feeding the field

[The Beater]

Well as it has been sorted that it is not illigal to feed a field then i suppose that it is up to whoever owns or is shooting the land. i for one would not ever feed a field as it would cost to much to keep the field fed. also i would have no intentions to shoot 700 birds in one session. i for one would be happier in myself knowing that in difficult conditions i was able to shoot 30-40 then being able to shoot 250 easy without really having to put much effort into reconnosence and decoying and hide placement etc. that is what makes pigeon shooting, pigeon shooting to me its unpredictable and if you put in hard work then you get good results. i am preventing the pigeons from eating the crop and i am also testing my shooting and field craft, which is what its all about. this is just my opinion.

 

 

well said, all this talk of feeding a fields is a joke. i reckon you'll need at least a ton of wheat £200ish for starters, how you gonna get it to field, how you gonna spread it etc.... unless you get farmer with fork lift then tractor with vicon spreader to go spread it for you. then he'll think you,ve got money to burn and wants you to pay to shoot from now on. just get out there find where there feeding and use good field craft. fair enough if some big estate or pigeon guide wants to do it and charge some french guns £500 each per day, there not doing anything for are sport, or crop protection. just the money.

 

rant over

[tosspot]

I'll have my two penneth then. Baiting fields is commonly done on large estates to funnel birds away from high value crops- The reason you have never heard of it is because all of you never been invited to shoot such a field after it has been baited. Normally it is reserved for the select view around the game keeper or farm manager. These fields are known as 'Engineered'.

 

These practices are often also used by pigeon guides to ensure good shooting, and if someone was to ring BASC or DEFRA they would clearly clarify the stance on the situation regarding this.

 

The last time I shot a fed field with two other guns we took over 700 birds of it in one session. So what would you rather do?

Chase around endless rape fields like we do throughout the winter- Have one or two shots and they all clear off

 

Or go to a 50 acre field and shoot 250 a piece?

 

Fair comment, but I still believe that under the terms of the general licence, should this be tested in court, there would be a case to answer. I can appreciate the thinking behind doing it for commercial reasons but have never actually heard of it being done, especially since the price of grain has gone through the roof.

 

The keepers that I know personally are actually too busy running about and organising the shooting day(sss) etc to have time to go pigeon shooting.

As much as they would enjoy it.

 

D2D

 

 

could a comparison be drawn from the guy who i believe was successfully prosecuted for attracting starlings into his garden then shooting them

 

of course at a time when starlings were on the list

 

 

i find the "official" stance on this from the BASC surprising

 

 

who would want to be the guinea pig and potentially risk screwing up pigeon shooting as we know it

 

 

nobody brought up roost shooting, think about it, discuss further

 

TP

[henry d]

Outlaw,

 

Iam sure that if you read the post again you will find that the post by Henryd was tounge and cheek........something that yes even mods are allowed to do

 

However I would suggest that if you have a problem with H's response that you take it up by PM.

 

NTTF

I understand what you are saying Dan but the simple fact is He has made it clear that it is illegal, not in bad spirit and

 

that is against the forum rules surley for deliberately missleading forum users.

 

If I blatantly lied to a genuine question how would that make me look.

 

This isnt just about HenryD.

 

If Pirate or Mrs Sweepy or You had posted it like that my response would be the same.

 

Tongue in cheek isnt easily conveyed by written text so maybe it should be factual and not tongue in cheek anymore.

 

It is hard enough trying to communicate your points of veiw on here as it is, so from the hip and to the point I am being.

 

Have a nice white Christmas you lucky so & so by the way

 

Tony

 

 

Yes Tony (BTW - thanks for the PM), it was a tongue in cheek reply I think that the anti`s would like to bring these things to light like they have with foxhunting, so my reply was simply to volunteer you for the duty fall guy

 

I don`t think for a moment that any police force would prosecute anyone baiting a field, however there was an instance of a field being baited for geese during hard weather and many 100`s of geese were allegedly shot by foreign shooters and many many more died due to leadshot being ingested with the food/grit, that in itself is 100% unacceptable and I also think it is unacceptable to bait fields for woodpigeon for similar reasons.

 

My apologies for not replying earlier as I have been busy pickling my liver and working etc. over the past few days

[Nildes]

Well, looking at the posts since my last one where I replied to the suggestion that baiting with grain was somehow "unsporting" whereas baiting with decoys is somehow more "sporting". I see that there's the further suggestion that baiting is or might be illegal as a means to pest control of problem birds.

As I interpret it, the birds need to be killed as near as possible to where they are doing the damage to ensure that they are the same ones. However, that doesn't necessarily mean actually on the crop or out in the field.

The Pest Controller also has a duty to be humane and that involves ensuring that he kills as cleanly and quickly as possible without causing uneccessary suffering.

He also has to be effective. There's nothing in the law concerning the control of Schedule2 part 2 about being "Sporting".

"Sporting" that's an entirely artificial construct that shooters impose on themselves.

So, I can't see a prosecution case being brought because a shooter is "Unsporting".

You are required to be "Humane" and its illegal to cause any species, whether a pest or not suffering

You are far more likely to be the target of presecutions being brought by the RSPCA for shooting and wounding birds and failing to promptly despatch them..

I would suggest that the use of hides, decoys and baits are all means to the end of ensuring that the birds concerned are brought within a close enough range to ensure that this happens.

You should firstly establish a case for damage and be able to point out the flightlines of pest birds over where you can safely shoot the culprits from.

 

 

Firstly you need to be able to show damage to a crop to any lawful authority enquiring.

Secondly, you should choose a safe location nearby where, having allowed for wind and normal flight lines you can intercept the pests before they do more damage.

Thirdly, you should set up your decoys in a pattern, perhaps feeding around a grain bait in front of your hide and ensure that you only shoot birds that really do come into a killing zone where you can drop them dead.

 

Leaving piles of dead pigeons around, bragging about bag sizes and long range shots etc doesn't really add up to effective and controlled pest management and is likely to attract attention and scrutiny.

So, is it apples or is it oranges? What are we really talking about here? Sport or Pest Control?

[Guest The Outlaw]

Outlaw,

 

Iam sure that if you read the post again you will find that the post by Henryd was tounge and cheek........something that yes even mods are allowed to do

 

However I would suggest that if you have a problem with H's response that you take it up by PM.

 

NTTF

I understand what you are saying Dan but the simple fact is He has made it clear that it is illegal, not in bad spirit and

 

that is against the forum rules surley for deliberately missleading forum users.

 

If I blatantly lied to a genuine question how would that make me look.

 

This isnt just about HenryD.

 

If Pirate or Mrs Sweepy or You had posted it like that my response would be the same.

 

Tongue in cheek isnt easily conveyed by written text so maybe it should be factual and not tongue in cheek anymore.

 

It is hard enough trying to communicate your points of veiw on here as it is, so from the hip and to the point I am being.

 

Have a nice white Christmas you lucky so & so by the way

 

Tony

 

 

Yes Tony (BTW - thanks for the PM), it was a tongue in cheek reply I think that the anti`s would like to bring these things to light like they have with foxhunting, so my reply was simply to volunteer you for the duty fall guy

 

I don`t think for a moment that any police force would prosecute anyone baiting a field, however there was an instance of a field being baited for geese during hard weather and many 100`s of geese were allegedly shot by foreign shooters and many many more died due to leadshot being ingested with the food/grit, that in itself is 100% unacceptable and I also think it is unacceptable to bait fields for woodpigeon for similar reasons.

 

My apologies for not replying earlier as I have been busy pickling my liver and working etc. over the past few days

 

Thanks HenryD Can I add that I am sorry if I took your commment the wrong way and applogise for trying to make you look

 

Stupid, I know you are not and I need to look between the lines a bit less.

 

Cheers HenryD

 

Hope you and your family have a great Christmas

 

Tony

[tealer]

Well, looking at the posts since my last one where I replied to the suggestion that baiting with grain was somehow "unsporting" whereas baiting with decoys is somehow more "sporting". I see that there's the further suggestion that baiting is or might be illegal as a means to pest control of problem birds.

As I interpret it, the birds need to be killed as near as possible to where they are doing the damage to ensure that they are the same ones. However, that doesn't necessarily mean actually on the crop or out in the field.

The Pest Controller also has a duty to be humane and that involves ensuring that he kills as cleanly and quickly as possible without causing uneccessary suffering.

He also has to be effective. There's nothing in the law concerning the control of Schedule2 part 2 about being "Sporting".

"Sporting" that's an entirely artificial construct that shooters impose on themselves.

So, I can't see a prosecution case being brought because a shooter is "Unsporting".

You are required to be "Humane" and its illegal to cause any species, whether a pest or not suffering

You are far more likely to be the target of presecutions being brought by the RSPCA for shooting and wounding birds and failing to promptly despatch them..

I would suggest that the use of hides, decoys and baits are all means to the end of ensuring that the birds concerned are brought within a close enough range to ensure that this happens.

You should firstly establish a case for damage and be able to point out the flightlines of pest birds over where you can safely shoot the culprits from.

 

 

Firstly you need to be able to show damage to a crop to any lawful authority enquiring.

Secondly, you should choose a safe location nearby where, having allowed for wind and normal flight lines you can intercept the pests before they do more damage.

Thirdly, you should set up your decoys in a pattern, perhaps feeding around a grain bait in front of your hide and ensure that you only shoot birds that really do come into a killing zone where you can drop them dead.

 

Leaving piles of dead pigeons around, bragging about bag sizes and long range shots etc doesn't really add up to effective and controlled pest management and is likely to attract attention and scrutiny.

So, is it apples or is it oranges? What are we really talking about here? Sport or Pest Control?

 

The present laws that exist today as far as pigeon shooting are concerned do not evolve around the practice of sport, however we also must not purely defend ourselves as pest controllers and also promote the 'sporting value'. For me, the lack of this reason has seen the demise of fox hunting in the UK. This post on feeding the fields only highlights the many current misconceptions that are held between people on the same side and could only show weakness to the many powerful adversaries of country 'sports'. So my answer to this is 'BOTH', by feeding the one non value field i have provided the quickest maximum protection for all the high value surrounding fields, that equates to minimum damage. The concentration of pigeon now on the non value field means i have efficiently taken control. As for bag, i will enjoy taking as little or as much as i wish, when i wish, job done, with pleasure, 'no charge' to the farmers or agriculture.

[Mutley]

Just a note to all that don't seem to do much in the way of pigeon shooting and understand the reason behind it all.....Yes to be honest it's our chosen sport and yes like it or not we are doing the farmer a favour, coz other wise i like many others out there wouldn't be getting phone calls from these farmers to come and shoot the sodding things and save his crop....With regards to decoying and luring so called rats into ones garden and making it a pest to control, these birds are already in the "GARDEN" hence us getting the "PHONE CALL" all we are doing by decoying is getting them in range to be able to shoot them effectively!!..... Some shooters have time to watch the fields and plan ahead and save the farmers phone bill others grab what chance they have and turn up at their chosen site and make the most of it, knowing full well if they don't seem to be putting enough effort in the farmer will happily give the shooting to some one who is a little keener, and we all know getting some where to shoot is a hard enough job at the best of times.

[Harnser]

I have read the comments on this thread with great interest . Several years ago i used to shoot on a farm in north norfolk

that used to grow lots of tick beans and peas .After the farmer had finished drilling he would scatter any lefter over seed on to a strategic part of the field that would be suitable for pigeon shooting ,he would wait a couple of days ,and then have a wonderful days pigeon shooting . I never knew of anybody including myself frowning on this practice . He also used to put out bales of hay and buckets of apples underneath his tree stand to pull the deer in to range . I dont know if these practices are illegal or not ,but i think you will find it more common than you think . Harnser .