Anth6568 Posted December 24, 2011 Report Share Posted December 24, 2011 Hello all, I've been reloading shotgun ammunition for a number of years now, typically for wildfowling. Im interested in exploring the "buffering area". Is there anyone out there that has experience in reloading steel shot with buffering compound? What is the best buffering compound for steel? Happy Xmas to you all! Regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B525 LIGHT Posted December 24, 2011 Report Share Posted December 24, 2011 I'm not sure it would give you any advantage with steel. With lead it cushions the pellets from one another durring the set back pressure encountered upon firing and prevents damage by pellets knocking against one another therefore maintaining a better pellet shape. It allows the pellets to almost move as one object. With Steel being so hard however it needs to be able to move individualy in order to squeeze through the choke therfore I'd question wether it may even be detrimental in a steel load. Just my two pennies worth... Merry Christmas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fruitloop Posted December 24, 2011 Report Share Posted December 24, 2011 the b/p lads and girls use semalena as a buffer at my club (cheep and it works) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted December 25, 2011 Report Share Posted December 25, 2011 the b/p lads and girls use semalena as a buffer at my club (cheep and it works) i bet the lads who shoot bp, have never used steel, progressive burn powder, plasic cup wad with no compression section. steel is a completely different beast in reloading terms, buffer can make a load hold together, and it can do nothing to a load. the buffer used in steel shells is a low density hard plastic pieces. i would be more inclined to use buffer with steel only if i cant get the load to pattern through open chokes. only use buffer thats listed and the ammount used. some loads are very pressure sensitive, where the pressure is high just to get good clean burn, adding buffer to these can produce a overpressured cartridge, however i`d only ever use it on loads that have a specialised slow burning powder, and that the pressure is 3k psi below max, and if the load needed to pattern. as steel is completely different to lead, i`d also assume the buffering would be totally different too. plastic beads are common. i have seen flour,wheat,sawdust,milled cork, and all sorts of stuff being used. the one issue, buffer can make the shotcolumn rise in the wad. thats very bad with steel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anth6568 Posted December 26, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2011 i bet the lads who shoot bp, have never used steel, progressive burn powder, plasic cup wad with no compression section. steel is a completely different beast in reloading terms, buffer can make a load hold together, and it can do nothing to a load. the buffer used in steel shells is a low density hard plastic pieces. i would be more inclined to use buffer with steel only if i cant get the load to pattern through open chokes. only use buffer thats listed and the ammount used. some loads are very pressure sensitive, where the pressure is high just to get good clean burn, adding buffer to these can produce a overpressured cartridge, however i`d only ever use it on loads that have a specialised slow burning powder, and that the pressure is 3k psi below max, and if the load needed to pattern. as steel is completely different to lead, i`d also assume the buffering would be totally different too. plastic beads are common. i have seen flour,wheat,sawdust,milled cork, and all sorts of stuff being used. the one issue, buffer can make the shotcolumn rise in the wad. thats very bad with steel. Thanks for the replies At the minute I dont have any recipes for buffered steel, and from reading these articles and others on the web I don't fancy getting the psi wrong. I have been reloading steel for a while now, but always from recipes that I have been given. Im trying to make a decent 36g 4mm steel cart in 3inch 12 bore, I have good 32g ones that have plenty of power when it comes to knocking Canada and Greylag geese down. The only problem is that being 32g 4mm at 40yards the pattern is starting to look thin, hence the up grade to 36g in increase pattern density or to make a buffered 32g that gives better patterns. The psi on the 32g one is right up there so I don't really fancy adding to that and making things worse, I could lower the velocity (less powder) and then add the buffer maybe?, I have used shop bought ones and they pattern great at 40y but seem to have a serious lack of power at that range. Does anyone have any 32g 4mm buffered / 36g 4mm load recipes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted December 26, 2011 Report Share Posted December 26, 2011 Thanks for the replies At the minute I dont have any recipes for buffered steel, and from reading these articles and others on the web I don't fancy getting the psi wrong. I have been reloading steel for a while now, but always from recipes that I have been given. Im trying to make a decent 36g 4mm steel cart in 3inch 12 bore, I have good 32g ones that have plenty of power when it comes to knocking Canada and Greylag geese down. The only problem is that being 32g 4mm at 40yards the pattern is starting to look thin, hence the up grade to 36g in increase pattern density or to make a buffered 32g that gives better patterns. The psi on the 32g one is right up there so I don't really fancy adding to that and making things worse, I could lower the velocity (less powder) and then add the buffer maybe?, I have used shop bought ones and they pattern great at 40y but seem to have a serious lack of power at that range. Does anyone have any 32g 4mm buffered / 36g 4mm load recipes? thatsh why they pattern better, because they are slower. i would persue a decent 36g /4mm recipe. but that will take you into 3.5" loads. especially with that large shotsize. bbs are quite common for geese. the buffer you want is mix 47 for steel, although there are some other ones. both are polymer type (thats plastic.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roughshooter Posted December 26, 2011 Report Share Posted December 26, 2011 PM Sent Regards Graham Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anth6568 Posted December 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 Thanks for the good advice gents, especially to rough shooter for the recipes. I'm sure there will be more questions to ponder over as a move along. Regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pavman Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 you dont need to buffer steel (no compression) strip down a factory load and you will not find any unless its used as a top off (Remmington) choke can also lead to a blow of the pattern with larger shot sizes. I did lots of testing of a number of steel loads, for my own benifit and found a full open choke much more effective on a nice pattern @ 50 yards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 you dont need to buffer steel (no compression) strip down a factory load and you will not find any unless its used as a top off (Remmington) choke can also lead to a blow of the pattern with larger shot sizes. I did lots of testing of a number of steel loads, for my own benifit and found a full open choke much more effective on a nice pattern @ 50 yards. +1 buffer can be used to fill a wad to make it tight, and not rattle. its often used with ill fitting loads ie light payloads, large wads etc.. steel does not respond well to choke, so shooting cylinders in the first instance is advised, especially with a patterning session. sometimes skeet can produce a full pattern. these superhard wildfowling chokes are designed to lightly choke loads so the actuall restriction is low, but the names are "full " or pass shooting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coyotemaster Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 The Remington Nitro's are/were buffered, must be a reason. I have shot steel Ts with and without and really never noticed a difference in killing range. Ballistic Products booklet STATUS OF STEEL list several loads using buffer,Tyvek overshot patches and other esoteric gimmicks that may or may not work. Choke does matter, patterning your gun is the only way to know what your gun likes/needs. I find mine pattern best with modified or improved modified and large shot. This is on the patterning board NOT the flyway where a more open choke may seem to kill better by virtue of a larger yet less dense pattern. I am after the tightest long range pattern I can get for pass shooting geese, your mileage may vary with your intended range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anth6568 Posted December 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 The Remington Nitro's are/were buffered, must be a reason. I have shot steel Ts with and without and really never noticed a difference in killing range. Ballistic Products booklet STATUS OF STEEL list several loads using buffer,Tyvek overshot patches and other esoteric gimmicks that may or may not work. Choke does matter, patterning your gun is the only way to know what your gun likes/needs. I find mine pattern best with modified or improved modified and large shot. This is on the patterning board NOT the flyway where a more open choke may seem to kill better by virtue of a larger yet less dense pattern. I am after the tightest long range pattern I can get for pass shooting geese, your mileage may vary with your intended range. Hello Im know im changing the subject slighly but what sort of steel cartridges and type of choke are you using? Regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coyotemaster Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 Hello Im know im changing the subject slighly but what sort of steel cartridges and type of choke are you using? Regards I am hand loading the following hulls- Remington T6, Federals and s few Fiocchis all currently in 10 ga. as I do not shoot many ducks anymore and the 10 is a much superior tool to the 3.5 12 ga. for pass shooting geese. That has to do with bore diameter and shot column length. I load 1 1/2 oz. loads of T or BBB at 1500fps w/ Blue Dot powder (amount depends on case) I have a variety of chokes for the 10 ga. and where I find the best patterns with steel shot falls between .015 and .025 constriction. I am currently using Trulock tubes that are hardened stainless steel(trulockchokes.com) I do think there is some improvement with steel loads with an elongated forcing cone. My first 10 ga. barrel had one and I think it helped a bit if nothing else than for less recoil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anth6568 Posted January 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 I am hand loading the following hulls- Remington T6, Federals and s few Fiocchis all currently in 10 ga. as I do not shoot many ducks anymore and the 10 is a much superior tool to the 3.5 12 ga. for pass shooting geese. That has to do with bore diameter and shot column length. I load 1 1/2 oz. loads of T or BBB at 1500fps w/ Blue Dot powder (amount depends on case) I have a variety of chokes for the 10 ga. and where I find the best patterns with steel shot falls between .015 and .025 constriction. I am currently using Trulock tubes that are hardened stainless steel(trulockchokes.com) I do think there is some improvement with steel loads with an elongated forcing cone. My first 10 ga. barrel had one and I think it helped a bit if nothing else than for less recoil. Hello I've seen quite a lot of inforamtion on the Trulock Chokes, Randy Wakeman has some good articles on the web. As for the Chokes, ive ordered one already but they are very hard to get hold of in the restriction you talk about. The one ive ordered is the Precison Hunter for the Browning invector plus. Im going carry out some more pattern testing when it arrives. I went wildfowling on the North east coast the other week and met some very good people up their who share the same interest. One of them had a 10b and we went on a goose shoot one morning. He explained all about the pattern, increased ranged etc, and i must say i felt my 12b 3ich was somewhat inferior after the conversation. Although i did hit a pinkfoot the day before! The main goose cartridge im using is a 12b 3inch 32g 4mm steel flying at around 1550ft/sec. This has plenty of power but lacks the pattern at 40 plus yards. As i stated before its back to the pattern testing i think. I have a few more recipies that i have been given by another Pigeonwatch member that i am going to try soon as well. Thats the problem with reloading, you always want to tinker to make things better!!! What sort of ranges are you engaging waterfowl with at Pass shooting? Happy New Year!! Regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coyotemaster Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 I will PM you on details Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anth6568 Posted January 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) I will PM you on details Hello Sorry for the delay, Ive been out doing some crop protection over the past few days. Anyway, back to the topic! Thanks for the excellent information on steel shot,ranges and sizes etc. I have some fun times ahead trying some of these out. Im going to source myself some new shot and im going to start reloading again. With regards to the Tom Roster videos, ive seen one on u-tube that lasted around 30min. It was very informative with regards to steel shot size,speed,choke etc. He makes it look all so easy! My choke is on order!! Thanks again Edited January 4, 2012 by Anth6568 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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