reggiegun Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 Hi, Can anyone clear a legal matter out for me. I am after booking some accompanied Roe stalking using an estate rifle for my 16 year old son and myself. I have been told that it is illegal for anyone under the age of 18 to use an estate rifle, is this correct? I have just phoned BASC but they are closed, will phone tomorrow, but if anyone could clear this up for me tonight would be good. Reggiegun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cockercas Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 17 I think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highlander Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 The following is from the Home Office Guidance on Firearms Law. I've highlighted the relevant bit. Borrowed rifles on private premises 6.16 Section 16(1) of the 1988 Act enables a person to borrow a rifle from the occupier of private premises and to use it on those premises in the presence of either the occupier or their servant without holding a firearm certificate in respect of that rifle. It should be noted that this gives slightly more flexibility in the use of a borrowed rifle than is permissible with the use of a shot gun as described in paragraph 6.14, in that the borrowed rifle can also be used in the presence of the servant of the occupier. However, the occupier and/or their servant must hold a firearm certificate in respect of the firearm being used, and the borrower, who must be accompanied by the certificate holder (whether it is the occupier or their servant), must comply with the conditions of the certificate. These may include a safekeeping requirement and, in some cases, territorial restrictions. Section 57(4) of the 1968 Act defines “premises” as including any land. The effect of the provision is to allow a person visiting a private estate to borrow and use a rifle without a certificate. The exemption does not extend to persons under the age of 17 or to other types of firearm. There is no notification required on the loan of a firearm under these circumstances. A borrowed rifle should not be specifically identified as such on a “keeper’s” or “landowner’s” firearm certificate. The term “in the presence of” is not defined in law but is generally interpreted as being within sight and earshot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 Hi, Can anyone clear a legal matter out for me. I am after booking some accompanied Roe stalking using an estate rifle for my 16 year old son and myself. I have been told that it is illegal for anyone under the age of 18 to use an estate rifle, is this correct? I have just phoned BASC but they are closed, will phone tomorrow, but if anyone could clear this up for me tonight would be good. Reggiegun Talk to whoever is offering the accompanied Roe stalking for clarification, there are plenty of ways a youngster can legally use rifles! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highlander Posted June 2, 2011 Report Share Posted June 2, 2011 Dekers you obviously didn't read my post above! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 2, 2011 Report Share Posted June 2, 2011 Dekers you obviously didn't read my post above! Oh Dear! Chap, I really don't know what you are suggesting, but there are plenty of "Young" people with a FAC and there are plenty of people under age who use "ESTATE" rifles perfectly legally, just like my lad did for several years, (before he got his own FAC/SGC), with the blessing of the Police! You need to know the terms of the Paid shoot! There are LOADS of ways youngsters can use FAC tools! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted June 2, 2011 Report Share Posted June 2, 2011 Go on Highlander...................ask Dekers for the link to the relevant part of the legislation he is referring to. After all, it's his favorite reply when the boots on the other foot !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highlander Posted June 3, 2011 Report Share Posted June 3, 2011 Sorry chap I really can't be a****. The old saying about leading a horse to water springs to mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coolhead Posted June 3, 2011 Report Share Posted June 3, 2011 Sorry chap I really can't be a****. The old saying about leading a horse to water springs to mind. Here you go chap. In fairness to the OP here is the proof of what you've posted. You answered the OP's question quite clearly. Firearms (Amendment) Act 1988 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 3, 2011 Report Share Posted June 3, 2011 (edited) The OP appears to have asked the wrong question and/or worded it badly, unless this is not as he makes out! This is not an Estate Rifle, it appears by implication a rifle used on a Paid Stalk, that, as I have made clear depends on the conditions/terms of the company offering this service. IF it is simply accompanied by the Occupier, then I agree that is the way, but even then there are ways round it. My lad accompanied me, as occupier, under the age of 17 with the blessing of the Police! How about this then, can a 5 year old borrow a .357 Win Mag at a Home Office Approved Rifle club and USE IT?! Put things another way, are you all seriously suggesting that NOBODY under 17 can use a Firearm or even have one on FAC under any circumstances? B*******! Edited June 3, 2011 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 3, 2011 Report Share Posted June 3, 2011 So..what are the specifics of this shoot and what have the BASC said in response to the detail of the shoot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guest1957 Posted June 3, 2011 Report Share Posted June 3, 2011 Neatly set out information here: http://www.basc.org.uk/en/utilities/document-summary.cfm/docid/1F23558B-FA1D-42CE-8EA798BC75FD9D26 Can't find law that allows someone under 17 to use a rifle without an fac outside of a HO approved club, can anyone shed light on this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 3, 2011 Report Share Posted June 3, 2011 (edited) Neatly set out information here: http://www.basc.org.uk/en/utilities/document-summary.cfm/docid/1F23558B-FA1D-42CE-8EA798BC75FD9D26 Can't find law that allows someone under 17 to use a rifle without an fac outside of a HO approved club, can anyone shed light on this? One to think about ...carefully Can you find a law that says my lad, who does NOT have an Open FAC, can shoot on ANY land whilst out with me whether it is cleared or not using HIS rifle! Yet he can! So I guess every farmer/stalker/pest controller/"sports shooter"/etc who has ever let their son/daughter under 17 use his rifle has broken the law as well, I guess we need to build a few more prisons then! Edited June 3, 2011 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guest1957 Posted June 3, 2011 Report Share Posted June 3, 2011 One to think about ...carefully Can you find a law that says my lad, who does NOT have an Open FAC, can shoot on ANY land whilst out with me whether it is cleared or not using HIS rifle! Yet he can! So I guess every farmer/stalker/pest controller/"sports shooter"/etc who has ever let their son/daughter under 17 use his rifle has broken the law as well, I guess we need to build a few more prisons then! What it does show is that firearms law is a scrambled mess Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 What it does show is that firearms law is a scrambled mess Of that, there is no doubt whatsoever! They also suffer from VERY inconsistent interpretation around the country...but that's another thread altogether! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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