Cranfield

N & S Shooting Supplies, 119, Stocks Lane, Penketh, Warrington, Cheshire, WA 52RW. Telephone; Mike Newall 01925 728057 for a price list. johnny, sorry I can,t help on the "flapper", but I,m sure someone else will.

No shooting in the last week, as I,ve been sea fishing in Ireland. However, the arrival of some new decoys, floaters and other bits, will inspire me to go forth sometime this week and harrass the local pigeon population. A lot of the rape is being harvested now and as we flew in to the airport at Stanstead, Essex , I noticed, what appeared to be ,wheat fields being cut. This can be one of the best times of the year in this part of England. The only problem is that the pigeons are almost spoilt for choice. You have to be careful not to overshoot a "good" field , or the birds will relocate, if you are really unlucky, they relocate to fields you have no access to. Is it possible, or customary, over there to pay the landowner/farmer for your pigeon shooting ? This would give you some exclusivity and security. Are you sure you can,t get back to those good pigeon fields more than once a year? My friends in Georgia and Alabama, think nothing of a 300 mile round trip drive for a days fishing or hunting. With our roads a journey like that would take all day. It seems that permission to shoot pigeons is a lot easier to get in the US, than in this part of the UK. The shooting here is jealously guarded and in some areas its a "closed shop". Seems a lot easier in the North of England, but then most things are. :evil: (Immediately takes cover)

Hi cammo, welcome. There are plenty of experienced pigeon shooters on here with loads of good advice. If you are interested in "contact forums", meeting like-minded people, etc we can fix you up with this months special offer............Deako. :(

Sorry, I forgot to mention that these are other peoples wounded birds I am despatching. I, of course, do not wound birds. Mine are all dead in the air.

CRUMBS !!! After a days shooting like that, you are seriously considering leaving the area ? Sounds like a good case for a divorce, or two homes. I am not keen on pigeon shooting from a hide, when other guns are within 200 yards or so. If there are no alternatives, then its often best to share a hide and take turns shooting. However, I have never experienced that volume of birds trying to feed on one field. In those circumstances I suppose normal "rules/ideas" don,t apply. I can understand not wishing to advertise the shooting by taking photographs, but I would have thought the noise of the shooting activity, would draw the attention of other guns to the area. When I "shared" a farm with another chap (who lived next to it), he use to tell me how many pigeons I had shot each time I went on a weekday (while he was at work). It seems his wife use to be at home counting my shots and reporting to him. Jealousy is a terrible thing.

I saw about 6 woodpigeons the whole week. Loads of big black crows and those evil looking ones with the grey bodies, but almost no woodpigeons. They must all be up North or, on the East coast, they certainly are not on the West coast. We had a great time (as usual) and the weather and fishing was good. I may post some pics later.

All the comments made just prove how you have to keep your eyes open and make the most of every opportunity that presents itself. Beware of the "self-fullfilling prophesy" syndrome !!!!!! A friend of mine use to go pigeon shooting after work, starting about 4.30 - 5.00 pm. He usually got some birds and every now and then would have a storming session. He went around telling everyone that late afternoon/early evening was the best time to shoot pigeons. Well, it was for him, he never went any other time. :( It pays to be flexible.

To despatch a wounded bird I hold the body in my left hand (preventing the wings flapping) and put my first two fingers either side of its neck. I then pull my hands gently apart (not pulling its head off),maintain the pressure and "strangle" the bird. Doesn,t sound very nice, but it works and is humane. If anyone has any other methods that don,t involve rocks, clubs, machines etc. I would be interested.

I have received my N & S order, I can,t wait to try the foam decoys on my rotary device. They look hideous, but apparently work very well. I have a Pinewood Rotary Device which cost almost £200. It operates perfectly and todate, I have had no problems. There are a lot of cheaper ones about and the N & S one is supposed to be very good. CHECK THAT THE PRICE QUOTED INCLUDES THE BATTERY AND CARRYING CASE. I nearly got caught out. :(

I am off to Co Mayo, in Ireland for a weeks sea fishing. We leave from Stanstead Airport, which will give me the chance to look at all the pigeons in the fields, alongside the M11. There always seems to be loads about. Does any Forum member/watcher shoot that area ? Anyway, I look forward to reading all the successful pigeon shooting reports upon my return.

Don,t mis-understand Deako, he meant to say that he would lovingly stroke its neck if he could persuade it to come close enough. If the birds are "decoyable",I have found a moving decoy, of any sort ,to be most effective. I always have some shell decoys out on a breezy day, their rocking motion is most realistic. It also pays to give ideas and equipment a fair trial over a longish time, in different circumstances. I am not sure that I have ever had pigeons "put off" by decoys. If things are slow for no apparent reason, then I will sometimes increase or decrease the number of birds I have out ,or change the pattern slightly. I have heard that they get spooked on the rotary pigeon decoy device eventually, but that is not my experience. The most common reason I have seen for pigeons acting spooky over decoys is a previously shot (not picked up) bird laying upside down. That really puts them off. It also pays to get out of the hide and look around. I have found a big fertilizer bag that had blown in to the hedgerow near my hide, that was frightening them.Sometimes an aspect of your hide is not quite right and may want repairing. Also, if I shoot a field regularly, I will vary my hide position as much as possible. I am sure if you stayed in the same place day after day, you would certainly condition the birds to your presence. I have heard that this is a problem on some commercial US dove shoots, where they feed fields and shoot from fixed positions. Its strange how long it sometimes takes pigeons to "discover" a good feed. Other times I have seen them following the seed planters and combines. A farmer locally planted beans by "broadcasting" them( spreading the beans on the surface and then rolling then in). He had to sow the field twice as the pigeons were picking the beans up as they hit the ground. To add even more spice to my pigeon shooting , I have become very interested in my cartridge/kill ratio. Not just for economic reasons, but it stops me taking silly shots and is a measure of how well I am shooting. I am suprised you are down at 7 1/2 size shot, I don,t go below 7 and normally 6. You know the conditions you are shooting in and must make your choice accordingly. As a frequent visitor to the US, I have had plenty of experience of your Customs officials, I find the longest queue is at Immigration. In May at Atlanta airport, the tannoy asked for a Korean interpretor at Booth 3. About 800 people sank to their knees and prayed that they were not in the queue for Booth 3. It normally takes us about an hour to clear Immigration, prior to collecting our luggage. We may be going back to the Panhandle in October for some Reds and Specks fishing, also the chance at some Georgia doves and some sun for my wife, we don,t have any of that here either. 8) We should start another topic heading, "Letter from America".

Dead-eye, Malc is 100% right. Don,t you have any swathed rape available ? I saw some around Hempstead last week, it may not have been on your land though. If nothing else , ambush ,em.

My clarification of the US term "blackbird" was necessary as in the UK we have a blackbird, which is a protected bird with a very nice song. I didn,t want anyone getting the wrong idea. I would consider 70 birds shot in a day, very acceptable. How many guns were there ? What was the bird/cartridge ratio ? What cartridge loads were you using ? What do you do with the birds ? Can I come and shoot with you ?

I have never had any success shooting pigeons over crops in heavy rain. The main reason they don,t like walking around in the rain, is that they get mud on their feet and can,t fly. Thats what makes meadows and clover so attractive on long wet days.

hh, sounds as though you made the best of a difficult situation. Its frustrating when the laid down bit is right in the middle and there aren,t any tractor tracks to make use of. I think we,ve all experienced that. One good thing about swathed rape is that you can get right in to the field and utilising the rape (carefully) plus the light cammo net, you can make a functional hide.

The pigeons on the wires over your barley filed were probably digesting a snack and getting ready to pop down for "seconds". When do they feed ? Depends on the crop. Depends on the weather. Depends on the time of year. Depends what time Mr Pigeon gets home from work :( Etc. I have gone early,( expecting rain later) and the shooting has been slow. Then it doesn,t rain and the birds feed strongly from 5pm onwards. I,ve been out in bad Winter weather, when the birds fed for less than an hour between dawn and dusk. Don,t forget, you can get birds come and look at your decoys (and get shot), even if they are not feeding. If you ain,t in the field with your decoys out and your gun loaded, you will never know. Its difficult to shoot pigeons if you don,t go.

Dead-eye, you are probably right, but it was 5.15 pm and I know you Subaru guys like to get home on time. :( I took the car back this mormning and they took all four wheels off and re-balanced them (no charge). Going down the M2, violent vibrations at 65/70mph. I decided to go to my pigeon shooting, as it wasn,t raining, KwikFit could be visited later. Another slow half day, there were a few birds about, but they are spoilt for choice. One shot and nothing for an hour. I only shot 5, but only used 5 cartridges, so I achieved something today. The frequent VERY HEAVY showers didn,t help anything. Anyway, back to KwikFit and tell them it still ain,t fixed, there was a general reluctance from anyone to do anything. I insisted the "Manager" accompany me on a test drive so he could see for himself. There was no disputing the vibrations and when we got back to the garage, they tell me the balancing machine is a bit knackered and they have had 6 cars back in the last few days. I obviously asked why they are taking money to balance wheels, if the machine doesn,t work properly. They told me it is intermittent. The matter was resolved by me taking my car to KwikFit at Gravesend, where they checked the 4 wheels and found the balancing to be miles out. I told them the whole sorry saga and they said it would be drawn to the attention of the Area Manager. Their workshop was very efficient and a good advert for the Company. I may not go to KwikFit in the future though. :(

meandassey, KwikFits was like Dysneyland, 3 idiots that were more interested in larking about with each other, than in fixing anyones cars. If I hadn,t been a bit desperate I would have gone somewhere else. I anticipate a discussion tomorrow as to whether or not they should have sussed it out. :(

Had a "duty" attendance today at my Farmer friends swathed rape. It rained most of the day and the pigeons did not want to leave the trees. A waste of time, but "I done me duty". One irritating side effect was that driving along the "dirt/mud" tracks to get to the field, I plastered my car with mud. When I had finished getting wet (hard to call it shooting), I went back to the farm and used the power wash to get the worst of the mud from my wheels and wheel arches etc. Driving home I experienced wheel wobble at about 50 mph, anything faster and the car was almost undriveable. I went straight to KwikFit and had the front wheels balanced and the tracking checked. Cost me £28.95p and on the way home (after they shut), I noticed it was still there from 70mph upwards. I am resigned to taking it back tomorrow and they can do it again. I telephoned my Farmer friend to tell him that I would be back at the field again tomorrow, if it wasn,t raining hard. I mentioned the wheel wobble and he reckons that its mud inside the wheel which is off balancing the wheel. So, if I had cleaned the wheels out properly with the hose, I wouldn,t have had a problem or spent £28.95p. If only I,d known !! :(

Big Dave, I am honest enough to admit that most of my computer problems are ME. Thats not the Microsoft programme Millenium Edition. I mean ME (Cranfield).

Dead-eye, look at lazzas post. The rape has probably been sprayed, this effectively kills it prior to harvesting. The farmer won,t want you walking all over it, but if you can carefully use the tractor lines to set out your decoys and pick up your pigeons, you could get some good sport of the lower lying areas. You could also set up an ambush point on the way to the field, or set up on the field and not use decoys. They normally harvest 7-10 days after swathing, I think its much the same after spraying. The moisture content has to be right though. This rain we are getting won,t help.

The first thing to do is to clarify what a "blackbird" is. For the benefit of UK members, it is not, nor related to, our blackbird. Its a small vermin bird, similar to a starling. It can be very perplexing when birds pass seemingly "good" fields to go to a specific field. The only time I think I found the answer, was when the favoured field was more sheltered from the wind. This has not always been the case though. When you mention "corn", I assume you mean sweetcorn or maize. This is another crop that is not widely grown in my part of the UK. I have no experience of whether pigeons are attracted to it or, if so, at what stage of the crops development. Its strange how pigeons will keep visiting old wheat stubbles, even when they start sprouting again. Sometimes in preference to newer ,fresher food alternatives nearby. This "non-typical" behaviour is one of the things that makes pigeon shooting different. Some masochists even enjoy the frustration. I had a very wet days shooting today on swathed rape. The birds were not at all interested in the crops and I only shot 4 birds that were passing. I had to leave the field about 4pm, just as the skies cleared and the sun began to shine. Such is life.

Not sure about the "non-toxic" shot question, But I suspect that if you say nothing, nobody else will know. Organic means, very little or no, weed killer type stuff. That should be good for your shooting. It seems to me, that often the birds prefer the weeds to the crops. Check out the pigeons on the "set-aside" fields, they love it.

Went out this morning with Meandassey to get some cartridges and look at some other decoying items. I had some comparison prices from N & S and my local shop, plus some other mail order firms. We visited a shop near London that advertises widely in the shooting press. The difference in the prices was amazing and in most instances we were comparing like for like. My local shop was cheapest on cartridges (only £5 saving per 500, but worth having) and N & S was cheapest on everything that they can supply. A gun sock at my local shop was £8.50, at the "London" shop the same sock was £17.99 :( Hide poles, Floaters, Army style cammo nets, flock coated decoys, no contest. It certainly pays to shop around, I will be calling Mike Newall at N & S tonight. :thumbs:

The rape around here is also being sprayed or "swathed", some last week, but most of it this week. I have a "swathed a week ago" field to visit tomorrow.