00jacksonp Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 HI guys I was hoping somebody can enlighten me . Recoil is directly proportionate to The mass of the projectile and the Energy (powder) pushing it . The only way the shell can reduce this is by absorbing energy which would mean robbing energy from the projectile (velocity) If you increased the energy to counteract this then you just have a low performance high propellant cart. On paper It seems like a complete gimmick that everyone is lapping up! Any thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stevo Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 Yeah its a gimmick that eeveryone sussed out yrs ago . But some buy into it . Apart from the obvious using a lighter load . Gun fit and gun weight are the biggest factors in reducing felt/perceived recoil . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
00jacksonp Posted January 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 Yeah thought so .They are bloody expensive . Its the nice silver case and silver writing that lure people in! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 The gimmick enables them to charge more than the shells are worth. Surprisingly effective sales ploy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stevo Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 The gimmick enables them to charge more than the shells are worth. Surprisingly effective sales ploy. Bang on the money Gordon . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDog Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 HI guys I was hoping somebody can enlighten me . Recoil is directly proportionate to The mass of the projectile and the Energy (powder) pushing it . The only way the shell can reduce this is by absorbing energy which would mean robbing energy from the projectile (velocity) If you increased the energy to counteract this then you just have a low performance high propellant cart. On paper It seems like a complete gimmick that everyone is lapping up! Any thoughts? Crikey is that what happens? I am just a simple man and I never knew all of that stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 HI guys I was hoping somebody can enlighten me . Recoil is directly proportionate to The mass of the projectile and the Energy (powder) pushing it . The only way the shell can reduce this is by absorbing energy which would mean robbing energy from the projectile (velocity) If you increased the energy to counteract this then you just have a low performance high propellant cart. On paper It seems like a complete gimmick that everyone is lapping up! Any thoughts? HI guys I was hoping somebody can enlighten me . Recoil is directly proportionate to The mass of the projectile and the Energy (powder) pushing it . The only way the shell can reduce this is by absorbing energy which would mean robbing energy from the projectile (velocity) If you increased the energy to counteract this then you just have a low performance high propellant cart. On paper It seems like a complete gimmick that everyone is lapping up! Any thoughts? recoil, is directly due to mass, and the speed of the mass (thats the total shotweight and shot speed.) the only way to reduce recoil is to reduce one or both these factors. full stop. less beans and rocks. increasing the energy, could go 2 ways, more speed or more pressure. Probably both. actually the gordon recoil system is really smart. its smart for one reason, it reduces the volume of the hull, so a 2.5" recipe can fit in a 70mm case. that means it could be cheaper in powder than its counterparts. (less volume = less powder / specialy formulated etc...) i dont think it works well in the "recoil reduction" but it can be reloaded with less powder (volume) and that means it can save money in expensive powder. shell manufacturers dont just dump a product on the market, its carefully planned, so that product "X" can make them money. if that means saving money and increasing profits via "piece of flexi plastic in the basewad" then so be it. gamebore are here to make money, it just so happens they make shells too ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westward Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 Physics tells us you can't reduce the total recoil except by making the gun heavier but what you can do is change the way it's delivered to the shoulder. Slowing down the burn rate of the powder makes the recoil pulse slightly longer and the peak pressure slightly lower. That's why shells of different makes/models/wad type often feel different recoil wise even though the shot load and speed are the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 Physics tells us you can't reduce the total recoil except by making the gun heavier but what you can do is change the way it's delivered to the shoulder. Slowing down the burn rate of the powder makes the recoil pulse slightly longer and the peak pressure slightly lower. That's why shells of different makes/models/wad type often feel different recoil wise even though the shot load and speed are the same. yeah you can reduce the recoil, just shoot it slower. there is no "slowing the burnrate of a powder" its just using a different powder. often with slower powder need more powder to produce more pressure to burn right and to settle the speed consistantly. the speed goes up and the recoil goes up. with any amount of powder. i`ve loaded 15 grain charges vs 30 grain charges and a proof gun recoil sensor says "its the same" most shells never get to there expected speeds, so thats the x factor for loads, if you run all the loads in the same equiptment you`ll most likley come across, more speed = more recoil. shell manufacturers can market whatever, but rarely the true facts.... the peak pressure of slower burning powder is a fraction of second (i think micro or millisecond) later, i`ve tested superfast powders ! and slow powders, recoils similar and for expected speeds too. i have as yet not tested 1.5 - 2oz turkey loads. i doubt that i would ever attempt that. i`ve ran tests where i push powder to the limit (i`ve an extensive back catalogue of failed reloads ), and tried loads where i know they are really inneficient and fast. most powders have multiple applications, take titewad, can do 21g loads to 32g. most lilely at similar pressures too. (bpi data) did you know that a 1oz subsonic load actually recoils less than a 21g 1450fps ! even hull cartridge publishes this on their "recoil ometer !" by my very educated guess ie thats the linear model of comparing [32g vs 28g ] vs 24g subsonic recoil, would mean that the 24gram subsonics (12 or 20 gauge) would be about 7n/s. i have as yet to do a 36g subsonic load published (i need to sort out that) felt recoil, is just "witchcraft" lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westward Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 Oh sorry! I didn't mean to suggest that the shooter can slow down the burn rate - I meant the powder manufacturer... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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