fruitloop Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) the reason thay use it is probably the same reason thay all have snap on tools in the usa...no not for the life time grantee as the snap on grantee is worth nothing . the reason is that its cheep Edited February 10, 2012 by fruitloop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Ackley ,I wasent referring to you personaly as being a tackle tart . Although it now looks as if you include your self in that catagory . Happy hunting . Harnser . its not a case of being a "tackle tart" I like to save a penny as much as the next man,but what you fail,,to grap is "thiungs move on" the quality of rifle building = more accurate the quality of factory ammo = better consistancy with reloading its moved on massive over the past 10 years,people now know you havnt got to accept a 4 inch group,you can do better by modern reloading techniques. powder,bullets,primers have all got better,which means much better performance and accuracy can be attacheieved,its OK you saying your happy with your results and you dont need anyhting else bat LEE,obvioulsy you havnt made the jump to better yourself,this is OK if your happy but telling others to stay at that level isnt right,you must tell the whole story I have never said LEE gear wont make resonable ammo,it will.BUT with modern time and modern techniques one can do better. if you dont wnat to move with the times that fair enough but dont knock people or advcie people not to do it I still use cheapo dies for certain peoples calibers I reload for they work well but there not LEE you dont need to spend a fortune to get the best out of your rifle,just use decent stuff which will last a life time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Totally agree with you Harnser, Ackley is indeed a tackle tart (never heard of that one before) Not many jumping up and agreeing with him either, so far Lee is getting the vote for being a good investment for the the money, and if I could only get 4inch groups and it wasnt me I would be sending my dies back. If you asked the question ' why is there a round thing on the end of the shaft' most would say to change gear with, Ackley's response would surely be to stop your hand slipping off. I dont need people to jump up and agree with me this is the wrong site for the serious precision shooter,Iam just stating the facts there is better out there and for not a lot more money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 How much accuracy do you need to shoot deer and kill them clean at say a maximum range of 200 yards . My Ruger will shoot M.O.A. at 100 yards ,thats more than enough accuracy for me .I dont need to spend a fortune on another press and dies to get it to shoot 1/2 inch groups at 100 yards . Harnser . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) How much accuracy do you need to shoot deer and kill them clean at say a maximum range of 200 yards . My Ruger will shoot M.O.A. at 100 yards ,thats more than enough accuracy for me .I dont need to spend a fortune on another press and dies to get it to shoot 1/2 inch groups at 100 yards . Harnser . I give up,just becasue you are happy doesnt mean others are,its a big wide world out there and people expect different things,why comprimise on accuarcy when by simple techniques and using different items you can better one self. I know old timers "no offence" who would only shoot at 100 yards and be happy to hit a dinner plate,with a bit of help they get more confident and are then amazed at what be attacheived even though they may have been shooting or reloading for 30 years. I take people out with me and let them shoot at targete at serious distance,once they have had a bit of coaching there amazed at what "they" can do things move on,just like anything in life,confidence in yourself and your equipment is key Edited February 10, 2012 by Ackley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fruitloop Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) right guys i know i have not been reloading for long and yes i have the lee kit i was a little disappointed in the scale as when i zeroed it and then set it to 50gr to put a test wate on e.g. a 50gr head it was miles off so was it the built head thats out or the scales i tested 10 all came out the same so i understand what ackley is on about conserning quality of the lee Edited February 10, 2012 by fruitloop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedwards1966 Posted February 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 After looking on Henry Krank's site, it looks like the basic presses are £27, dies start at £15. Assuming I've got this right and they are suitable for my job then that's a little better than the basic kit I first saw. I'm not sure what I'd need to spend on scales, but so far I'm at £42. Most people seem to be saying Lee is OK. If primers cost £30/1000= 3p each Bullets £22/hundred= 22p each Powder £40/lb (7000gr), 44 grains per round = 25p I've probably got enough cases to last some time even without using my silver ones, so it looks like they'll cost 50p each. That seems a bit better than 1.63 each - once I've paid for the gear and assuming I manage not to get too addicted! That said after finding a load that works fine for me I might end up shooting it a bit more as the cost won't be such a concern. Have I got my figures about right, and what would scales cost? It's a pity I haven't been a member of PW long enough to see the sales section, as second hand gear would be fine for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redgum Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Ackley what cloud you on mate, my apologies in advance if your a target shooter practicing for a place to represent your country in a few months time. You say you don't doupt lee can produce reasonably accurate ammunition, wrong, it will and does make very good ammunition. I'm sure a marksman and experience reloader can produce more accuracy with lee gear than an idiot with the most expensive kit. The 'Old timers' you so often mention have problably forgotten more field craft than you will ever learn but things in the field have not change( except more lowland deer ) Lee isnt sold out of the back of a museum door, its modern kit that wins competetions. When I am scrabbling over rocks and fallen trees in pursuit of a group of fallow does that need thinning out everything has to come together in the final squeeze of the trigger,scope and rifle and me. Reliablility is the thing, if I could only shoot a 2inch group at 100yds that would be enough out to 200yds as long as it was consistent.In the freezing cold with knumb fingers ,no bags or bench to rest on a rifle that shoots little cloverleaf groups is of no use if your not good enough. I have been out stalking time and time again in the worse of conditions with 'old timers' and certainly learnt alot about the importance of 'little tiny groups'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redgum Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) After looking on Henry Krank's site, it looks like the basic presses are £27, dies start at £15. Assuming I've got this right and they are suitable for my job then that's a little better than the basic kit I first saw. I'm not sure what I'd need to spend on scales, but so far I'm at £42. Most people seem to be saying Lee is OK. If primers cost £30/1000= 3p each Bullets £22/hundred= 22p each Powder £40/lb (7000gr), 44 grains per round = 25p I've probably got enough cases to last some time even without using my silver ones, so it looks like they'll cost 50p each. That seems a bit better than 1.63 each - once I've paid for the gear and assuming I manage not to get too addicted! That said after finding a load that works fine for me I might end up shooting it a bit more as the cost won't be such a concern. Have I got my figures about right, and what would scales cost? It's a pity I haven't been a member of PW long enough to see the sales section, as second hand gear would be fine for me. Nowt wrong with your calculations, plus its good fun to do and very satisfying to use. I will say that lee scales are not the easiest things to use but will get you started.RCBS scales come up on ebay quite often. Ps think you will see more secondhand stuff on fleabay. Edited February 10, 2012 by Redgum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fruitloop Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) guys I'm finding that some of you have a little problem with ackley.i know him on a personal basis and have found him to be a real nice guy and helpfull. like when i was looking for a rifle and what cal he even taken me to fetch it. helped me with the brass when i first got my rifle reloading kit plus being taken out with him on his permission .he has a Passion for what he dose some of you may read arrogance in to that but its not.he just knows what hes talking about Edited February 10, 2012 by fruitloop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedwards1966 Posted February 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 I'm just up the road from you if you want to have a natter and see my setup. It's not top wack gear, but has been doing the job for years "very" efficiently. 70gn Nostler BT's are good out to 260 yds, without hold over, in my .243. Be warned though. If you do down your own reloading path, it can become addictive, but extremely satisfying to see your own handy work doing the job Thanks, if I end up getting into reloading it'd be great to see how it's actually done. When you say up the road where are you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Ackley what cloud you on mate, my apologies in advance if your a target shooter practicing for a place to represent your country in a few months time. You say you don't doupt lee can produce reasonably accurate ammunition, wrong, it will and does make very good ammunition. I'm sure a marksman and experience reloader can produce more accuracy with lee gear than an idiot with the most expensive kit. I am always on cloud 9 as iam always happy unlike some on here,no Iam not a target shooter its something thats never really interested me,but one day I may have a go,alwasy best to try different things in life,I have always said LEE will produce ammo but to what standars is questionable,so how can I be wrong.yes i agree someone who hasnt a clue what to do will make a hash even using the best gear on the market,same as anything else i suspose,but thats why people ask questions to gain form the experiences of others The 'Old timers' you so often mention have problably forgotten more field craft than you will ever learn but things in the field have not change( except more lowland deer ) your are quite correct WE can all learn something from someone,its a shame others on here fail to accept this,everyone i have ever been out with I have picked up some tips,even the old timers can learn modern tecniques. I dont agree "things havnt changed in the field" yes they have with modern ballistics and modern equipment which enables you to be able to place a bullet at further distances,which years ago was unheard of,this prooving my point everyone can progress even the old timers,thats if there willing to try and learn Lee isnt sold out of the back of a museum door, its modern kit that wins competetions. When I am scrabbling over rocks and fallen trees in pursuit of a group of fallow does that need thinning out everything has to come together in the final squeeze of the trigger,scope and rifle and me. Reliablility is the thing, if I could only shoot a 2inch group at 100yds that would be enough out to 200yds as long as it was consistent.In the freezing cold with knumb fingers ,no bags or bench to rest on a rifle that shoots little cloverleaf groups is of no use if your not good enough. I have been out stalking time and time again in the worse of conditions with 'old timers' and certainly learnt alot about the importance of 'little tiny groups'. no one has ever said LEE is sold from a museum,but please show me where comps are won using this gear,if you care to go over to 6mm BR you will find out what the top guys are using or even try looking at UK varminting, you or I cab scrabble over any obsticle you like this dosent mean one has to put up with sun standard ammo,accruracy kill at the end of the day,but the difference is when you have done all your scrabbling and the deer has moved on just that bit out of your range,the guy with an accuarate rifle and load will be able to still take the shot unlkie the guy who has no confidence and has to go home empty handed,the skilled hunter will alwasy be able to adapt under any conditions using to rest on whats ever is available,at the end of the day do "you" take a shot having a suitable rest as i know i dont that would be irresponsable at 100 yards or 500 yards.so yes silly little tiny groups does come in handy at any time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cockercas Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 i got bored reading the same thing that happens in every reloading thread with the same handful of people. you do know there is an option to ignore the others posts!!!!!. i load with lee. i shoot foxes upto 300 meters with 58gr vmax.(.243) no hold over (45mm high @ 100 meters) im pretty happy with the gear. except with the powder funnel which is inaccurate and dispenses charges in different weights. probably my fault tho, its only done it since i moved Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mereside Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) just come across this post what a load of tosh people post about these kits ,these are very good and very accurate you wont load a more accurate load with a press as apposed to the classic loader i use one for 270 and is superb one thing that you wont do with a press is take it to the range and tweak your loads like a classic loader make a batch up at home at the longest aol and take the loader to the range and tweak it there you can load as quick with one as the press there is no difference the only thing is if you want to get into loading very cheap and want great rounds buy one you will not look back ,atb wayne ps bedwards im in hornsea if you want to see some reloading on my 270 and 300 winmag and see a classic loader in action http://www.ebay.com/itm/LEE-243-Winchester-CLASSIC-LOADER-COMPLETE-90235-NEW-/390086807220?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5ad2fc4eb4 this might be cheaper this is my sako 300 win loaded with lee gear Edited February 10, 2012 by mereside Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redgum Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 i got bored reading the same thing that happens in every reloading thread with the same handful of people. you do know there is an option to ignore the others posts!!!!!. i load with lee. i shoot foxes upto 300 meters with 58gr vmax.(.243) no hold over (45mm high @ 100 meters) im pretty happy with the gear. except with the powder funnel which is inaccurate and dispenses charges in different weights. probably my fault tho, its only done it since i moved My apologies as I'm probably on the list as 'same handful of people'. It just makes me mad ahow someone who is obvioulsy experienced just rights off something which throws out the wrong message. Quite a few people I know reload because its just so darn expensive to buy ammo unless your rifle shoots ppu or you can get it locally. To go out and spend loads of dosh which they don't have on reloading gear doesnt equate and to say Lee is rubbish just makes those on a budget think reloading is out of their league. Its a great hobby and very satisfying to shoot your dinner with your homeloads. You can start at a budget level and add things as you go along. Its not perfect, take your powder measure, but you will have to spend a lot of money to get one that is( personally I weigh all my loads) I have slowly added bits and pieces as I have learnt more about the subject but those very first rnds loaded with all lee gear really did put a smile on my face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mereside Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) just one other thing on the classic loader it held a guiness record for the most smallest group at a 1000yrds for over seven years so cant be bad,atb wayne http://www.titanreloading.com/presses/classic-lee-loader Edited February 10, 2012 by mereside Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 just one other thing on the classic loader it held a guiness record for the most smallest group at a 1000yrds for over seven years so cant be bad,atb wayne http://www.titanreloading.com/presses/classic-lee-loader do your homework correctly mate in 1993 Robert Fry shot the world 1000 yard record using a LEE collect die,go take a look now at what is beomg used and the group sizes that have halfed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) just one other thing on the classic loader it held a guiness record for the most smallest group at a 1000yrds for over seven years so cant be bad,atb wayne http://www.titanreloading.com/presses/classic-lee-loader Some good info and points there ... It's not tht anyone picks on anyone but there are some on here who are down right obnoxious and play the big man at the keyboard....it's so immature that I sometimes think i't been typed by one of my kids! There are entry of people who can vouch that factory loads and loads made with LEE gear are perfectly accurate... Regards, Gixer Edited February 10, 2012 by gixer1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redgum Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Lee gets my vote, as this lousy accuracy is enough for my hunting needs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 right guys i know i have not been reloading for long and yes i have the lee kit i was a little disappointed in the scale as when i zeroed it and then set it to 50gr to put a test wate on e.g. a 50gr head it was miles off so was it the built head thats out or the scales i tested 10 all came out the same so i understand what ackley is on about conserning quality of the lee Have you considered the fact that the bullet heads might be the most important factor here? you check scales with check weights not bullet heads. Many scales read different i recon, a lot has to do with conditions. when in the loading room its consistancy thats the important not the actual numbers, thats one good reason to work up a load Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cockercas Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 My apologies as I'm probably on the list as 'same handful of people'. It just makes me mad ahow someone who is obvioulsy experienced just rights off something which throws out the wrong message. Quite a few people I know reload because its just so darn expensive to buy ammo unless your rifle shoots ppu or you can get it locally. To go out and spend loads of dosh which they don't have on reloading gear doesnt equate and to say Lee is rubbish just makes those on a budget think reloading is out of their league. Its a great hobby and very satisfying to shoot your dinner with your homeloads. You can start at a budget level and add things as you go along. Its not perfect, take your powder measure, but you will have to spend a lot of money to get one that is( personally I weigh all my loads) I have slowly added bits and pieces as I have learnt more about the subject but those very first rnds loaded with all lee gear really did put a smile on my face. no apologies needed i just skipped the banter. each to there own but no need to lower the tone (not directed at anybody). if ackleys had bad lee gear then its going to give him a biased opinion. as with anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mereside Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 right guys i know i have not been reloading for long and yes i have the lee kit i was a little disappointed in the scale as when i zeroed it and then set it to 50gr to put a test wate on e.g. a 50gr head it was miles off so was it the built head thats out or the scales i tested 10 all came out the same so i understand what ackley is on about conserning quality of the lee fruitloop are you using the beam scales from lee ? if so can you not just set the scales up properly as per instructions using your checkweight and lock it off for perfect weights everytime sorry if i have read your post wrong . once you have it set up and its used in the same place it should read properly,atb wayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 I have mentioned this before but at just 100yds you can throw powder loads that are visually different and still get good results, many get very huffy about loading but many would be suprised by the things they think improve a load that actually has no effect whatsoever outside of the shooters mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3800lloyd Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 ime not in a hurry to load ,so i bought a basic lee hand press , trimming tool ,hand primer ,rcbs 505 scales and powder trickler , cheap set up but works a treat load 223 no problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Lee gets my vote, as this lousy accuracy is enough for my hunting needs Not good enough Redgum , if you spend a couple of grand on expensive reloading gear you will be able to have a one hole group . Mind you , I always get a one hole group when I shoot one round groups . I have always been taught that the first shot is the one that matters . Harnser . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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