sterling

It wouldn't prevent a nutter killing people. Nothing will. The sooner the media and the public realise that, the sooner we can get back to improving (not necessarily making it more difficult) firearms laws and licensing. You can't buy a car and drive it on the road without testing because it increases the chance of accidental injury or death. The same could be said for firearms tests. It might not make a huge difference to the stats, it just makes sense. proactive rather than reactive. We already have too many reactive gun laws. I've done a canadian PAL/RPAL license test. You demonstrate safe handling and operation of the type of firearms you plan to own and that's it. Not too guelling. It's not meant to be a pain for sensible people, it's meant to stop "special" folks from owning weapons.

I'm sure you can imagine just how complex the system must be when you consider the niche areas like veterinary humane killing, deer stalking on national trust land etc. none of which I have any experience with, so I can't have a full picture of how to improve licensing. I do think however that evidence of "good cause" should be shown for owning a shotgun. I know of more than one person who lives in an inner-city flat with shotguns and have never used them for any purpose, sporting or otherwise. I also think that a Canadian style licensing system would help, where an individual has to attend a course and prove safe proficiency with a firearm before they're allowed to walk into a shop and take one home. Currently, any simpleton who is uncapable of even operating their TV remote can get a SGC, a gun and some carts, head home and then try to work out how to use the thing. I'm amazed more new shotgun owners don't have ND's. Just an observation about the criminal records criteria - Not having one just means you haven't been caught. Some of the most prolific criminals have never been caught. I don't have any bright ideas about this one though and their proposed phsyc profile from a GP is just as useless. Hypothetically; a chief FEO who conducted an interview made someone out to be an idiot for enquiring about reloading shotgun carts. They were told unequivocally that you can't reload ammunition. Don't ask me how I know this. So maybe making sure firearms officers are actually informed might be a good place to start!

What a surprise - the BBC being irresponsible with uninformed reporting . This "debate" was obviously on the cards when all news reports made a point to emphasise that the firearms allegedly used by Atherton were legally held. We all know what happened in the wake of Hungerford and Dunblane and the pessimist in me expected a similar reaction to the Cumbria shootings. Now we have the Peterlee shootings to add to the list. I'll go out on a limb and say I think it is time the UK firearms laws and processing were revised, but not under pressure from the uninformed, gun-fearing masses.

I'd say codling has the closest estimate so far. To be fair, you jokers with all that 297/.230 short stuff is pretty funny though! I was professor of guns at some prestigious university somewhere so you know I have the credentials to back this up. The two cartridges you have there are a .17HM2 necked up to .50 and then necked back down to 9mm and the other is a M712 155mm fin stabilized rocket and should be safe to fire from your garden gun if it's conservatively bored out.

I've got a 9" hushpower fitted to a mossy 500 410. It's the new version with the removable collet system instead of the permanent bush fitting of the older model. It was more spendy at £100, but it's well worth it so that you can remove the thing when you actually want to hit anything. A red dot or ghost rings can fix most of the accuracy problems, so on to actual effectiveness; if you can't tell the difference between your suppressed and un-suppressed gun, there's either a problem with your suppressor or your ears. Subsonic shot carts are an expensive gimmick in my opinion. You won't notice the difference in sound. You will however have to hold much more lead and reduce your range by a fair bit. The extra grams of lead don't make up for lost speed in my experience. I've noticed pretty serious plastic residue in the tube after firing plas-wads, so I'd strongly recommend fibre. A bore obstruction or serious baffle strike could ruin your day. Eley extra-long are the only subsonic fibre I know of and they'll cost around £7 a box. Eley fourlongs are WAY quieter though and although a bit anaemic at 12.5g, they can do the job at sensible .410 ranges. Eley fourlong with the hushpower through my gun are comparible to somebody clapping their hands hard near your ears. I'll admit I still wear hearing protection but I've got to say it's a very useful tool. I regularly have the farmer who lives 200m away come to see if I've actually shot anything! (I should add he's not deaf as far as I know)

PM sent...

Many thanks for the kind offer Dan, PM inbound...

If it's still around, would you be interested in selling the H110? I'm in worcestershire and could collect. Just throw me a PM!

Professional conservation officer looking for permission to walk and shoot rabbit, pigeon, rat etc. (all lawful quarry) on land in Worcestershire/within 25 miles of Kidderminster. Fully insured, safety conscious and experienced on the land. Equiped with shotgun, non-fac air rifle and will apply for FAC/rimfire if required. I would be willing to offer the cheapest hedge laying, coppicing, light forestry or landscaping work in return and a nice bottle of your favourite tipple at Christmas too!

Same boat as you mate. Looking for permission for rabbit/pigeon mainly for shotgun and non-fac airgun in worcestershire. I'm visiting farms, knocking on doors and generally putting the word about pretty relentlessly (so far in vain). If I get any permission, I'd be willing to invite you out on it because I know how bladdy hard it is to find land and how incredibly unhelpful a lot of people are in this sport to those just starting out! Some can even be found on this site, but I won't name any names... I'll message you if I get lucky.

Just when I forget how much I miss living on the Devon coast, someone reminds me it's still there. Welcome from the land-locked West Midlands!

Thanks for the info cookoff. Yeah I've been told the 410 is a sensitive little sucker. Just learned today that it's one of the highest pressure shotgun loads at around 13000 PSI, versus the 8000(ish) for 12 gauge. :look: Great help there Floating Chamber! I'll have a go at making the powder/shot scoops and loading block, but I'll bite the bullet and buy a de-primer as I have visions of me igniting one on my rickety homemade tool. On the topic of reloading 410, I found this site which may be of interest to some of you: http://smallboreshotgun.org/tag/410-slug-loads/ I understand you can't load slug or big buck without an FAC, which should only take my police force another 2 years or so to process , but it's still interesting reading.

Thanks for the welcome all! Good to be here. I just thank my lucky stars I'm not a pigeon!

Cheers gary, PW seems like a great site. Finally a use for the internet that I don't mind my missus seeing

Sound advice, thanks a lot guys! Scales and some good reloading data are my top priority then. The shot dripper, press and the custom loads can wait until I've learned a thing or two. I think I just might enjoy reloading cartridges as much as I do shooting them! Thanks again

Hi all, I've been lurking here for a few weeks and I've finally come out of the bushes to say hello. I'm a young(ish) lad in Bewdley and after living in the states with a lovely (sorely missed) gun collection and shooting hobby for a while, I'm starting up shooting in the UK and without any mates who shoot, this forum is a much needed place to learn, chat and hopefully have a laugh too. Hopefully in time I'll meet a few of you for a day's shooting or an evening's pint! Until then, see you around the forum...

Hi all, I'm new around here but I've been picking up great information since I found the forum a few weeks back. I've just made the move from non-fac air rifle to shotgun, so a huge learning curve has just begun. I've just started reloading 410 for a mossberg 500 and have a question to ask and possibly a can of worms to open; It seems Siarm (http://www.siarm.com/index.php?language=en) is cheapest for reloading components, so if I for instance buy 3" fiocchi hulls from them, fiocchi 615 primers and gualandi h40 wads, how the hell do I know which powder/quantity of powder, quantity of lead shot or how long I should make the overall payload length up to with wads/fillers if I'm roll crimping? Basically, without a pressure test gun and a chrono, is it possible to safely work up unpublished loads or do you guys just stick to existing data and go and search for those specific components listed? Jeez I hope that load of waffle makes sense to somebody Unfortunately, none of my mates shoot, so I've gotta learn all this alone from books/the net. Thanks a load!