FAO BASC - Medical reports

[bedwards1966]

Well David, as far as I'm concerned you should be winning a prize for not answering questions.

 

Is BASC doing anything to stop the police from asking for medical reports and/or additional forms where the police have not made any actual demands for them (i.e they are only 'requesting' them)?

[bobt]

the police can ask for a gold bar if they want, but its only an ask,

 

I hope your FLO realises how argumentitive you are.

[David BASC]

And you should win top prize for not listening to my answers!

 

I will say again as you evidently have missed most of what I have posted:

 

PLEASE tell we which authorities are doing this so we can investigate, I need to see the additional paperwork that's being sent and what's being asked. Once we have that information we can take action.

 

Let me make it very clear for you as evidently you don't understand, that without this evidence we cannot take further action .

 

Can you please confirm that you understand what I have just posted?

[Kes]

the police can ask for a gold bar if they want, but its only an ask,

 

I hope your FLO realises how argumentitive you are.

Asking for what you believe you are entitled to is not being argumentative I suggest.Even pushinga point if you are sure of your ground. People who do not query and merely comply with unreasonable requests, rely on others to solve the problems on their behalf. I have said before Cheshire would not allow a .223 for muntjac - yes I complained and was given AOLQ, Good for Cheshire they put it right. I suspect other smay also benefit from the change ?

[Scully]

Scully, please tell me who the predominant BASC representative was so I can go and talk with them to get their side of the story

 

Also, as you keep saying that many shooters are being told to foot the bill for GP report, you evidently have contact with them so please ask them to contact me with full details of their constabulary, what documentation was sent regarding this, and how much they paid.

 

thanks

 

David

Sorry David, but I wont be identifying the 'prominent' person I spoke to I'm afraid, for obvious reasons. I can assure you however, that I have not fabricated nor elaborated anything I've related to this forum as part of the 'phone conversation regarding the GP's letter.

I believe Bedwards provided a link to another forum, as did I, on which there are examples of various people who have complied with the 'request' and paid for the report, and also the price they were charged by their surgery. On that forum you will also find the applicant of whom I spoke regarding his attempt to seek help from BASC and was advised to reapply in another 12 months due to his history of substance abuse and suicide attempt, and the subsequent outcome when he chose to ignore BASC's advice. I think his avatar is Daithom or something similar.

[David BASC]

Scully, it comes as no surprise that you wont tell me who you spoke to - but can you confirm it was someone from the firearms team?

 

I will look back through this thread for the links.

 

Its sound advice for someone who has been refused due to an issue such as drug abuse or attempted suicide for example to delay for 12 months and reapply, as in the vast majority of cases ( although there will always be exceptions to the rule) an appeal would fail, I don't think anyone on here wold find that strange.

 

David

[Scully]

the police can ask for a gold bar if they want, but its only an ask,

 

I hope your FLO realises how argumentitive you are.

Your point being? Are you implying that if his FLO (FEO?) realised how argumentative he is, it could go against him? Are you suggesting we take whatever carp we're offered to ensure we don't rock any boats? If this was the case my tickets would have been revoked some time ago, and those of my mate many many moons ago. I was under the impression the police and our licensing authorities were there to provide a service.

[Scully]

Scully, it comes as no surprise that you wont tell me who you spoke to - but can you confirm it was someone from the firearms team?

 

David

Then it will come as no surprise when I don't confirm your request. It was a lengthy conversation and despite it was obvious I was rather hostile at first, he was the most honest and open (although initially very defensive understandably) BASC representative I've spoken to in person for many a year. The more I speak to BASC representatives the more they start to sound like politicians sadly (perhaps it's the nature of the beast they're involved with as part of their work; who knows) but in this case, refreshingly, it wasn't so.

If what I have related during this thread is untrue, then no doubt BASC and all the other shooting organisations will refute my claims. Time will tell.

[David BASC]

No it does not, but I do have to wonder why you are being so secretive after making this statement several times. I want to get to the bottom of it. Oh well, I will ask the firearms team in the morning.

[Scully]

No it does not, but I do have to wonder why you are being so secretive after making this statement several times. I want to get to the bottom of it. Oh well, I will ask the firearms team in the morning.

Don't forget to post your findings on here. It will be interesting to compare notes.

[Medic1281]

David BASC, I have sent you a pm with regards to a GP report I had to get and pay for as part of my renewal application to west Mercia. The cost was. £15.

[bostonmick]

 

So no definite instances then just conjecture. I find it frustratingly difficuilt in holding a conversation with you bostonmick as I can't work out whether you have genuine problems in understanding what has been written or whether its just deliberate pig ignorant obstinance. As I've already stated, there are many instances of applicants paying the cost of a GP's report when requested to do so by some licensing authorities. It isn't conjecture; it is happening. As I also said, it is often newbies and first time applicants who are doing this because they fear the consequences of none compliance regardless of what the shooting organisations are saying. It is happening. It isn't conjecture, I don't know how to make it clearer.

As has been pointed out many times the forces that are asking for the gp letter are also stating on their forms that it is not a legal requirement. And has been pointed out many times also, we know this, but for a first time applicant in dealing with the police the act of non compliance is daunting. Do you suggest we just say,' that's your problem' and leave it at that ? So much for solidarity eh.

I would have thought that as all information you put on your applications has to be spot on that people would read the forms properly so therefore not go into panic mode and pay for letters.Well, unfortunately you thought wrong I'm afraid. I've just told you what's happening...again.

on the cost it is only on here that figures on any rise are being quoted as if I remember correctly it was not that long ago the police were refused the right to increase by Cameron. Yes, you're correct.

I dare say it will rise because everything does and as you say you are self employed you would understand that as I am sure your charges would have risen in the past ten years. This is totally irrelevant as my income is not funded by the taxpayer as the police budget is, and therefore the licensing fee, or in this case the cost of a GP's letter is, as it comes from the same budget.

so as there has been no change to either the cost or the requirements in law at the moment it is all

conjecture and unfounded.rumour at best. The cost is conjecture; I don't recall anyone claiming otherwise. The requirements in law is not conjecture, nor rumour however. It is based on information I received over the phone from a prominent BASC representative who assured me the compulsory GP's letter was 'coming; there is nothing we can do about it'. Not one of the shooting organisations has refuted this .They may well be involved in ongoing discussions with the HO etc, but not to have the practice stopped, only to see who foots the bill when the GP's letter becomes compulsory.

If anyone doubts my word all they have to do is visit the BASC website, fill in the requirements with your email, membership number etc, and then ask your question. I have done this twice now regarding this matter, and twice have been contacted within the day. Can't fault BASC there.atb

 

I think you would find it difficult to hold a conversation with anyone that has a different view to yours.this forum like all others is for all to air their opinions you may disagree with some of them as is your right but you do seem a little bullish and very keen to argue and border on insulting.i for one am in favour of the cost for applications being paid in full by the person wishing to gain a certificate.including the gp letter.the only question I can see over this is how would you stand if your gp was anti gun and refused to supply would the government make it compulsory for them to give the information. as far as I can see there is only one person who on here at the moment states they had to supply the letter at their own cost.they do not say why and the cost a princely £15.you have been told by a high ranked person in basc that things are going to change and there is nothing they can do to stop it so why are you still ranting on here.you like everyone else will comply with any new rules and costs or give up your guns.it really is that simple.we are a tiny tiny minority get used to it.

 

[wymberley]

David BASC, I have sent you a pm with regards to a GP report I had to get and pay for as part of my renewal application to west Mercia. The cost was. £15.

£15? Did you get it off ebay

[Scully]

 

 

 

 

I think you would find it difficult to hold a conversation with anyone that has a different view to yours.Yeah, you're probably right. Especially when that person advocates just blithely complying with any and all **** the licensing authorities, police and politicians dish out to us.this forum like all others is for all to air their opinions you may disagree with some of them as is your right but you do seem a little bullish and very keen to argue and border on insulting.Well I wont apologise for that ; if the cap fits . i for one am in favour of the cost for applications being paid in full by the person wishing to gain a certificate.including the gp letter.the only question I can see over this is how would you stand if your gp was anti gun and refused to supply would the government make it compulsory for them to give the information. Some are refusing 'to supply' on the grounds of doctor/patient confidentiality. Talks are ongoing with, amongst other parties, the BMA regarding this very matter. How would being an 'anti' would deter a GP from supplying a report?as far as I can see there is only one person who on here at the moment states they had to supply the letter at their own cost.they do not say why and the cost a princely £15. Correct, but this is just one forum . There are others who have complied with the GP's letter for whatever reason, and been charged more than the cost of a certificate. you have been told by a high ranked person in basc that things are going to change and there is nothing they can do to stop it so why are you still ranting on here.​Because I refuse to bend over and simply take it for no beneficial reason to t either the shooter nor the safety of the general public. The police are pushing it as an aris covering exercise in a cynical attempt to redeem themselves for the Atherton cock up.you like everyone else will comply with any new rules and costs or give up your guns.Very true.it really is that simple.we are a tiny tiny minority get used to it.One minute you're stating we should all be members of a shooting organisation as there's strength in numbers, now you're saying we should get used to the fact we can't do anything about it. Don't forget to say 'thank kindly sir' after you've pulled up your keks after the next shafting. Chip chip chip......

 

 

Edited May 29, 2014 by Scully

[David BASC]

Thanks Medic - much appreciated!

[bostonmick]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think you would find it difficult to hold a conversation with anyone that has a different view to yours.Yeah, you're probably right. Especially when that person advocates just blithely complying with any and all **** the licensing authorities, police and politicians dish out to us.this forum like all others is for all to air their opinions you may disagree with some of them as is your right but you do seem a little bullish and very keen to argue and border on insulting.Well I wont apologise for that ; if the cap fits . i for one am in favour of the cost for applications being paid in full by the person wishing to gain a certificate.including the gp letter.the only question I can see over this is how would you stand if your gp was anti gun and refused to supply would the government make it compulsory for them to give the information. Some are refusing 'to supply' on the grounds of doctor/patient confidentiality. Talks are ongoing with, amongst other parties, the BMA regarding this very matter. How would being an 'anti' would deter a GP from supplying a report?as far as I can see there is only one person who on here at the moment states they had to supply the letter at their own cost.they do not say why and the cost a princely £15. Correct, but this is just one forum . There are others who have complied with the GP's letter for whatever reason, and been charged more than the cost of a certificate. you have been told by a high ranked person in basc that things are going to change and there is nothing they can do to stop it so why are you still ranting on here.​Because I refuse to bend over and simply take it for no beneficial reason to t either the shooter nor the safety of the general public. The police are pushing it as an aris covering exercise in a cynical attempt to redeem themselves for the Atherton cock up.you like everyone else will comply with any new rules and costs or give up your guns.Very true.it really is that simple.we are a tiny tiny minority get used to it.One minute you're stating we should all be members of a shooting organisation as there's strength in numbers, now you're saying we should get used to the fact we can't do anything about it. Don't forget to say 'thank kindly sir' after you've pulled up your keks after the next shafting. Chip chip chip......

You do sound like a very angry and volatile young chap not a good combination when put with firearms. I do hope you manage to get into a good anger management course before you do either yourself or others harm.we are a small minority and although we may win the odd small victory along the way the general populous do not like guns and we are viewed with suspicion and scepticism and will be used by any government as a vote winner.and yes I advocate that all those involved in country sports/pursuits should be members of our organisations and not just for the sake of argument. As for being shafted as you keep saying just check your keks the next time you fill your car with fuel. Read your gas/electric/water or even council tax bill.because you may need to pull them up yourself.atb

[Kes]

You do sound like a very angry and volatile young chap not a good combination when put with firearms. I do hope you manage to get into a good anger management course before you do either yourself or others harm.we are a small minority and although we may win the odd small victory along the way the general populous do not like guns and we are viewed with suspicion and scepticism and will be used by any government as a vote winner.and yes I advocate that all those involved in country sports/pursuits should be members of our organisations and not just for the sake of argument. As for being shafted as you keep saying just check your keks the next time you fill your car with fuel. Read your gas/electric/water or even council tax bill.because you may need to pull them up yourself.atb

I am sorry I agree with Scullys view of you and your posts - as I have mentioned before, many of them are simply not worth reading. This last paternalistic carp is typical and your final rejoinder is very reminiscent of 'my dads bigger than your Dad'. Best you stop playing with the bigger boys - IMHO, atb.

I again refuse to respond to your infantile comments.

[wymberley]

You do sound like a very angry and volatile young chap not a good combination when put with firearms. I do hope you manage to get into a good anger management course before you do either yourself or others harm.we are a small minority and although we may win the odd small victory along the way the general populous do not like guns and we are viewed with suspicion and scepticism and will be used by any government as a vote winner.and yes I advocate that all those involved in country sports/pursuits should be members of our organisations and not just for the sake of argument. As for being shafted as you keep saying just check your keks the next time you fill your car with fuel. Read your gas/electric/water or even council tax bill.because you may need to pull them up yourself.atb

Now that's a shame. You just blew it. Although I don't agree with much that you've said - some I do - I could appreciate where you're coming from.

 

You're now saying though that the HO and police should be permitted to make a profit from the issue of our certificates as do the examples of the businesses you named from their products. Even then, are you not aware that many - who in no way can be considered a minority - are equally angry and at times equally volatile about the prices/profit margins we are forced to pay for the products you mention. Surely, if it is acceptable for the majority of folk to complain vigorously, then in a democracy, the minority, however small, are equally entitled to do likewise.

[Scully]

Great post mick; at least your drivel is consistent.
Because I'm a firearms owner I'm not allowed to feel angry about the **** we are consistently shovelled eh, and should just sit back and stop complaining?
Pathetic.

Young chap!! I'm 55 next month.

Edited May 29, 2014 by Scully

[the_rains]

Interesting thread i was recently charged 65£ for my medical certificate

[bostonmick]

Now that's a shame. You just blew it. Although I don't agree with much that you've said - some I do - I could appreciate where you're coming from.

 

You're now saying though that the HO and police should be permitted to make a profit from the issue of our certificates as do the examples of the businesses you named from their products. Even then, are you not aware that many - who in no way can be considered a minority - are equally angry and at times equally volatile about the prices/profit margins we are forced to pay for the products you mention. Surely, if it is acceptable for the majority of folk to complain vigorously, then in a democracy, the minority, however small, are equally entitled to do likewise.

in none of my posts have I said that you cannot complain about anything.as far as I am aware the home office or the police are not seeking a profit from your certificates just to cover the cost of processing them.i believe that to be fair you do not.i remember a few years back when the list of referee's was purely made up of professionals who charged to sign the photo's and your forms around £25 in most cases.yet everyone was only to happy to go along with it.perhaps basc and the others could suggest a simple one question form asking gp's if they know of any reason why this person should not be permitted a firearm.just tick a yes or no box.then we could all bung them a tenner for their trouble and jobs a good un.onless you would consider that being shafted as well.atb

[David BASC]

Scully,

 

I have spoken to all members of the firearms team, no one can remember such a conversation, so unless you can point me in the right direction....

 

I can confirm however that BASC are still 100% opposed to compulsory medical reports.

 

David

[bostonmick]

Great post mick; at least your drivel is consistent.

Because I'm a firearms owner I'm not allowed to feel angry about the **** we are consistently shovelled eh, and should just sit back and stop complaining?

Pathetic.

you are perfectly entitled to complain.as you have obviously done.you have as you say been in contact with basc and had it from a very high source that it wil come and they can do not much about it only try and limit the damage.which is something that has not been mentioned all the comments here say stop it dead nobody has come up with a compromise that's the normal way.all you are looking at is a small rise in costs it could be much worse they could raise the criteria for ownership that could cause far bigger problems.

[bostonmick]

I am sorry I agree with Scullys view of you and your posts - as I have mentioned before, many of them are simply not worth reading. This last paternalistic carp is typical and your final rejoinder is very reminiscent of 'my dads bigger than your Dad'. Best you stop playing with the bigger boys - IMHO, atb.

I again refuse to respond to your infantile comments.

in case you had not noticed you just replied.

[bostonmick]

Scully,

 

I have spoken to all members of the firearms team, no one can remember such a conversation, so unless you can point me in the right direction....

 

I can confirm however that BASC are still 100% opposed to compulsory medical reports.

 

David

 

I hope this will be enough to silence the complainers.but I doubt it. I sympathise with you david that because of who you work for you are sometimes seen as a battering ram on here you are a far more patient person than most.