Airguns to die a slow death?

[alanlee]

I rang up Uttings today to order a scope, and asked him what they were doing when the new 'no mail-order' rules come into effect in October.

Basically, they are going to cut back, and keep a very limited range of guns in stock, if someone does want a gun, then it will likely have to be ordered in, as they will not be able to afford to keep stock in any more, as their main market (mail order) will have gone.

It is rumoured that Ramsbottoms are no longer ordering in any guns,and they'll be doing the same.

The thought is that gun shops will now be getting the extra trade, but according to the man at Uttings, that will not happen, as the manufacturers need to get decent orders in before they make a batch of guns, and 1 shop ordering a gun is not likely to get it until another 50 or so guns have been ordered,and 1 shop is very unlikely to sell a large amount of guns without the mail order side of their business, so it may be a long wait to get a certain gun. When a big mail order shop currently orders guns from, say, BSA, they order 150-200, which they can sell in a couple of months.

The Uttings man thinks there will be a number of casualties amongst the makers. Daystate and Theoben may be safe, as they are very small, and dont usually go in for bulk orders. Air Arms and AGS are likely to be suffering when the ban starts,and, to a lesser extent, so are BSA, but they export a lot, so will be insulated a little more.

Now is not the time to buy gun makers shares.

Alan.

[WeihrauchPower]

As long as there's plenty of us (which there is), and lots of interested newcomers airgunning will survive.

It will be very sad if some of these companys which we have used and have relied upon over the years can't survive though.

[naddan28]

As long as there's plenty of us (which there is), and lots of interested newcomers airgunning will survive.

It will be very sad if some of these companys which we have used and have relied upon over the years can't survive though.

Also sad, that the fact local gunshops charge more than mail order companies and without any competition from them... are going to continue to rip us off and just make a bigger profit as sales will increase.

[farmer]

As long as there's plenty of us (which there is), and lots of interested newcomers airgunning will survive.

It will be very sad if some of these companys which we have used and have relied upon over the years can't survive though.

Also sad, that the fact local gunshops charge more than mail order companies and without any competition from them... are going to continue to rip us off and just make a bigger profit as sales will increase.

Thats my main concern aswell, so I travel about 30 miles to get a decent "HONEST" deal.

[08shooter]

guys here in n ireland everything is on ticket i used to have to get pellets marked on.the gunshops here have you over a barrel as you have to buy from them.a good point about airguns on fac are that it takes the guns out of hoodlums reach.if i buy a gun today i could wait four months before i get it home,im waiting on 2 at the moment.we have isolated problems in n ireland but they are few and far between now which is a good thing as negative press coverage against guns harms our sport each time.i will say that if they make you buy from rfds it will not be the end of the world but yes it may be a little more expensive.mr blair will think that by going this route he will take guns out of circulation which looks good but its the illegal guns he has to worry about

[caplock]

Yep it's going to die a death.

 

Get what you want now before they all dry up. Only make sure it's a goodun and will last a good few years. Next step, within 5 years once the free for all trade in airguns has dried up, a form of airgun license and central airweapons database 'CAD', not so stringent as fac but with age and legal constraints, obtainable from the post office and to include photo and other biometric info as well as details of guns held.

 

Price to be confirmed.

 

The first entries on such 'ticket' will follow a 6 month 'amnesty' after introduction in which time guns already held will be able to be entered.

 

Therafter sales and purchases will have to be face to face with details exchanged ala shotgun and FA's

Mis sold or illegally held air weapons after this period will incurr severe £penalties and crim record.

Enjoy

[ss12]

if the government wants to stop people comitting crimes with airguns i think they should ban the sale of cheap airguns insted of all airgun (which will eventualy happen)e.g. anything under £60-70 because a majority of people who would go into a shop and spend a few hundred pounds on an airgun is not Likely to run about shooting others with it

[Cranfield]

The commercial logic that manufacturers of air weapons will not make stock if mail order is discontinued, makes no sense whatsoever.

 

The customer and the requirement will still be there, except the customer will go to his/her local Gunshop to purchase the weapon, or accessory.

 

The Distributor/Importer will hold the stock and send what is required to the Gunshops (as now happens with shotguns), this could be ten weapons, or one.

 

Licensing may be on the horizon (some would say about time), perhaps an adjustment in age requirements, but airgunning will not die a slow death.

[naddan28]

The commercial logic that manufacturers of air weapons will not make stock if mail order is discontinued, makes no sense whatsoever.

 

The customer and the requirement will still be there, except the customer will go to his/her local Gunshop to purchase the weapon, or accessory.

 

The Distributor/Importer will hold the stock and send what is required to the Gunshops (as now happens with shotguns), this could be ten weapons, or one.

 

Licensing may be on the horizon (some would say about time), perhaps an adjustment in age requirements, but airgunning will not die a slow death.

I agree that airgunning wont die a slow death, however I do very much doubt that RFD's will be pasing on their new economies of scales toward us. instead just creaming a higher gross profit margin for themselves. :@ Looking at things now its cheaper to get a CZ .17HMR, FAC, scope and gunsafe than a new top end pcp multishot rifle with scope (before you even think of striup pumps/buddy bottles etc). With inflated costs from RFD's its going to make things even worse!

 

The decrease in competition for RFD's is going to turn a perfectly competitive market into a oligopoly/ monopoly (in area's with only one local RFD) which will either benefit or detriment us. I am betting as said earlier its going to harm us rather than benefit us. B) :@ B)

[WeihrauchPower]

if the government wants to stop people comitting crimes with airguns i think they should ban the sale of cheap airguns insted of all airgun (which will eventualy happen)e.g. anything under £60-70 because a majority of people who would go into a shop and spend a few hundred pounds on an airgun is not Likely to run about shooting others with it

 

I agree.

I'm sure most accidents and wounding of peoples pets happen when cheap airguns are given to kids to "play with" or bought by idiots.

There is no place for these cheap imitation plinkers if they are going to ruin a serious sport for others.

I don't want to start an argument as i really enjoyed plinking as a kid but these low powered rifles and pistols are alot more dangerous, especially when it comes to ricochets.

How many dogs, cats and children are shot with an air arms s410?, much more likely to be a B2.

[Mungler]

The commercial logic that manufacturers of air weapons will not make stock if mail order is discontinued, makes no sense whatsoever.

 

The customer and the requirement will still be there, except the customer will go to his/her local Gunshop to purchase the weapon, or accessory.

 

The Distributor/Importer will hold the stock and send what is required to the Gunshops (as now happens with shotguns), this could be ten weapons, or one.

 

Licensing may be on the horizon (some would say about time), perhaps an adjustment in age requirements, but airgunning will not die a slow death.

I agree that airgunning wont die a slow death, however I do very much doubt that RFD's will be pasing on their new economies of scales toward us. instead just creaming a higher gross profit margin for themselves. :@ Looking at things now its cheaper to get a CZ .17HMR, FAC, scope and gunsafe than a new top end pcp multishot rifle with scope (before you even think of striup pumps/buddy bottles etc). With inflated costs from RFD's its going to make things even worse!

 

The decrease in competition for RFD's is going to turn a perfectly competitive market into a oligopoly/ monopoly (in area's with only one local RFD) which will either benefit or detriment us. I am betting as said earlier its going to harm us rather than benefit us. B) :@ B)

 

 

 

I think it is because the airgun market is driven by hard advertising, and with no mail order then the advertising will die as well.

 

A couple of shooting mags will bite the big one on this.

[pin]

To be honest the airgun "shooting comics" are mostly devoid of any fresh content from as far back as I can remember, they do the standard "no bad reviews" rubbish and fill the pages with advertising - its laughable that they dare to charge a fee for obtaining them considering the obvious advertising revenue streams they have.

 

When businesses face challenges which can be foreseen and they don't react, I don't have any sympathy for them at all. Other industries deal with disruptive influences all the time and don't go bust - why should this lot be any different?

 

Instead of bleating and moaning, if one of them got together and formed a detailed and comprehensive index of all the gun shops selling air rifles and catalogued their services, locations and prices I don't see why this change in the law would have that much of a detrimental effect on sales

[SNAKEBITE]

Aiguns will not die.

 

All that is going to happen is we will see a return to days when there was no mail order, when there was no internet and people used to go to shops and speak to real people.

I am only 36 and can remember those days, it might come as a shock to those who have grown up in the "computer age" but we really did manage quite well before they came along.

It is called having a life really.

[Lightning BSA]

hi all,

 

Computers and internet is not everything, if want somthing you gonna have to purchase face to face, biggest problem is that people have forgotten what the world used to be like without the internet and is taken for granted, beside theres always a way round it, we'll just have to wait and see what the new law brings in.

 

Lightning BSA

[col s10]

bit confused on this one ,are they stopping mail order simply because they send aweapon through the post

[alanlee]

bit confused on this one ,are they stopping mail order simply because they send aweapon through the post

 

No, you can have a gun sent through the post to you, but it must be to a Registered Firearms Dealer, who will check your ID when you collect it. Finding a RFD close to you, who will accept a posted gun will be difficult, plus they will charge an admin fee for their services, typically £25, thus making the mail-order gun a lot more expensive, and less convenient.

All sales by Trade sellers have to be face to face, or via another RFD.

 

You can then walk out of the shop, and sell it to whoever you want (aged 18+) without any paperwork at all, and no ID check.

So it is a very poor law that will only hit the legitimate gun trade, and do nothing to stop hooligans using their 20 year old BSA Meteor to take pot-shots at passing people.

Alan.

[naddan28]

Aiguns will not die.

 

All that is going to happen is we will see a return to days when there was no mail order, when there was no internet and people used to go to shops and speak to real people.

I am only 36 and can remember those days, it might come as a shock to those who have grown up in the "computer age" but we really did manage quite well before they came along.

It is called having a life really.

Thanks snakebite, I have a life! I am more concerned with the effect on prices etc through the new law as I stated previously. I dont care if i have to go out and buy it or order it online, just I would prefer to know the new laws didn't have RFD's creaming a nice newly found profit due to the fact that they now have increased customer base.

[pin]

I think you will find the poor local RFD's will be glad of this. Speak to any one of them and they will tell you they feel like shop windows for internet buyers.

 

Personally I am all for this, when you buy a gun you want to touch it and shoulder it and make sure you like it - if you do that at your local gunshop and then buy online to save £30 then shame on you, the next time you dive round there when you have run out of pellets they might not be there.

 

Support your local gunshop, how knows, this may even mean a few more RFD's spring up

[naddan28]

I think you will find the poor local RFD's will be glad of this. Speak to any one of them and they will tell you they feel like shop windows for internet buyers.

 

Personally I am all for this, when you buy a gun you want to touch it and shoulder it and make sure you like it - if you do that at your local gunshop and then buy online to save £30 then shame on you, the next time you dive round there when you have run out of pellets they might not be there.

 

Support your local gunshop, how knows, this may even mean a few more RFD's spring up

Don't get me wrong PIN, I actually brought my air rifle from the local gunsmith. Just, the potential for local RFD's to exploit our new situation is quite huge. Last time I went into my local RFD he was more interested in looking at his book than actually serving me, bearing in mind I have spent £200+ in 3 months I would not consider myself a window shopper.

[col s10]

bought mine from uttings if you dont like it ,you just send it back ,bit more hassle i know,its just sad another service has been taken awaw from us

[pin]

Don't get me wrong PIN, I actually brought my air rifle from the local gunsmith. Just, the potential for local RFD's to exploit our new situation is quite huge. Last time I went into my local RFD he was more interested in looking at his book than actually serving me, bearing in mind I have spent £200+ in 3 months I would not consider myself a window shopper.

 

I spend hundreds every month, if I was dealing with one who did that to me i'd take my custom elsewhere

[kirky640]

 

Also sad, that the fact local gunshops charge more than mail order companies and without any competition from them... are going to continue to rip us off and just make a bigger profit as sales will increase.

 

hello naddan28

 

if our local gun shops dont make proffit they will close !!!!

remember they have over heads that many mail order firm wont have

and the advice and banter in a gun shop can be priceless

 

and that would be sad

 

just another way of looking at it mate

 

the gun shop has to make money to pay his way in life dont grudge him it mate

 

cheers kirky

and i dont think there is any point to monitoring my posts as i can edit them anyway

sorry but the divel in me made put this in

i no im a bady and should no better

[naddan28]

 

Don't get me wrong PIN, I actually brought my air rifle from the local gunsmith. Just, the potential for local RFD's to exploit our new situation is quite huge. Last time I went into my local RFD he was more interested in looking at his book than actually serving me, bearing in mind I have spent £200+ in 3 months I would not consider myself a window shopper.

 

I spend hundreds every month, if I was dealing with one who did that to me i'd take my custom elsewhere

Thats the point PIN, We dont have any other local RFD's and Kirky, this one I dont think will pass on any savings they recieve through bulk buying etc and just abuse there monopoly powers by keeping prices high. They, will just by themselves shiny new landrover defenders

[kirky640]

 

Don't get me wrong PIN, I actually brought my air rifle from the local gunsmith. Just, the potential for local RFD's to exploit our new situation is quite huge. Last time I went into my local RFD he was more interested in looking at his book than actually serving me, bearing in mind I have spent £200+ in 3 months I would not consider myself a window shopper.

 

I spend hundreds every month, if I was dealing with one who did that to me i'd take my custom elsewhere

Thats the point PIN, We dont have any other local RFD's and Kirky, this one I dont think will pass on any savings they recieve through bulk buying etc and just abuse there monopoly powers by keeping prices high. They, will just by themselves shiny new landrover defenders

good for the gun shops

 

if you have a good gun shop and owner you can be sure they wont sell air and or any guns on to

hoodys and the like, and this will help keep our sport clean and tidy

 

its good that thugs cant just go and order guns by post

 

i see this as a step in the rite direction in helping to stop ****** bringing our shooting into

disrepute

 

go hagal with your you never know you just might get a few quid knocked off

 

i do and save some money now and then

its part of the fun buying something is the hageling over price

 

cheers kirky

[JJaxeman]

"i do and save some money now and then

its part of the fun buying something is the hageling over price

 

cheers kirky"

 

 

You tite wad I agree its the face to face that counts and is lasting with a good shop unlike the click here to continue on the internet The day to day shop is having the hardest of times at best with the internet shipping fiasco and I am one of them internet bargain hunters myself but this kind of purchase does not lend it self to a internet self service sales sitution IMHO and it is therefore my opinion air weapons should be shop only based sales and not internet to save our heritage