BangBangNik Posted August 19, 2012 Report Share Posted August 19, 2012 Recently I have been reading through natural England's online leaflets on controll of pests trying to learn as much as I can about what I am allowed to do and how I'm allowed to do it. While reading the control of rabbits leaflet I came across a paragraph that confused me a little(not hard) and was hoping for some clarification on it. Apologies in advance if I am being thick but I have read it a number of times and it's still no clearer. The paragraph is as follows: The Ground Game Act 1880 gives an occupier the right to shoot rabbits on his land during the day and to authorise in writing one other person to do so. The person must be a member of the occupier's household or staff or be employed for reward. Under the Pests Act 1954, an occupier may apply to Natural England for authority to use a reasonable number of extra guns, if the owner of the shooting rights will neither permit the occupier to bring on extra guns, nor undertake to destroy the rabbits himself, and it is necessary to use more guns than the occupier has the right to authorise. What I don't get is this, the farm I shoot on has a number of people who the farmer allows to shoot on his land. How does this work if only "one other person" is allowed to shoot rabbits? Or when I'm reading threads on here about "me and mr x shooting x amount of rabbits," are they technically comiting an offence unles the farmer has applied for a licence to allow more guns. Also it says the other authorised person must be being paid For his service. I can't imagine everyone on here that are shooting rabbits are being paid, but like me, see it as a trade off in that the farmer gets his rabbit problem sorted and I get to do the sport I enjoy. Sorry for the lengthy question but this is how we learn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redtailhawk1 Posted August 19, 2012 Report Share Posted August 19, 2012 The farmer on my permission is getting his son to help me cut dead trees on his land and log them for me for free using his chain saw. I take it as that as payment for pest control. Although I do not think that is quite right. Could be wrong but as I understand it, rabbits are an introduced pest and the farmer/ land owner has a duty to control them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blunderbuss Posted August 19, 2012 Report Share Posted August 19, 2012 (edited) I think the excerpt your referring to is aimed at tennant farmers ('the occupier'). Its to allow a tenant to shoot pest species, or employ someone else to - even if his landlord has retained the shooting rights. In that scenario as tennant farmer with no shooting rights, you cant shoot game, but the law allows you to shoot rabbits. If the farm you're referring to is owned rather than leased by the farmer, I think he can let whoever he likes shoot rabbits? Edit: As Redtailhawk says above, landowners are legally obliged to keep rabbits under control and in some circumstances can be fined if they don't. Edited August 19, 2012 by Blunderbuss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BangBangNik Posted August 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2012 Aah, I see. That makes sense and now you have explained it, when I read it back I understand. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted August 19, 2012 Report Share Posted August 19, 2012 Blunderbuss has the right of it IMHO. Except this extract is from the leaseholder to Natural England who own the land you shoot over The extra guns bit refers to a tenants obligation to keep pest species under control and the Landlords right, in default of the tenant carrying out his obligations re pests, to give permission to other guns to do it. P.S. pest species includes pigeons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted August 19, 2012 Report Share Posted August 19, 2012 The fact it is the "Ground game act of 1880 makes me think it isnt the most recent legislation............http://www.naturalengland.org.uk/Images/WML-G22_tcm6-9968.pdf See point 4: 4. The right to shoot rabbits The Ground Game Act 1880 gives an occupier the right to shoot rabbits on his/her land during the day and to authorise in writing one other person to do so. That person must be a member of the occupier’s household or staff, or be employed for reward. An occupier may apply to Natural England for authority to use a reasonable number of extra guns, if the owner of the shooting rights will neither permit the occupier to use extra guns, nor undertake to destroy the rabbits themselves. If you wish to apply to use extra guns, contact Natural England at the address below. Under the 1880 Act, as interpreted by the courts and as read with the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981, only the following are allowed to shoot rabbits at night: • An owner-occupier with shooting rights; • A landlord/landlady who has reserved their shooting rights; • A shooting tenant not in occupation who has derived the shooting rights from the owner; and • An occupier, or one other person authorised by them in writing, where the occupier has written authority from another person with shooting rights. I Wonder if someone with "permission" is in fact "a Shooting tenant" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted August 20, 2012 Report Share Posted August 20, 2012 Prior to 1981 the legislation regarding rabbit shooting at night was far tougher than it is now. Anyone with the first edition of the BASC's 'Handbook of Shooting The Sporting Shotgun' (as a quick reference) will have the specifics. A shooting tenant is as described and sadly there's no clause which states, 'this includes HDAV'. You could argue that the law regarding the shooting of rabbit is broken more often than that relating to 'phones and driving. But, hey, don't rock the boat, the job gets done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted August 20, 2012 Report Share Posted August 20, 2012 The farmer on my permission is getting his son to help me cut dead trees on his land and log them for me for free using his chain saw. I take it as that as payment for pest control. Although I do not think that is quite right. Could be wrong but as I understand it, rabbits are an introduced pest and the farmer/ land owner has a duty to control them. Unless someone can find it tucked away somewhere, payment for pest control is no longer of consequence. 'For payment or reward' was specified pre 1981 (rabbit shooting at night) but this could be taken as the reward being keeping what you shot. However, please note that my knowledge on this aspect of the law is limited to that which effects me. Yes, there is a duty of control. A common 'issue' is/was railway embankments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted August 21, 2012 Report Share Posted August 21, 2012 The fact it is the "Ground game act of 1880 makes me think it isnt the most recent legislation............http://www.naturalen...2_tcm6-9968.pdf See point 4: I Wonder if someone with "permission" is in fact "a Shooting tenant" No, they would not be. To qualify in law as a Shooting Tenant one must have a lease for the shooting rights which would preclude others, including the owner, from shooting the land (other than the occupier taking rabbits). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted August 21, 2012 Report Share Posted August 21, 2012 Ok my interpretation looks to be incorrect then it does seem that there as a difference between the legal stance and the practical one. I will admit I wasn't aware of such tight restrictions on shooting rabbits at night. Does this apply only at night? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted August 21, 2012 Report Share Posted August 21, 2012 Ok my interpretation looks to be incorrect then it does seem that there as a difference between the legal stance and the practical one. I will admit I wasn't aware of such tight restrictions on shooting rabbits at night. Does this apply only at night? Your quote at Post #6 wraps it up nicely. The 1981 Act relaxed things a lttle - the night shooting control was far more stringent than even that detailed above for day time. Scottish shooters have the advantage of a precedent in as much as keeping the rabbits shot satisfies the requirement of a reward in the absence of payment of monies for those genuinely employed (Bruce v Prosser 1898). As said, it's best not to rock the boat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted August 21, 2012 Report Share Posted August 21, 2012 But as long as one person (only at a time) has written permission from the occupier they can shoot rabbits at night. Best make sure one has written permission. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted August 21, 2012 Report Share Posted August 21, 2012 But as long as one person (only at a time) has written permission from the occupier they can shoot rabbits at night. Best make sure one has written permission. A goody to keep you out of trouble (and answer stupid questions on here) is Fair Game - the law of country sports and the protection of wildlife by Charlie Parkes and John Thornley. There's a load on Amazon starting at 1p plus postage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BangBangNik Posted August 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2012 Well thanks everyone, it is abit clearer now. Hopefully it will something that I never need to fall back on but you just never know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvid wings Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 READING BETWEEN THE LINES THE FARMERS YOUR DAD ! IF HE'S STILL PRE OP,IF NOT YOUR MUM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bewsher500 Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 But as long as one person (only at a time) has written permission from the occupier they can shoot rabbits at night. Best make sure one has written permission. I shoot some ground where at least two of us have written permission, and I often go with a mate. Does that fall foul of the law?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.