Plastic V Felt wads

[Snotty]

The answer is simple, get a muzzle loader and a can of good old fashioned gunpowder. You can then load a card 'twixt powder and shot, no wads at all

[Big Dog]

Well I come from a farming background. I know of a situation where local famer in my area ( 20-25 yrs ago) talked about a cow that died due to a plastic wad sticking in the throat. I don't know if there was other stuff that got stuck too and compounded the situation, but a cow died.

 

Also in NI clay shoots that would have areas that get grased, insist on fibre wads. Many shooter still believe, myself included, that you get a better patern from fibre wads.

 

I also agree that there is lead deposits on plastic wads too.

 

To solved the problem use a rifle and bring home the empty cases

[webber]

I now regularly shoot clays on a ground at Ulpha. Its an excellent Sunday morning shoot. The shoot is located on what I would describe as rocky outcropped rough pasture. Sheep and cattle are simply herded to the far end of the field before shooting commences. They seem amazingly unaffected by the loud bangs.

 

The ground is strictly feld wads only, and notices are posted requesting that members report anyone shooting plastic wads. The shoot is fortnightly and well attended, therfore thousands of shots are fired. Im sure that if there was any doubt about felt wads the shoot woud not be located as it is, there is however serious consern over plastic wads.

 

I have only ever bought fibre / feld wadded cartridges, and therefore cant contrast the two, but Im no olympic shot.

 

webber

[jpw99]

Ok then you suckered me back in on this one.

Have used plas only until i hit on this wonderful forum and this particular thread. After taking in all the advice and opinions have bought my very first box of felt wad carts. On Saturday i blasted a pigeon on the deck with my first felt wad cart - feathers everywhere - it got back up and did a runner - cartridge number 2 blasted again - more feathers every where. Went to pick up and it was still with us and had to be despatched by hand - not good :o

And to boot they fogot to mention that felt wads just might give you an extra kick, the blo..dy things nearly did me in never mind the pigeon

I guess if this is the result of using felt wads i'm going to have to get a

three shot auto just to make sure each time

 

A pox on felt wads but i will still abide by the rules and use them cos thats the kind of guy i am

Cheers

Jim the geordie

[dunganick]

i would say theres something different going on there, prehaps you switched brand and the ones your using are faster or slower, meaning your not centering the pattern on them, having being in the reverse to yourself, ive never used plasitcs, and the few times ive shot woodies, i never have a problem.

 

i hate to shift the blame, but i dont think its the wadd, if your getting bashed about prehaps you changed the shot weight and now the velocity has changed and as above changed your required ammount of lead

[Country_est]

I agree with Nick on this. I have never shot anything other than fibre for game / living things in the last 15 years. Never had a problem with dead / runners, have had long range (40yd) high fast pigeons and pheasants that died instantly, also have 20yd runners and everything between. But as for shooting pigeons on the ground with a scatter gun got to remember that the pattern tends to be sightly hight than poa. Have you tried shooting them as they come in, also have you tried the gun / cart combination on clays or on a pattern plate to see if there are any holes Also have never shot anything other than rabbits on the ground, unless its a diver thats taking the pi$$ out of the dog.

 

Now for shooting with the plas wads, only use them on sssi's and waterways cos using the NON Toxics for wildfowling tends to mean I use steels with plastics.

[jpw99]

Thanks for the extra input to this near normant thread lads

I hear what you say. It's got to be down to human error - me I have two boxes on trial at the moment:-

Plastic -Saga Export30 -2 3/4 - 1 1/16oz - 30g - No6 at £3.10 per 25.

Felt -Saga Export30 -2 3/4 - 1 1/16oz - 30g - No6 at £3.50 per 25.

 

So i havn't changed the brand, only the wad type. I havn't done any clay practice at all, and have not used a plate to see the patern. I guess i could rig up a target easy enough out in the field, and i am now very much aware that a flying target is much more exposed than a sitting duck, and a kill with the first shot is much more likely. On a lighter note i suppose if the first shot does not kill it in the air then the susequent fall to the ground may well finish the job

I don't get pleasure from shooting sitting ducks but when you are desperate and they take you by surprise the natural reaction is to mount and shoot.

Cheers

Jim

[Guest Mr Pieman]

I have done a bit of research into this. A vet friend of mine - been a vet for 25 years - has never (and never personally know of) known an animal to die from eating a plastic wad. He says cows, as runimants, chew everything to ******* and readily spit out what doesn't chew well. also, their throats are large enough for a plastic wad to be easily swallowed.

 

Sheep die of all manner of things and no one ever has a post mortem done on them due to the cost - unless they die in significant numbers. He feels it is little more than an unban myth put round by manufacturers to encourage the uptake of fibre wads. Ecologically better - yes, danger to animals - no!!!!

 

PP

[the last engineer]

Thanks for the extra input to this near normant thread lads

I hear what you say. It's got to be down to human error - me   I have two boxes on trial at the moment:-

Plastic -Saga Export30 -2 3/4 - 1 1/16oz - 30g - No6 at £3.10 per 25.

Felt    -Saga Export30 -2 3/4 - 1 1/16oz - 30g - No6 at £3.50 per 25.

 

So i havn't changed the brand, only the wad type. I havn't done any clay practice at all, and have not used a plate to see the patern. I guess i could rig up a target easy enough out in the field, and i am now very much aware that a flying target is much more exposed than a sitting duck, and a kill with the first shot is much more likely. On a lighter note i suppose if the first shot does not kill it in the air then the susequent fall to the ground may well finish the job

I don't get pleasure from shooting sitting ducks but when you are desperate and they take you by surprise the natural reaction is to mount and shoot.

Cheers

Jim

Jim, theres nothing wrong with the loads your putting through ,either one will knock em dead in the air, i cant remember what gun you use ,think Biakel comes to mind , if its knocking you around its probably a light stock ,having no shock absorbing properties ,if not that then i would look at the way you mount your gun, it could be a simple fix if there's anyone close to you with a little knowledge , but fix it before it gets worse is my answer ,theres nothing worse than the feeling of imminent pain to follow the pulling of a trigger ,flinch city here we come .

 

 

Martin

[Big Dog]

JPW99 (Jim)

Two things I would add the the debate:

 

1: Shooting a sitting duck - I think any sitting target with a 12g is hard on your shoulder. I hate taking them even to pattern my guns. I think when you are in swing you either don't think about it the same or the moving energy of the swing reduces the recoil energy a little.

 

2. Please don't take offence to this, none intented. I have shot Baikals a view times an I alway found them to kick the shoulder off me. My best mate has one, he don't shoot 12g much, and its not an expensive gun either, but 1 shot can bruse my shoulder and cheek. A heavier gun with recoil pad may help.

[dunganick]

again i dont want to insult anyone here, but normally if your getting bashed about by a gun its down to a poor fit of your gun or a poor mount, i own a presentation grade baikal 25 yr old, and it weighs a bit less than a pen, and kicks like *******, so i now use low recoil 28gram carts, but dont use it for clays much, purely a field gun.

 

however it is a perfect fit, if not a little short, and its never bruised me, and i shot it with 30gram xlr's for a long time before bothering with other carts.

Edited July 19, 2005 by dunganick

[the last engineer]

again i dont want to insult anyone here, but normally if your getting bashed about by a gun its down to a poor fit of your gun or a poor mount, i own a presentation grade baikal 25 yr old, and it weighs a bit less than a pen, and kicks like *******, so i now use low recoil 28gram carts, but dont use it for clays much, purely a field gun.

 

however it is a perfect fit, if not a little short, and its never bruised me, and i shot it with 30gram xlr's for a long time before bothering with other carts.

your good to go with the set up you have Nick ,i recall you telling me of your shoulder's , unfourtunatly others arent ,we all mount a guns differantly,look at the number of stock configurations out there, in many shot presentations ,eg L2R R2L overhead incoming outgoing and so on ,the movement of the gun determines where it sits in your shoulder,and to where the energy is directed .

 

Take an overhead for example, all the force back down into your carcass ,you realy need an absorber ,quality gun or good pad and padding , most crossing birds are taken with the swing ,as BigDog said the engery is spent in the inertia of the swing ,an incomer is again a bad one if not handled right ,your body should roll back with the swing absoring recoil again .

 

Anyway as for me and my way, it's certanly aint for the many ,my shoulder may come into contact with the gun on a lot of birds but not all ,the gun is fired when the picture is right ,all my guns are solid quality stocks taking a lot of recoil from my arms and shoulder .

 

As to your Baikal Jim, having owned one and shot others , its not my 10th or 11th choice, they are renowned for recoil and have been for years, the quality of stock is poor and light hence the price level on the guns themselves, your going to get what you pay for yeh .

 

No offence to nick and his trusty steed ,hes the lucky one it works for him .

good luckin your shooting Jim .

 

 

Martin

[jpw99]

Lads thanks yet again, having read the last several posts i'm almost filling up with emotion at your sincere concerns for my welfare All points well taken To clarify a point i made regarding the kick from the new felt wads i have just started on --- the shots that i have taken just prior to using the new felt carts were i found easy peasy and soft as a babies bum on the shoulder, and to boot they were even very easy on the ear Therefore it just came as a bit of a shock to the system when i fired my first two felt carts expecting them to be the same .and i have to confess i was rolling a fag at the time when this bird dropped in and i just grabbed for my gun and snatched at it, and if truth be known, did not mount it properly B) So there you have it - my pain -my fault.

I am quite familiar with the kick on this baikal, and have in the past been ready for it with no proplems - it could of course just be old age creeping up

Now if you have not fallen asleep - this next bit is going to crease you because i'm gona throw fat onto a fire :o :o Have just spoken with my syndicate leader (should have done so at first -difficult to get hold of) and and and he tells me ALL our shoots are aware we use plastic and have no problems with it AT ALL How about that then, looks like i won't be throwing them plastics away after all Cheers, Jim