bring back pistols ?

[Vipa]

Mungler, Your support is welcomed, thank you, and I agree with your other comments.

I do not use any other fora, one is enough.

Vipa is prone to overreaction sadly. Suggesting I am in any way involved with the GCN is typically wayward. I didnt even know what it meant until I read your post.

 

Vipa you need to moderate your oversensitive and somewhat unpredictable reaction.

For the record, camo doesnt turn me on personally, however, its a very effective tool for me out in the field.

 

Have you ever come accross the concept of sarcasm This is a forum, not a commons debate!

Edited June 5, 2011 by Vipa

[Vipa]

Mungler, Your support is welcomed, thank you, and I agree with your other comments.

I do not use any other fora, one is enough.

Vipa is prone to overreaction sadly. Suggesting I am in any way involved with the GCN is typically wayward. I didnt even know what it meant until I read your post.

 

Vipa you need to moderate your oversensitive and somewhat unpredictable reaction.

For the record, camo doesnt turn me on personally, however, its a very effective tool for me out in the field.

 

Research would suggest that the only thing cammo will shield you from in the field is the prying eyes of other people.

 

My reactions are not 'somewhat unpredictable'

 

You post stupid comments, I will 'quite predictably' vilify you for them! My MO hasn't changes since I joined PW

Edited June 5, 2011 by Vipa

[Browning GTS]

I enjoy shooting in all forms its my main pastime/hobby. I used to shoot .22 pistols before the ban. I have just joined a local ish gun club with a view to getting a couple of BP pistols, not quite than same but a good second best, well i think anyway. The thing is shooters from all disciplines should stick together strength in numbers and all that.

[coneyhunter]

i myself was having this discussion with a freind of mine the other day.

 

We are allowed to own what are classed as LBRS and LBPs ( long barrel revolver and long barrel pistols) on a section one certificate which i feel is sadly all that we will ever be ale to shoot in terms of the handgun in this country. Sadly i didnt have the chance to own handguns before the ban but know many people from the club that did and it really does sound like we are missing out.

 

Im not going to start on the Government making a kneejerk reaction to private firerarms ownership after what was an extremely tragic incident, the feeling that im sure is shared, gun owner or not.

 

Sadly we seem to live in a country that firmly beleives that the best way to control gun crime is to slap heinious and contradictory sanctions on legitimate gun owners, who by their very nature are law abiding and responsible enough to own firearms.

 

There is talk of the .22 pistol ( not LBP ) coming back onto a section 1 ticket for target sports but im not going to hold my breath.

 

For the government to reppeal the handgun ban will require them to admit that they were wrong in the first place to ban them, and to admit that it has had no affect on gun crime at all, the politician who pushes for this will be commiting career suicide and i cant see any of them willing to take that risk.

[Kes]

Vipa, so sarcasm is what you were doing is it?

Perhaps "you post stupid comments" is one of them.

So why did the majority of other posters stick to the subject?

Why, apparently feeling some value in the post which triggered your 'sarcasm', do you now use the word vilify?

If camo is essential to your enjoyment of guns - fine.

If you like long posts - fine.

If you would forget criticism and stick to the subject that would be really special !

Please dont bother to reply lets get on with our lives - with or without camo.

 

I've heard it said that sarcasm is the lowest form of wit and the sincerest form of flattery - if you are OK with that - fine.

Edited June 5, 2011 by Kes

[Vipa]

Vipa, so sarcasm is what you were doing is it?

Perhaps "you post stupid comments" is one of them.

So why did the majority of other posters stick to the subject?

Why, apparently feeling some value in the post which triggered your 'sarcasm', do you now use the word vilify?

If camo is essential to your enjoyment of guns - fine.

If you like long posts - fine.

If you would forget criticism and stick to the subject that would be really special !

Please dont bother to reply lets get on with our lives - with or without camo.

 

I've heard it said that sarcasm is the lowest form of wit and the sincerest form of flattery - if you are OK with that - fine.

 

You really are a sensitive chap aren't you!

 

If everyone stuck rigidly to the subject without recourse to name calling, wee taking, sarcasm, vilification... on every topic, they would be done in 1 page abd be very, very dull

 

I also think you will find upon re-reading each and every one of my posts that all of them were indeed 'on topic!'

 

The reference to you posting stupid comments was not sarcasm, it was a direct attack on the STUPID COMMENT you posted bitchin' about shooters who enjoy thier sport 'noisily,' 'loudly' and 'in public!' I have never read so much rot in all my born days... If you see shooting as being something seedy that should be done away from the public view and in a manner that means you do it 'behind closed doors' then you have a real problem and would possibly be better off taking up something that the general public (in your mind) will not disaprove of... golf perhaps

 

Shooting tends to be noisy and loud and by feeling that it is something you would rather the population at large didn't know you took part in just feeds the whole political correctness disease this sport and country are aflicted with. That is EXACTLY the attitude which helped nail the coffin lid down on handguns and is, moving forward, the very same attitude (or lack thereof) that will ultimately see all shooting sports outlawed in the UK. Stand up and be counted, be proud of your sport not ashamed (which your post would suggest you are!)

 

The sarcasm element was telling you to get back to the GCN network (just in case you were still unsure!)

 

No, absolutely no flattery whatsoever

Edited June 5, 2011 by Vipa

[Kes]

I have one word for you without sarcasm - ****.

[Vipa]

I have one word for you without sarcasm - ****.

 

What's that... 4 letter word describing me cool, nice, able, just, fair.... I am humbled

[Vince Green]

Coming back to the OP, is it only me that remembers the total ****** that were flooding into pistol shooting in the last few years before it was banned? They weren't proper shooters they were fantasists from a parrallel universe. Sorry to loose pistol shooting but not sorry to see the back of them Walter Mittys, wannabe Rambos etc.

Edited June 5, 2011 by Vince Green

[Bazooka Joe]

is it only me that remembers the total ****** that were flooding into pistol shooting in the last few years before it was banned?

 

No Vince, your not alone

[greywolf1958]

I'd love to have pistol shooting allowed again. I sold all my small/full bore pistols before the ban came in, but I know I would enjoy it again.

I was a member of LITTS for many years, and enjoyed using the many pistols that I owned.

Sadly, I don't think we will ever see a return to handgun ownership, and I honestly believe that one day, rifles/shotguns will also be banned.

 

 

Steve.

 

Same as me, Steve. Every Saturday used to find me down the ranges shooting Police Pistol, Service Pistol and Practical Pistol comps against lots of other clubs (including Met Police)and it was a great atmosphere. Sadly though, that's all gone and won't be coming back.

Following the ban, many of my pals (like myself) took up archery but to be honest, that's too much like hard work and with aching elbows, many of us packed that in fairly quickly! Of course, I've always had my air rifles, though, a constant since I was a kid.

As you imply, shooting sports will always be on the back foot and we have to be so careful not to give excuse for Government to further punish what is probably one of the most law-abiding sectors of the community. Never mind that car drivers kill and maim thousands of people every year...

[the running man]

Coming back to the OP, is it only me that remembers the total ****** that were flooding into pistol shooting in the last few years before it was banned? They weren't proper shooters they were fantasists from a parrallel universe. Sorry to loose pistol shooting but not sorry to see the back of them Walter Mittys, wannabe Rambos etc.

yeah they all moved to essex,and became pw members,with a sgc only attitude.

[RC45]

The problem is, most of the resentment comes from shooters themselves, comments like "why would someone want a GSG" or "why would you want to shoot on a range"... SMALL MINDS!!!

[Vipa]

Coming back to the OP, is it only me that remembers the total ****** that were flooding into pistol shooting in the last few years before it was banned? They weren't proper shooters they were fantasists from a parrallel universe. Sorry to loose pistol shooting but not sorry to see the back of them Walter Mittys, wannabe Rambos etc.

 

Vince... I am genuinely interested here (not trying to ambush you! :yp: )

 

At the time when you were shooting and these 'undesirables' started flooding the shooting scene as you say, what shooting disciplines were you active in? (not on the odd occasion but your bread & butter)

Edited June 5, 2011 by Vipa

[Vipa]

The problem is, most of the resentment comes from shooters themselves, comments like "why would someone want a GSG" or "why would you want to shoot on a range"... SMALL MINDS!!!

 

Couldn't agree more RC... that's what's really pigging me off about some of these posts!

[Vince Green]

Vince... I am genuinely interested here (not trying to ambush you! :yp: )

 

At the time when you were shooting and these 'undesirables' started flooding the shooting scene as you say, what shooting disciplines were you active in? (not on the odd occasion but your bread & butter)

I was running a big and very active pistol club in NW London. I was the Secretary. Also I didn't say undesirables I said ****** and there is a world of difference. When the organisers of the Bisley Pistol AD meeting had to issue an edict saying no dressing up was allowed on camp then I would call them ******, wouldn't you? The meeting was starting to become a joke. There were blokes in full combat gear, blokes dressed like SWAT team members, cowboys, American police uniforms (full uniforms right down to the torch and the nightstick) and loads of blokes swaggering around the camp with guns in elaborate holster rigs who probably weren't even competing but just wanted to wear a gun on their hip all day.

 

Pistol shooting was growing rapidly but much of the new intake were not interested in the target disciplines or learning the skills and techniques. All they were interested in was the Rambo stuff and heavy calibre combat weapons. Yes, I think ****** pretty much sums them up

Edited June 6, 2011 by Vince Green

[poontang]

yeah they all moved to essex,and became pw members,with a sgc only attitude.

 

<yawn>

 

Would you like salt & vinegar for that big chip on your shoulder?

[the running man]

I was running a big and very active pistol club in NW London. I was the Secretary. Also I didn't say undesirables I said ****** and there is a world of difference. When the organisers of the Bisley Pistol AD meeting had to issue an edict saying no dressing up was allowed on camp then I would call them ******, wouldn't you? The meeting was starting to become a joke. There were blokes in full combat gear, blokes dressed like SWAT team members, cowboys, American police uniforms (full uniforms right down to the torch and the nightstick) and loads of blokes swaggering around the camp with guns in elaborate holster rigs who probably weren't even competing but just wanted to wear a gun on their hip all day.

 

Pistol shooting was growing rapidly but much of the new intake were not interested in the target disciplines or learning the skills and techniques. All they were interested in was the Rambo stuff and heavy calibre combat weapons. Yes, I think ****** pretty much sums them up

I attended pistol 87 through to pistol 95 and saw no such dressing up,I know that combat jackets were basically banned after hungerford becase of the picture of ryan in a said jacket,this was supposedly to disassociate us from him somehow,(just what the logic behind that was I do not know) but the ban or frowning on of cammo gear has been laxed over the last 8 year or so in the target world,people do wear them but few and far between,I personally don't wear cammo gear for range stuff,there's no need of it,I'm not in the army!,trousers in cammo are more popular and are worn more by people,but to fashion concious youngsters and a large selection of people accross the country cammo in difering forms of clothing seems to be accepted into todays dress code, christ I've got a pair of swimming burmuda shorts from m&s in cammo!!!!!

[the running man]

I was running a big and very active pistol club in NW London. I was the Secretary. Also I didn't say undesirables I said ****** and there is a world of difference. When the organisers of the Bisley Pistol AD meeting had to issue an edict saying no dressing up was allowed on camp then I would call them ******, wouldn't you? The meeting was starting to become a joke. There were blokes in full combat gear, blokes dressed like SWAT team members, cowboys, American police uniforms (full uniforms right down to the torch and the nightstick) and loads of blokes swaggering around the camp with guns in elaborate holster rigs who probably weren't even competing but just wanted to wear a gun on their hip all day.

 

Pistol shooting was growing rapidly but much of the new intake were not interested in the target disciplines or learning the skills and techniques. All they were interested in was the Rambo stuff and heavy calibre combat weapons. Yes, I think ****** pretty much sums them up

I attended pistol 87 through to pistol 95 and saw no such dressing up,I know that combat jackets were basically banned after hungerford becase of the picture of ryan in a said jacket,this was supposedly to disassociate us from him somehow,(just what the logic behind that was I do not know) but the ban or frowning on of cammo gear has been laxed over the last 8 year or so in the target world,people do wear them but few and far between,I personally don't wear cammo gear for range stuff,there's no need of it,I'm not in the army!,trousers in cammo are more popular and are worn more by people,but to fashion concious youngsters and a large selection of people accross the country cammo in difering forms of clothing seems to be accepted into todays dress code, christ I've got a pair of swimming burmuda shorts from m&s in cammo!!!!!

[Vince Green]

I attended pistol 87 through to pistol 95 and saw no such dressing up,I know that combat jackets were basically banned after hungerford becase of the picture of ryan in a said jacket,this was supposedly to disassociate us from him somehow,(just what the logic behind that was I do not know) but the ban or frowning on of cammo gear has been laxed over the last 8 year or so in the target world,people do wear them but few and far between,I personally don't wear cammo gear for range stuff,there's no need of it,I'm not in the army!,trousers in cammo are more popular and are worn more by people,but to fashion concious youngsters and a large selection of people accross the country cammo in difering forms of clothing seems to be accepted into todays dress code, christ I've got a pair of swimming burmuda shorts from m&s in cammo!!!!!

Yes I know that cammo gear is not always wrong, I think you have to look a whole lot deeper than a pair of cammo bermuda shorts to get inside the minds of the people I am talking about.

[Mungler]

combat jackets were basically banned after hungerford becase of the picture of ryan in a said jacket,this was supposedly to disassociate us from him somehow,(just what the logic behind that was I do not know)

 

Well funny, and somehow not funny at all.

 

QED

 

This summarises everything I have struggling to "get at".

 

Shooters seem to have this complete inability to properly look at themselves through the eyes of everyone else. We may consider ourselves the most law obiding but failing to grasp that looking like Michael Ryan post Hungerford was probably "a bad thing".....well, public have longer memories for these large scale madacres carried out by "legitimate" FAC holders. We can say we are the most law obiding section of the community but the general public at large (with all of their votes) just aren't listening or don't believe us. Not surprising really when Everytime a "legitimate shooter" goes Tonto the body count always hits double figures.

 

I didn't know that Bisley had banned camo following Hungerford. I didn't know Vince Green was full on into pistol shooting; interesting first hand commentary. No doubt Vince is a plant from the Gun Control Network (insert shaking head emoticon here that I can't manage to do on an iPhone).

 

Bring on BASC and sporting shooters. The public "get" sporting shooting.

 

Sorry, but there it is.

Edited June 6, 2011 by Mungler

[the running man]

I see what you mean vince,wearing cammo on the range gives the wrong impression........throwing something into the mixing bowl of this highly lengthy topic,I want to put forward the issue of section 7 pistols, is everyone aware of the growing popularity of these pistols? And is everyone aware that bisley is not the only place you can shoot them. I hear the barbican armoury does them (confirmation needed) and also the tunnel in bridport is gonna or is doing them,I think there's a few places also that are also shooting them and storing them, so with this in mind and the rapidly growing lbp and lbr numbers,are we seeing a re-emergence of pistol shooting already? And further to this,if pistols are being stored at locations around the country,then why can't they store ordinary pistols also?

[WoodyPopper]

I've never shot pistols so I don't know whether it attracted fantasists or not. But I suspect it might have.

There's a guy who I've seen a couple of times at one of my local sporting clay clubs. He dresses all in black, wears his cartridges in two cartridge belts crossed across his chest and carries a pump action 12g on one hip and a semi automatic on the other. Now, he seems perfectly safe. The guns point skyward and have breech flags. He shoots well and safely. But people at the club notice him.

Given that he's a safe shot, it doesn't matter a damn what he wears.

But, if he were involved in an accident or other incident at the club, and it got into the news, the fall-out would be far worse than if some gamekeeper in moleskin breeks was involved. To anyone outside the sport, this guy must look worrying and, if he got into trouble, it would confirm a lot of people's prejudices.

And, John Batley in "Modern Pigeon Shooting" says something along the lines of "no need to dress like an urban terrorist to go pigeon shooting".

So, in an ideal world you should be able to wear whatever you please when shooting, and harbour any fantasies you like, as long as you don't act on them (I myself wear tweed plus-fours, a mustard coloured waistcoat, and an alpine hat when out after pigeons and my fantasies are indescribable). But the non-shooting public is one of the things that makes this not an ideal world and their views need to be considered.

Edited June 6, 2011 by WoodyPopper

[Mungler]

Spot on. It's just about looking at ourselves through the eyes of the general public who are likely to be uneducated as to shooting matters generally and yet who all have a vote and the equal ability as us to influence government.

 

Educating the general public is not easy and I think BASC is the only organisation with the resource and ability to do it.

[Vince Green]

I hear the barbican armoury does them (confirmation needed)

By the Barbican Armoury I presume you mean the range under the Barbican Centre in London Wall. I would still know this as Marylebone RPC but that name might have changed. It always was section 7 as far as I know.