conflicting information

[roadkill]

As i am as new as they come to training a dog im starting to get confused with conflicting information , So i would like some guidance and see what methods you lot use .

 

In sporting shooter the dog trainer in there states ..... working dog - trainers do not use the command STAY , its an unnecessary command... Then later on he goes on about sitting the dog and how to release the dog ........ Do not use the dogs name as a release command and never call your dog to you from the sitting position - always return to him and praise him .. If you call your dog from sitting , it will just encourage him to anticipate being called and he is more likely to leave the sit position of his own accord. Any dog in the world will come off the sit position when his name is called - ( SO YOU ARE NOT TEACHING THE RECALL )

 

However , i have just bought a dvd on gun dog training . And they do the opersit . They use the stay command to hold the dog and also they call the dog from the sitting position using the dog name and clapping when starting the dog on recall lessons ..

So both the magazine and dvd are conflicting one another so now im stuck and confused .

 

Is the stay command ok to use or should i avoid it? And is it ok or not to call a dog from the sit position to you and also using its name?

 

Please help one very confused beginner

 

Roadkill

[deeksofdoom]

You do realise your going to get about ten different replies to that question and your still going to be none the wiser........... I use the stay command I use a mixture of voice and whistle commands sometimes both, e.g. the commands 'sit', 'stay' and '1 pip on the whistle' all mean the same thing i.e. stop and stay where you are.

 

You got to come up with your own style, hope this helps.

[roadkill]

You do realise your going to get about ten different replies to that question and your still going to be none the wiser........... I use the stay command I use a mixture of voice and whistle commands sometimes both, e.g. the commands 'sit', 'stay' and '1 pip on the whistle' all mean the same thing i.e. stop and stay where you are.

 

You got to come up with your own style, hope this helps.

 

 

that's what im expecting , i was just wondering what the majority of PW do .

 

So how do you go on with recall ? Do you use your dogs name and do you recall her from the sit position ?

 

Cheers roadkill

[deeksofdoom]

that's what im expecting , i was just wondering what the majority of PW do .

 

So how do you go on with recall ? Do you use your dogs name and do you recall her from the sit position ?

 

Cheers roadkill

 

Recall is 2 pips on the whistle or I call the dogs name, but if your going to use a whistle use it all the time, especially when out walking and when the dog comes back make sure to get down and make a big fuss of it .... every time!

[roadkill]

Recall is 2 pips on the whistle or I call the dogs name, but if your going to use a whistle use it all the time, especially when out walking and when the dog comes back make sure to get down and make a big fuss of it .... every time!

 

 

so would you recall the dog from the sitting position , as what i was going to do for a start was to sit the dog and back off a few feet and then call the dogs name and use the whistle to get her use to it . I have already started to use the whistle for the sit command and this works fine ...

[MC]

I will never call my dog if I have told him to STAY, I will only reacall him from the WAIT position.

 

Both will be sitting, stay means exactly that STAY don't do anything else. Wait means wait until I tell you what to do.

 

I use several pips for the recall. 1 blow for the stop, 2 pips to turn when quartering and several to come back.

[deeksofdoom]

so would you recall the dog from the sitting position , as what i was going to do for a start was to sit the dog and back off a few feet and then call the dogs name and use the whistle to get her use to it . I have already started to use the whistle for the sit command and this works fine ...

 

My dogs aren't field trial champions by any standard and I'm no expert, I have trained my dogs relatively well by myself and they work well to my expectations. I have a GWP that I use for roughshooting and a springer that I beat with but this year she is going to be doing mostly roughshooting, I hope! They sit, come for the recall, stop , go back follow directional commands and retrieve from land and water, however they can be unruly and wild but that just adds to the fun and makes for a couple of really gamey hard hunting dogs.... in my opinion anyway.

 

To answer your original question 'would you recall the dog from the sitting position' yes I would. However as MC says he wouldn't. Some guys think it makes the dog unsteady. I don't think its that important not for me anyway. I never tried using the wait command seems like a good idea might be wortha try.

 

There is a really good dog trialing man that I beat with a few times last year and the best advice he gave me was to never give a dog a command where you think he is going to disobey you. If you tell the dog to sit and stay and there are too many distractions around him and there is a good chance he's going to break, so don't tell him to sit, practice it somewhere else.

[dusk2dawn]

Recall is 2 pips on the whistle or I call the dogs name, but if your going to use a whistle use it all the time, especially when out walking and when the dog comes back make sure to get down and make a big fuss of it .... every time!

 

If you are training your dog for the shooting field the last thing you want to be doing is hollering the dogs name all over the place, so train it to the whistle, nice and quiet, minimal disturbance to the area you are shooting in.

 

Sit means sit and stay, its as simple as that, no need to use the word stay at all, the dog should remain sitting for as long as you want it to without moving.

 

A couple of pips and it is back up beside you walking to heel. Abit of praise in the early days certainly but as the training progresses a simple "good dog" is reward enough.

 

My advice to you would be to get hold of one of the aknowledged experts training books and stick with that, stop reading every article you can find, as you have already found some contradict the proven training methods that have stood the test of time and produced the champions that most lines decend from.

 

Good luck with the training, D2D.

[Dirty Harry]

I agree with D2D.

Sit means sit and stay. If I want my dog to do anything else I tell him. If I dont tell him he stays sitting. I think the less commands the better. Makes it easier for them to understand.

As for the recall I would start by not calling the dog from the sitting position but walk back to him. Only when he is really good at this try calling him but dont do it everytime or he will just start running in.

I am training my first gundog at the moment and before I started with the recall I could sit him and walk 100 yards away wait 5 mins and walk back and he would remain sitting.

Get the basics right and and the rest will be a whole lot easier.

 

Harry

[WGD]

Use whatever commands you're happy with and make sure your training is varied so the dog does not pre-empt what you are going to ask it to do. What I, or anyone else does, is irrelevant as long as you are happy with the responses you get from your dog to the commands you give it. The single most important thing is to be CONSISTENT.

[Spaniel]

With the springers, i dont use the stay command i just use sit

and when at the sit position i dont call them to me, i walk up to them and walk them back at my side or i maybe give them the release command

 

I have done the call from sit in the beginning and believe me the springers are so clever that they will anticipate what you are going todo next, and they will start to move forward...something you dont want....

 

also to get them steady i will put them in the sit position and then i will walk away from them throwing the dummy or ball around and retrieving this myself...this is to get them to stay steady in the sit position until i tell them otherwise etc

 

All good fun isnt it but believe me you will get so much advise it will drive you round the bend....do what you feel comfortable with and most importantly learn from your mistakes

[Spaniel]

However , i have just bought a dvd on gun dog training . And they do the opersit . They use the stay command to hold the dog and also they call the dog from the sitting position using the dog name and clapping when starting the dog on recall lessons ..

 

Maybe they are just building confidence in the younge dog at this stage, as a pup i use to wait until mine was actually coming to me, before i called her name and gave her loads of encouragement etc

 

now i use the whistle or if i have both out in the garden in the sit position, i will use their names to call them to me

[fallarben]

when training i send a dog out by name so can not use it as a recall i believe and was tought from a early age a dog needs one comand sit means sit and stay till ur told to do something else to many commands personaly i think confuses a young dog so keep it simple

[SteveH]

I will never call my dog if I have told him to STAY, I will only reacall him from the WAIT position.

 

Both will be sitting, stay means exactly that STAY don't do anything else. Wait means wait until I tell you what to do.

 

Same here.