

as for your reloads, i`d recomend getting some data first, try and emulate a cartridge you like first.

 

i hear it all the time, just keep your feet on the ground.

 

"i want to fire 2oz out of my 12g 2" chamber"

"with no recoil"

"at 1800fps"

"no pressure"

"cheap"

 

when loads get -

fast, and larger, pressure is the main concern. try not to force a 20 to do what a 12 can. you will be very disapointed. it is expensive to get a 20g to perform as a 12gauge. the powders are more expensive because they are slower, and you use more of it !

 

we`ll dig out some stuff to help.

 

i`ve just been pricing up a 20g load and 130 is bang on the money. but that is excluding delivery.

 

And excluding shot too :yp:

[Guest cookoff013]

£160 should be acheivable. i think.

 

?

Edited December 17, 2010 by cookoff013

[sitsinhedges]

Mine use 17 grains or 1.1grams of vectan A1 which is 3.8p, CX2000 2.5P (lucky purchase), 15mm fibre wad and plastic obturator 3.5p and a homecut overshot card which comes to a total of £96/1000.

 

My chrono says they are doing 1150fps, not fast but they work well enough and the recoil is very mild.

 

Not sure if the powder measure could be upped for a faster cartridge or not as the Nobel website is a bit vague and states a different primer that I don't know the strength of

 

http://www.nobelsport.fr/nobelsport/fr/schedules/vec_a1.html

[Guest cookoff013]

i priced up 16 grains of AS and 5/8oz or 11/16oz, AS is alittle too fast for the 20 but "should" work in these lighter loads.

AS shouldnt really be used in loads 21g or more, for the 20gauge. primers are 3p, £30 / 1000. the powder is £30 per kg, and ~1g opowder per shot.

 

i dont really like having data without pressure information. thats the most interesting part, how hard the powder is working, actually shows its suitability. most powders can make "some" shot leave the barrel in any gauge, but the performance will get worse and worse, as the powder becomes less veratile.

[sitsinhedges]

i priced up 16 grains of AS and 5/8oz or 11/16oz, AS is alittle too fast for the 20 but "should" work in these lighter loads.

AS shouldnt really be used in loads 21g or more, for the 20gauge. primers are 3p, £30 / 1000. the powder is £30 per kg, and ~1g opowder per shot.

 

i dont really like having data without pressure information. thats the most interesting part, how hard the powder is working, actually shows its suitability. most powders can make "some" shot leave the barrel in any gauge, but the performance will get worse and worse, as the powder becomes less veratile.

 

I didn't have the pressures for my stated load but use the consistent velocity and fine residue in the barrels as a marker that it is burning efficiently, if it wasn't there would be unburnt clumps and erratic speeds.

 

It was a published load BTW, not something I made up

Edited December 17, 2010 by sitsinhedges

[Guest cookoff013]

loads that are over pressure can also be consistent and clean.

 

high pressure loads will nearly always burn clean. at pressures of 10,000or more, most powders and most charges,

ie 10-30grains will burn very clean, as long as the pressure for these loads are above 10,000.

 

some even go as far as adding a grain of fast powder to slow burning powders to get extra pressure in the winter. (i`d advise you dont do this.)

 

AS is the only powder i`d go down to 5/8oz its very fast. as its "like" red dot, there are a few loaders in the stated that use red dot in the 20 for lightest loads. thats 19 and 18grams. i`d be comfortable whacking clays with them.

[Guest cookoff013]

Not sure if the powder measure could be upped for a faster cartridge or not as the Nobel website is a bit vague and states a different primer that I don't know the strength of

 

the cx2000 is a hot primer (not magnum), M686 is a medium strength primer.

[fuzrat]

thanks gents, this is good stuff I shall pop into Reloading Solutions and have a chat with them and see if I can find some decent reading material (reloading for dummies would be good )

 

Sounds like something I could dabble in when not shooting Keep the top tips coming

 

Fuzrat

[fruitloop]

i agree with sitsin about 20g cases thay are a p.i.t.a. to re crimp as thay tend to split on first fire or they are to thin and bulge so i to are having problems with them

[fuzrat]

Well that answers my next question, was going to ask if you can reload empties more than once. A resounding no by the looks of it I quite like the look of the RTO finish anyway, I think it just looks neater

 

Fuzrat

[Floating Chamber]

I never have any problems with my 20 gauge loads. I only use a LeeLoadAll II for this gauge and can crank them out fast and furious using primed cases. The loads are spun to effect a factory finish.

 

Get yourselves a set of these:

 

Edited December 19, 2010 by Floating Chamber

[sitsinhedges]

I never have any problems with my 20 gauge loads. I only use a LeeLoadAll II for this gauge and can crank them out fast and furious using primed cases. The loads are spun to effect a factory finish.

 

Get yourselves a set of these:

 

 

If they are primed cases are they actually reloads

 

It seems to be the effect of the first firing and how it affects the original crimp that seems to make them unsuitable for more use. The plastic seems very thin on many cases aswell and an RTO can't cure splits.

 

I make good 20gauge trumpets

Edited December 19, 2010 by sitsinhedges

[Floating Chamber]

My RELOADS have equally good crimps as primed cases.

[fuzrat]

FC, can you mount your "spinners" in a hand held drill or do you have to have a bench drill?

 

Fuzrat

[Floating Chamber]

The video on SIARM shows this is possible.

Edited December 19, 2010 by Floating Chamber

[sitsinhedges]

FC, can you mount your "spinners" in a hand held drill or do you have to have a bench drill?

 

Fuzrat

 

 

A benchdrill set with a stop will give you consistency and just be a damned sight easier