Durham Police---Officer Arrested

[blunt shooter]

I was informed by a well known shooter and shoot capt from ther Consett area that the original powner had been arrested because his ex made allegations of threats of violence and as such as a gamekeeper he had lost his licences and his gamekeepers cottage etc.

His guns which were seized from becaused of these threats (alleged or not?) were sold to people on his behalf ,in fact good mates of his who he nominated to Pc Allen and he was paid ALL of the money fr them , as for the 22rf no one including dealers wanted it so apparently Allen eventually sold it to a local (trhe man it was supposed to have ben stolen from in a burglary)and the previous owner the gamekeeper soI am told was paid at Ruffside?:o

I can only go off whjat people who know this man tell me , if the allegations made against him were found to be false it is only corect he shold get his job and licences back and he should sue the police cos he unnecessarily sold guns that would cost him a great deal to replace?

BUT again I am only goinmg on what I've been told he was mentally unstable tried suicide etc so if I understand the law correctly that would prevent him from getting his licences back and remaining as a gamekeeper?

 

As for the cops costs I bought a gun off him, a Winchester 12b, I contacted the previous keeper who told me the cop had offered to buy the gun off hiom but he gave him it as styock was broken and trigger guard etc missing.When I got my hands on it Allen told me how he had come by itr and that the had spent money on restocking it , getting trigger guard etc and fitting a set of extended chokes , he showed me receipts for over £400 for what he had spent on the gun I p;aid £450 with a gun slip, I was happy with what I paid and the previous owner didnty mind cos he didnt want to spend money on it.I suppose this is waht they mean by costs incurred to do up gunms etc.

I have since sold the gun for £600 a nice profit for me, the police have asked me about it and seen the new owner who still has the gun

I still ca not see what they have done wrong, other cops were doing the same thing

As for the case been put back a month your info re thast is wrong its not cos they are going to trial Durham Police don't want a trial they want it to go away, its ONLY put back cos CPS hadnt had time to go over the papers, and I was told that by a cop wqho works at Consett<PS he also confirmed that the 22rf had been found in the stream in that blokes back garden??So no conspiracy there???

[blunt shooter]

Did you also know that Allen had tried suicide himself and trhat his wife has tried it 3 timesand was in hospital for months, he has lost his car , motorcycle, house pension everything and he still may end up in prison?

I'd have got less for robbing a bank

,Each person I speak to who knows / knew Allen ALL speak highly of him saying he was helpful and a cheerful full of joy person who went that extra mile for people, thats how I found him as well

I personally think he has suffered enough lets face it he'll never get a job again whatever the outcome?

Whatever he and his workmates did or didn't do it's obvious he and Cobain are scapegoats cos I know other cops who were doing exactly the same but somehow they ain't been touched and have retired on full pensions.

I just don't think that the probable punishment they will get fits the crime( thats if there has been a crime)

Surely it should be all of the Dept or none?

[TPH]

At the end of the day these police officers sold guns that they were not ment to.

I know someone that had his certificate revoked for getting a police caution.

His guns and cartridges were all removed 81 days after the caution alls he did was obstruct a police officer. There was no violence involved.Have theses officers had thier certificate revoked if they have one? Or is it the case of one law for thm and one for the public. There is talk of the cps dropping the charges this is not right in my eyes.

[al4x]

to me there is a big issue with this one in whether there was any malicious intent involved in this or whether the guys were doing something they didn't realise was against the law / rules. Theft from their employer is a bit tenuous if the guys sold guns on for people handing them in and gave them the money. Obviously none were sold off ticket so they didn't go into the wrong hands. They have everything to loose and indeed seem to have lost everything and if the version of events is to be believed it seems like common sense has gone out of the window with charging them. I'm not sure we'll ever know what did or did not happen.

[TPH]

At the end of the day they sold guns that had been handed in.

Anybody else doing this would have been jailed.

The police were quick to prosecute the solider who handed in the shotgun he found in his garden.

[blunt shooter]

The comments made are good ones, if what they were doing was common practice as seems to have been the case in Durham and elsewhere in the country as to how firearms handed in were transfered on behalf of the owners and they received full recompense and none are off register and all accounted for what harm were the cops doing??

Several cops I know bought or had guns sold the same way BUT they havent been charged with anything?

 

As for Grasshoppers comments about the gamekeeper he had a pint with a few weeks ago I checked up on that today it would seem that the gamekeeper( whose 22rf that was stolen from the man who bought it from police property after its previous owner had lost his licence for threats to kill against his ex ) has in fact definetely LOST his licences he is now emp;loyed as a driver and lives with his mother, he still helps out local keepers BUT has no licences or guns of his own.

So it would seem my version is correct and that Grasshopper is either talking about a different person, is misinformed or mislead or as I said earlier has an axe to grind about Allen?

Lets not forget there is another cop involved in thiese types of matter Cobain this forum always is about Allen, if he and Cobain were doing the same thing I am sure others would be and as someone has commented (TPH I think) they have m,ade an error and have not deliberately broken the law?surely loosing everything is more than enough punishment?

[blunt shooter]

As for the comment obout someone loosing their ticket for a police caution , we all know when we get firearms licences we have to like little angels , any malicicious threats ( hell hath no fury like a women scorned ) and all that any complaints to police about a ticket holder and they could loose their ticket and guns,

'It wouls seem that different forces deal with these matters in different ways, my mate in Northumbria(Sunderland) lost his driving licence for drink driving Northumbria sent an armed team of cops to cease his guns and serve him with revocation notice for his licences.

I have a mate in Durham same thing all he got was a harsh letter of warning?

I know another lad in Peterlee who lost his ticket for hitting his wife a single cop turned up to take his guns and inform him his ticket was revoked.

Different forces different chief constables different ways of dealing with the same things, perhaps a National system for dealing with these matters should be made that makes ALL forces deal with matters the same way?

[grasshopper]

I have got a single Baikel in the cabinet that i bought from him...not had a knock yet,but i do have the receipt so not to bothered.

I might sell it on April 1st next year.....but before noon

 

Have shot with him on our pheasant shoot on a few occasions...speak as you find and i found him fine,especially when i put a fox i,d just shot into his brand new game bag and he carried it out of the wood for me.

The fella has a good sense of humour,was helpful to me and i hope it all works out for him.

As for Grasshoppers comments about the gamekeeper he had a pint with a few weeks ago I checked up on that today it would seem that the gamekeeper( whose 22rf that was stolen from the man who bought it from police property after its previous owner had lost his licence for threats to kill against his ex ) has in fact definetely LOST his licences he is now emp;loyed as a driver and lives with his mother, he still helps out local keepers BUT has no licences or guns of his own.

So it would seem my version is correct and that Grasshopper is either talking about a different person, is misinformed or mislead or as I said earlier has an axe to grind about Allen?

 

You really are a **** stirrer who doesn,t even bother to read posts before you start on your 1 man crusade to prove PC Allen innocent.Think you,ll find it wasn,t me who said that

 

The gamekeeper in question is a different 1 to the one i know(although he did work for the same estate) and the 1 i know also had dealings with Pc allen.

 

There is also the point of the 7 or so reciept books going missing which presumably would prove he did eveything above the law..as i have said previously in this thread,i have nothing against Maurice Allen and i,m interested to see what the outcome is.

Another post from yours truly suggesting i have no axe to grind

 

May i suggest you read the whole thread and then..Like i,ve already said..wait until it,s all been sorted.

[mosa]

My 1st gun came from this guy. The 1st time i went shooting was with a guy from work who sold me a midland semi auto 12g for £50. i was over the moon to get such a bargain... or so i thought!! It wouldnt cycle any more than 1 shot after a short time. anyway i took it to steve smiths who tried to repair it but the ejector catch snapped off so i scrapped it. Then about a year later the lad i work with told me his friend or past syndicate member (the cop in question) had been arrested for selling on scrapped guns. Then this rang alarms in my head and i had to refresh him of the gun he sold me. Then i got a knock from 2 plain clothes PC's who were investigating the case. As my memory at the time was spot on (dont know whats happened lately) i recalled all the details surrounding the sale to me, which they matched. My mate was informed that he may get a visit from the police but that never happened. The line must have stopped once the gun was scrapped rather than getting passed on. ive never heard anything since

[blunt shooter]

My 1st gun came from this guy. The 1st time i went shooting was with a guy from work who sold me a midland semi auto 12g for £50. i was over the moon to get such a bargain... or so i thought!! It wouldnt cycle any more than 1 shot after a short time. anyway i took it to steve smiths who tried to repair it but the ejector catch snapped off so i scrapped it. Then about a year later the lad i work with told me his friend or past syndicate member (the cop in question) had been arrested for selling on scrapped guns. Then this rang alarms in my head and i had to refresh him of the gun he sold me. Then i got a knock from 2 plain clothes PC's who were investigating the case. As my memory at the time was spot on (dont know whats happened lately) i recalled all the details surrounding the sale to me, which they matched. My mate was informed that he may get a visit from the police but that never happened. The line must have stopped once the gun was scrapped rather than getting passed on. ive never heard anything since

[blunt shooter]

I think £50 for a semi auto was a bargain, as for scrapping it for a snapped ejector that was foolish its a cheap and fairly easy reapair, rather than scrap it you could have pt ex it at a gun dealer and got your mmoney back.

Needless to say the fact no more people visited is probably because no offences as to this gun(yes BZ & GH I'm just summising that)

But when buying any secondhand gun from anyone it may work when we buy it but it could also break on 1st use ,it's a risk we all take .

The comments have been madfe from several of us

MAYBE THE TRUTH WILL COME OUT MAYBE IT WILL NOT

but whatever these I don't envy what these 2 cops will have to go through???

[TPH]

I have heard that these 2 officers were back at court on the 26/03/2010.

Does anybody know what happend. There has been nothing in the paper.

[blunt shooter]

I have heard that these 2 officers were back at court on the 26/03/2010.

Does anybody know what happend. There has been nothing in the paper.

I have heard that the police are not taking any actions for thefts against Allen but he is going to court for misconduct sometime in July, apparently part of the reasons for this is he sold guns for serving cops who got paid in full and as he was charged with theft of some of these it was pointed out that these serving cops MUST have recieved the proceeds of stolen goods BUT WEREN'T done for anything so Misconduct only for gun brokering???

Cobain has elected to go for trial some time later this year?

I think they are both still out on bail till after the trial because neither of them can be sentenced till the end of Cobain's trial, So I'm sure it will be in the papers and on Tv at some time after its conclussion

Can I also take this chance to apologise to BZ and GH if I have misquoted them and got comments mixed up with the incorrect people , I like you have no axe to grind but am not on a 1 man crusade to prove them innocent or guilty more to prove not just they did this but it was common practice in Durham and other Forces and I feel they have been singled out

It should have been ALL done or NONE done?

Lets just keep an eye on the media to see what ther result is?

[the running man]

The more society changes all around us, the more things stay the same.......I expect he was doing it a few times then became complacent and got caught,just like all thieves do in the end,I just hope it dosent lead to tighter gun control.

[UKPoacher]

Can I just say that I know Maurice Allen personally and theres more to this story than meets the eye. For one it is being misrepresented in the media. It was not, as far as I understand it, a "gun-running plot" at all. Most importantly, PC Allen made no profit from this whatsoever. He simply was a great admirer of guns, he appreciated their "artistic" value.

 

He was trying to help people out, for example, if someone handed in a gun for whatever reason (if they were no longer able to afford to keep it), rather than have it wastefully destroyed, PC Allen would sell it on for the previous owner AT NO PROFIT FOR HIMSELF, which all the papers have failed to report. While this is still technically against the rules, he thought he was doing the right thing, and didnt want to see perfectly good weapons needlessly destroyed. Best of all, everyone in the department did this, and a lot didnt even know it was illegal. it was accepted practice, and to my knowledge several high ranking officers were aware of it and did nothing to stop it. Some even bought weapons this way. The 16 counts of theft he is charged with are theft against the police force, as they claim even though the previous owners allowed him to sell them on, they were technically police property so he technically stole them.

 

It is a perfect example of politics in the police force, PC allen was a highly regarded and respected officer, yest after he became an outspoken critic of the force civilianising several posts, and openly called several high ranking officers liars, his career has mysteriously fallen apart. Best of all, he had 8 receipt books that proved he made no profit from this, yet they have all conveniently been lost from police records.

 

Basically he is a good man who has made himself a lot of enemies and they have destroyed his career and his life because he was so outspoken

 

I don't know about the issues here, except that I can personally vouch for the last two paragraphs being entirely believable. Many police forces including mine are rotten from the core with senior officers being as bent as nine bob notes and untouchable by disciplinary or criminal measures.

 

I also know that dodgy dealings go off in property matters. I personally investigated and proved beyond any doubt that a sergeant was stealing found property including air rifles, jewellery and fishing tackle yet nothing was done. It was brushed under the carpet rather than raise bad publicity.