spoony Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 Hi just a quick hello, 38 yr northerner just starting out. Heaps of Qs, Looking to buy an outfit, but with soooo much on the market its not an easy task. First off most shooting will be field target in some private woods i have access to, then and only when i am capable on to bunnies. Calibre???.177 or .22 well after reading lots of other posts have decided .22 Guns?? ahhhh the big Q.... well for me it has to be multi shot pre charged, (maybe single shot) well went to local gunshop, had a looksee. Well this is what they gave me to look at AA Sg10 HW100 Super10 mk3 BB K and another 4 which i wont list as they well over my well streched £600 well first a few Qs Will a karbine offer the same accuracy and distance as a rifle??(i like the karbines) fixed charging system or buddy bottle type pros and cons?? single or multi shot pros and cons?? another gun i like and i know someone who has one, is the falcon light hunter raptor (skelton stock) but the shop doesnt sell them and didnt rate them? funny as my friend bought it from them about 5 years ago? now out of all the above guns the one that felt the most natural for me was the super10. Soooooo anyone got one and what they like? cheers for your time guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lurcherboy Posted January 10, 2007 Report Share Posted January 10, 2007 Whatto spoony. You ask more questions than my rottie after I get home at sunrise :yp: You have come to the right place mate and someone will be along to answer all your questions soon or quicker if you fill your profile in :look: LB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boytleburgher Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 Welcome to the forum. :look: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naddan28 Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 welcome mate:D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyber Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 Welcome! One of my friends has a superten and he loves it. I'm not too sure on the accuracy though. If your not too bothered on the length then I would suggest you look at Daystate. I have the X2 with a 10 shot magazine and if it is accuracy you want then you cannot go wrong, the accuracy is AMAZING!! Pellet on pellet at 20-30 yrds (well its possible on a very calm day anyhow, especially at 20yds!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 :look: to PW :yp: The main difference with a carbine PCP is that you get less shots per charge. So this will also help you to decide on a larger 'buddy bottle' or fixed chgarging system. The larger 'buddy bottle' will give many more shots per charge and increase the amount of shots you get in the guns sweet spot, which is the area where your rifle shoots most consistently. Mind you, even with a fixed system, you are very unlikely going to need more than the shots it will provide on a single trip. It all comes down to personal opinion and what suits you best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyber Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 I thought you got more shots per charge on a carbine as it requires less air to propel the pellet out of the shorter barrel or am I completely wrong?? :look: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Dog Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 Welcome dood :look: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 I thought you got more shots per charge on a carbine as it requires less air to propel the pellet out of the shorter barrel or am I completely wrong?? :look: Your wrong i'm afraid. It requires more pressure/air to get the pellet upto the required rate in a shorter barrel. Remember that the goal is to have the pellet to the required speed before it leaves the crown, therfore, over a shorter distance, you will need to accelerate harder, which requires more air. :yp: For example: The Air Arms S410 Classic with a total length of 39" will deliver 100 shots in .22, but the carbine version with a total length of 35" will only deliver 80 shots per charge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul in North Lincs. Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 hola chicco :look: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNAKEBITE Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 The main difference with a carbine PCP is that you get less shots per charge. I thought it was that one was longer than the other! :look: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 The main difference with a carbine PCP is that you get less shots per charge. I thought it was that one was longer than the other! :look: Clever ****. :yp: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNAKEBITE Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 The Air Arms S410 Classic with a total length of 39" will deliver 100 shots in .22, but the carbine version with a total length of 35" will only deliver 80 shots per charge. I can only give you first hand information about the carbine but in reality you only get about 40 usable shots within the optimum power band. This is from the start of the sweet spot which is 175bar. However on any given hunting trip this will easily be enough. Once you have made your choice of rifle we can cloud the issue with the "sweet spot" issue but at the moment I'd wait until you have bought one. It's nothing sinister or anything to worry about it can just get a bit silly if you worry about everything all at once. (I speak from experience!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spoony Posted January 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 cheers for the input guys, im also a keen bushcrafter, so when i got out it tends to be at least one over night stay, so i guess the buddy bottle may suit me better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyber Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 I thought you got more shots per charge on a carbine as it requires less air to propel the pellet out of the shorter barrel or am I completely wrong?? :look: Your wrong i'm afraid. It requires more pressure/air to get the pellet upto the required rate in a shorter barrel. Remember that the goal is to have the pellet to the required speed before it leaves the crown, therfore, over a shorter distance, you will need to accelerate harder, which requires more air. For example: The Air Arms S410 Classic with a total length of 39" will deliver 100 shots in .22, but the carbine version with a total length of 35" will only deliver 80 shots per charge. Cheers for that AXE, i never thought about it like that Learn summet new every day they say!! Thanks again :yp: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 you only get about 40 usable shots within the optimum power band Interesting stuff have you ever tried giving it a full fill to see if it does shoot the 80 shots as published? Cyber, no probs mate. :look: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNAKEBITE Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 Oh it will give you 80 shots allright but they will not be on the zero'ed point of impact. This will mean compensating for the drop on top of the distance estimation. Too many factors=missed shot in my book! As a keen bushcrafter Cyber you could use a pump. That way you get the rifle you want rather than compramising and you get a way of re-filling in the field. However you will be surprised at how few shots you do take in the field as long as you don't "plink". When I went through the rigramol of working out sweet spots I did use a file that someone had put togther. This involved the chrono'ing EVERY shot from 190Bar to when the rifle vented (60bar?). Every rifle is different but this was a good place to start from. I will see if I can track it down for you if you want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kipper Posted January 11, 2007 Report Share Posted January 11, 2007 Hello and A few of my opinions to your questions. here goes. If I was starting from scratch and I knew what I Know now this would be my choice. Cal = .177, I have allways had .22 but if I was buying a new air rifle it would be .177 due to flatter trajectory and its more forgiving when range finding. ( just my opinion not gospel ) Gun = AA S410 carbine, Without a doubt. I love these guns they are perfect for hunting and plinking IMO. as for the BSA Super 10, I liked this gun last year and I was considering buying one. I asked the pw members for there views and experiences with this gun and I was not impressed. so I stuck with AAS410. WHAT WAS I THINKING ( you will find that topic in the airgun section if you look) Carbine = yes Multi shot = yes Divers bottle / stirrup = Stirrup pump has worked well for me so I would not change that. Just keed everything clean / be carefull and use the filter type. Divers bottles seem alot of trouble to me. keep having to get them filled and the testing you have to have done on the bottle. IMO Hope this helps. Keep it safe and enjoy kipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spoony Posted January 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 cheers for your replies and advice, going to opt for the super10, was going for the .22 but not so sure now any pointers pros cons? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Posted January 12, 2007 Report Share Posted January 12, 2007 Spoony the .177 / .22 debate is age old and will continue until either calibre is unavailable. It really does come down to personal choice. For me it comes down to this: The .22 hits harder for hunting, is easier to load as it is bigger and gives me more shots per charge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spoony Posted January 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2007 Again thanks, another few qs if you dont mind, so what the best distance to zero? how far will a .22 and .177 travel straight, before havine to adjust for drop off?? and how far will a .22 and .177 kill a bunnie (max distance) with a head shot?? TIA oh and whats a good scope to start with without spending a fortune Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeihrauchPower Posted January 13, 2007 Report Share Posted January 13, 2007 Again thanks, another few qs if you dont mind,so what the best distance to zero? how far will a .22 and .177 travel straight, before havine to adjust for drop off?? and how far will a .22 and .177 kill a bunnie (max distance) with a head shot?? TIA oh and whats a good scope to start with without spending a fortune I would zero either calibre for 40yds which gives you a initial zero at around 10yds. Both are good out to 40-45yds using a good reliably accurate pellet so long as it hits the right spot, with the .22 having a better knock down effect. I'm sure someone will pipe up that they've had them at slighter longer distances but 40-45yds is the furthest you should be looking at really. If i were to buy a new scope at the moment i'd go for an AGS VIPIR 3-9x50 mil dot for around £100, or if thats a little steep there is the AGS Sapphire 3-9x40 mil dot for around £50-60. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spoony Posted January 13, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2007 are ags better than hawke? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeihrauchPower Posted January 13, 2007 Report Share Posted January 13, 2007 are ags better than hawke? I'm not sure, both me and a friend have had/used Hawke and had no problems. I've heard good things about the AGS scopes in Airgunner and Airgun world which is why i'd give them a go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNAKEBITE Posted January 13, 2007 Report Share Posted January 13, 2007 I would zero either calibre for 40yds which gives you a initial zero at around 10yds. I would suggest to someone who is just starting out to zero a .22 at 30yds and a .177 at 35 yds. Whilst I am not questioning your ability WP it would be easier for range estimation for a novice at those ranges. Just my opinion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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