davidsuffolk Posted July 24, 2013 Report Share Posted July 24, 2013 I have been shooting for many years but I am fairly new to clays and pigeons. I have found I have been missing a much larger number than I would have hoped so today spent so time on clays. I can normally expect to hit most high tower and those coming towards me but frequently miss crossing birds both real and clay. A friend watched the shot and found I was missing underneath but with lead correct so I moved my point of aim to about 5 degrees above at which point I was breaking far more. Clearly, I can aim off to compensate but that doesn't seem the best answer so what do my learned friends here suggest is the best way to correct it. My gun is an Armsan semi (and I'm too poor to have another gun!) with a synthetic stock. I have seen other posts where shimming stocks has been suggested but would welcome thoughts from people more knowledgeable than me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OvEr_KiLL Posted July 24, 2013 Report Share Posted July 24, 2013 next time your out on the pigeons get a big piece of cardboard and draw a circle in the middle and then stand back and shoot the circle how you would normal shoot and it will tell you where the shot is going, maybe someone else can explain this a bit better as it was just a rough guide Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornfree Posted July 24, 2013 Report Share Posted July 24, 2013 Dead simple just tape some strips of card on the comb start with 1/8" shoot it and see.I've got 3/8" on mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Mongrel- Posted July 24, 2013 Report Share Posted July 24, 2013 Dead simple just tape some strips of card on the comb start with 1/8" shoot it and see.I've got 3/8" on mine. OK, I'm sure it's just me being a bit simple here but.... Surely this must alter the sight picture and leave you with a view of more of the rib? If so, that's a problem for me. I have a mid bead on the O/U and always just do a quick 'bead check' to confirm alignment. So, how does 'shimming' the stock potentially help me if I'm shooting off POA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OvEr_KiLL Posted July 24, 2013 Report Share Posted July 24, 2013 its basically how high your head is on the stock where point of aim is, changing the shims will lower or highten the stock which will make your eye higher or lower on the rib Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Mongrel- Posted July 25, 2013 Report Share Posted July 25, 2013 Understand that, so, are we saying that if I mount the gun and the two beads are aligned as they should be, then the stock height is correct for me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornfree Posted July 25, 2013 Report Share Posted July 25, 2013 I would remove the centre bead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karpman Posted July 25, 2013 Report Share Posted July 25, 2013 Understand that, so, are we saying that if I mount the gun and the two beads are aligned as they should be, then the stock height is correct for me? Always thought the beads were supposed to be figure of eight withe the back one being bottom. Mine snapped off cant say I miss it, only ever shot clays once and hit something like 27/50 so any advice off me is probably throw away lol. Karpman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted July 25, 2013 Report Share Posted July 25, 2013 The simplest and one of the cheapest ways to fix this would be to buy a " beartooth" comb raising kit , it comes witha stock cover and a number of foam inserts to raise the comb to whatever suits you. Not sure if the Armsan autos come with shims to raise the comb if they do get one fitted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OvEr_KiLL Posted July 25, 2013 Report Share Posted July 25, 2013 Understand that, so, are we saying that if I mount the gun and the two beads are aligned as they should be, then the stock height is correct for me? get out there and get on a pattern plate! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenhunter Posted July 26, 2013 Report Share Posted July 26, 2013 As has been said, you need to raise the comb, Shims, comb-raising kit or whatever. I have never had a gun which let me shoot with eyes seeing only the bead and no or very little rib showing and I have always needed to raise the comb or shoot with my head raised slightly. Yes, technically all you should see is the bead but its not incorrect to see the rib too. I think, if asked, loads of people would say they can see the rib too. Raising the comb is like raising the rear sight on a rifle, it makes the gun shoot higher which is what you need to do with yours. GH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidsuffolk Posted July 26, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 26, 2013 Much obliged to all the posters, I will have a go at doing this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted July 26, 2013 Report Share Posted July 26, 2013 Raise the comb try patterning the swing on to the centre of the plate not aiming at it. Go this at 16 yards as even inch of adjustment then roughly equals 1/16th of inch on the stock adjust the height of the comb as above the shoot a variety of target crosser driven and going away clays you'll soon know if its worked but its not an exact science. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Mongrel- Posted July 27, 2013 Report Share Posted July 27, 2013 I would remove the centre bead. Would you? Why? Seems to me that it makes it easier to line things up if you two points of reference. I like it so it stays! get out there and get on a pattern plate! Indeed, very useful and I have done so, the gun is shooting straight, my question is hypothetical as I am struggling to understand the practice behind the theory. B) Always thought the beads were supposed to be figure of eight withe the back one being bottom. Mine snapped off cant say I miss it, only ever shot clays once and hit something like 27/50 so any advice off me is probably throw away lol. Karpman To be honest, I only use it as an initial check, I like it as it tells me that the rib is aligned truly, very easily. Yes it is a figure of eight and if I have that picture then the rib must be perfectly aligned with my eye. if I were to shim the stock then my eye would surely be out of alignment. So, if it appears lined up but I shoot high, how can that happen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted July 27, 2013 Report Share Posted July 27, 2013 Removing your beads should make no difference because you shouldn't be looking at them. So if they where removed you wouldn't notice!!! Look at the target it sounds like you need a gunfit!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tignme Posted July 28, 2013 Report Share Posted July 28, 2013 All o/u n sxs shoot high when new n not altered ,semis shoot a shade lower. pattern plate as said 16 yds n dont aim shoot gun down call pull to self mount n shoot naturally. A proper steel pattern plate,shoot observe,repaint,observe,if you can n need to shim up and repattern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Mongrel- Posted July 28, 2013 Report Share Posted July 28, 2013 Removing your beads should make no difference because you shouldn't be looking at them. So if they where removed you wouldn't notice!!! Look at the target it sounds like you need a gunfit!!! Why? If I mount the gun and the beads are aligned, what's wrong with the gunfit? I get what you are saying about looking at the target, but if they had no purpose, why would they be fitted? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted July 28, 2013 Report Share Posted July 28, 2013 They look nice and people expect them. That's all they are there for. The beads aligning very little to do with good gunfit, it's one of those myths like holding the gun in the crook of the arn and finger on the trigger stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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