sgc cert

[ROBLATCH]

i have a freind who recently applied for his sgc.after waiting 3 weeks he got a letter stating that the application had been declined for not supplying the correct information on the form as regards to the firearms act.apparently he has had a criminal record for violence related offences the last being over 10 years ago.when he called the police to state he had previousy called into the local police office to ask for his file of convictions the local f.a.o had told him to supply as much information as he could remember and when the f.a.o comes out to see him he would rectify the results.again when telephoning the local f.a.o she told him it was because he had 2 convictions relating to violence ( 1 of which he was cleared) and they were quite close together.

 

any advice

[darebear]

i have a freind who recently applied for his sgc.after waiting 3 weeks he got a letter stating that the application had been declined for not supplying the correct information on the form as regards to the firearms act.apparently he has had a criminal record for violence related offences the last being over 10 years ago.when he called the police to state he had previousy called into the local police office to ask for his file of convictions the local f.a.o had told him to supply as much information as he could remember and when the f.a.o comes out to see him he would rectify the results.again when telephoning the local f.a.o she told him it was because he had 2 convictions relating to violence ( 1 of which he was cleared) and they were quite close together.

 

any advice

 

 

 

 

i have no idea at all.

 

im just wondering, regardless of whether he forgot to mention this offence - would he been have denied it anyway because of the violent nature of the offence in the first place?

 

what was it? S18 or S20? because im not sure a S47 offence would matter.

 

but like i said, i have no idea really.

[Graham M]

Sorry Roblatch, but with the best will in the world I wouldn’t give a SGC to ANYONE with a violent criminal record.

He must have known he wouldn’t get one either, which is why he didn’t put it down on his form.

G.M.

[muckybear]

thats a bit harsh you can`t judge every book by its cover you don`t know the nature of the offence you can poke someone these days and get done for assult the law has gone mad m8

[naddan28]

As you seem to be a BASC member ROB give em' a call I am sure they will be able to provide a definitive answer and if necessary help up (obviously your friend will need to become a member).

 

Graham they have given 2 local bouncer's them where I live, I only know as they shoot on the farm I shoot. These two, certainly are not the type for a SGC and FAC but there you go.

[Blackbart]

The problem with firearms licenseing is consistency 1 force will contradict another force sometimes even within the same force they tell you different things.There should be a set of criteria that is written in stone that ALL forces have to abide by and not what we have at he minute which is a set of GUIDELINES that some jobsworth can interpret however he sees fit.

[muckybear]

As you seem to be a BASC member ROB give em' a call I am sure they will be able to provide a definitive answer and if necessary help up (obviously your friend will need to become a member).

 

Graham they have given 2 local bouncer's them where I live, I only know as they shoot on the farm I shoot. These two, certainly are not the type for a SGC and FAC but there you go.

i hold a sgc and i was a doorman for ages not all doormen are knobhead thugs i can look after my self but that doesn`t mean i would go around knocking **** out of people for the sake of it so thats a bit harsh because you have to get checked by the pold to get a door badge same as a shotgun or fire arm

[ROBLATCH]

i have a freind who recently applied for his sgc.after waiting 3 weeks he got a letter stating that the application had been declined for not supplying the correct information on the form as regards to the firearms act.apparently he has had a criminal record for violence related offences the last being over 10 years ago.when he called the police to state he had previousy called into the local police office to ask for his file of convictions the local f.a.o had told him to supply as much information as he could remember and when the f.a.o comes out to see him he would rectify the results.again when telephoning the local f.a.o she told him it was because he had 2 convictions relating to violence ( 1 of which he was cleared) and they were quite close together.

 

any advice

 

 

 

 

i have no idea at all.

 

im just wondering, regardless of whether he forgot to mention this offence - would he been have denied it anyway because of the violent nature of the offence in the first place?

 

what was it? S18 or S20? because im not sure a S47 offence would matter.

 

but like i said, i have no idea really.

 

i have asked him what section it was he was charged with and he tells me it was public order.

[Mungler]

How long ago were they? If one is expired then it's +10 years ago, but what about the other.

 

If you have been naughty years ago its about convincing them you are a reformed character.

 

The form is 100% clear on the fact you have to disclose *everything* including expired offences. Which bit of that did your mate not understand?

[Blackbart]

public order isnt a conviction for violence

[muckybear]

i have a freind who recently applied for his sgc.after waiting 3 weeks he got a letter stating that the application had been declined for not supplying the correct information on the form as regards to the firearms act.apparently he has had a criminal record for violence related offences the last being over 10 years ago.when he called the police to state he had previousy called into the local police office to ask for his file of convictions the local f.a.o had told him to supply as much information as he could remember and when the f.a.o comes out to see him he would rectify the results.again when telephoning the local f.a.o she told him it was because he had 2 convictions relating to violence ( 1 of which he was cleared) and they were quite close together.

 

any advice

 

 

 

 

i have no idea at all.

 

im just wondering, regardless of whether he forgot to mention this offence - would he been have denied it anyway because of the violent nature of the offence in the first place?

 

what was it? S18 or S20? because im not sure a S47 offence would matter.

 

but like i said, i have no idea really.

 

i have asked him what section it was he was charged with and he tells me it was public order.

you can sing in the street and get done for public order think your flo has been a bit harsh on your man unless he banged somebody and he ay telling you the whole truth unless there is a mis understanding i.e he didn`t fill the form incomplete because it was from yester year etc

[naddan28]

As you seem to be a BASC member ROB give em' a call I am sure they will be able to provide a definitive answer and if necessary help up (obviously your friend will need to become a member).

 

Graham they have given 2 local bouncer's them where I live, I only know as they shoot on the farm I shoot. These two, certainly are not the type for a SGC and FAC but there you go.

i hold a sgc and i was a doorman for ages not all doormen are knobhead thugs i can look after my self but that doesn`t mean i would go around knocking **** out of people for the sake of it so thats a bit harsh because you have to get checked by the pold to get a door badge same as a shotgun or fire arm

Mucky I know personally what these two are like, not all doormen I know. I used to on occasions do the odd bit of martial arts with them and althou their where the odd few who's nuckles dragged and seemed to enjoy trying to kill me (I was 14 at the time!) the majority were alright, honest blokes. However, I sure you know from your years of exp that there are a few ******. These two, well espically one of them is.

[Blackbart]

convictions are never classed as spent when you are applying for certain police checks ie working with kids,disabled applying for fac etc etc

[muckybear]

As you seem to be a BASC member ROB give em' a call I am sure they will be able to provide a definitive answer and if necessary help up (obviously your friend will need to become a member).

 

Graham they have given 2 local bouncer's them where I live, I only know as they shoot on the farm I shoot. These two, certainly are not the type for a SGC and FAC but there you go.

i hold a sgc and i was a doorman for ages not all doormen are knobhead thugs i can look after my self but that doesn`t mean i would go around knocking **** out of people for the sake of it so thats a bit harsh because you have to get checked by the pold to get a door badge same as a shotgun or fire arm

Mucky I know personally what these two are like, not all doormen I know. I used to on occasions do the odd bit of martial arts with them and althou their where the odd few who's nuckles dragged and seemed to enjoy trying to kill me (I was 14 at the time!) the majority were alright, honest blokes. However, I sure you know from your years of exp that there are a few ******. These two, well espically one of them is.

 

you are quite right kid there are some ******* who throw there weight around and these people don`t desire jack never mind sgc or fac sorry for jumping down your throat but i used to get it all the time YOUR ALL THE SAME BIG BULLIES i never was like that didn`t need to be

[Blackbart]

Best bet rob is tell your mate to say he has just arrived in the country(preferably in the back of a lorry)claim political asylum,say he has been racialy abused,oh and it would help if he was a single lesbian vegetarian one parent mum.He will get a council house,job dodgers allowance,relocation allowance,an interest free loan from the european equal rights commitee and you never know they might let him have a gun

[ROBLATCH]

public order isnt a conviction for violence

 

thats exactly right mate but the prosecuter in court apparently said the words used were lets kill the black bs which caused harrasment alarm or distress to others and the fear or provocation of violence.

i know harrasment alarm or distress is section 5 but havent got a clue about the other (i,l have to ask him)

 

thats a bit harsh you can`t judge every book by its cover you don`t know the nature of the offence you can poke someone these days and get done for assult the law has gone mad m8

 

the basc is there to give independent advice to members ! i dont think they will tell me about a freinds problems - or will they ?

[taffygun]

You're mate might do well to phone his FEO and ask him if he's been declined for his offences or the fact that he did not supply the information. If its the latter then its probably be declined as it looks like he was trying to cover up his past offences and hope they wouldn't get brought up, as said earlier - absolutely everything you've done is kept on file, its just the rehabilitation of offenders act that stops anyone other than government bodies knowing what has happened in the past. That act does not apply in FAC/SGC applications. If he's been declined tell him to ask if he's allowed to reapply, if he is then when he fills his form in the next time tell him to write in the convictions box " Please refer to your records of my previous convictions as i'm unsure of exact dates and offences " Then also tell him to put in any driving convictions or on-the-spot fines he's had in the last 6 years.

[markbivvy]

You're mate might do well to phone his FEO and ask him if he's been declined for his offences or the fact that he did not supply the information.

 

as above.

 

If its the latter then its probably be declined as it looks like he was trying to cover up his past .

and think himself lucky he has not been charged.

[taffygun]

thats exactly right mate but the prosecuter in court apparently said the words used were lets kill the black bs which caused harrasment alarm or distress to others and the fear or provocation of violence.

 

Oh hell....racially motivated threats to kill, looked upon probably as severely as actually beating the kak out of someone.

 

Your M8 might be better admitting defeat and trying again in a few years, and staying well out of trouble in the meantime

 

If its the latter then its probably be declined as it looks like he was trying to cover up his past .

and think himself lucky he has not been charged.

 

 

[ROBLATCH]

Sorry Roblatch, but with the best will in the world I wouldn’t give a SGC to ANYONE with a violent criminal record.

He must have known he wouldn’t get one either, which is why he didn’t put it down on his form.

G.M.

 

he did put it on his form but obviously if over 10 years ago couldnt rember when and as the guy is nearly 50 yrs old other petty teanager things came into it which he couldnt remember.

[markbivvy]

there is a thing called a DB1.( i think) available from the the police office for a tenner. its a record of convictions.anyone in any doubt at all should get it when asking for fac/sgc. saves loads of aggro.

[taffygun]

There is a difference in violent criminal history, I am ashamed to admit that I have convictions for violence in my past, and I would rather curl up and die than go back to the way I used to live. i'm not saying I was a hooligan or a thug but my convictions were for retaliating. I have changed my life around and I have direction now. I have a future ex-wife and 2 beautiful kids, people can change if they so wish.

 

So I believe that everyone is taken on their own merit. I have been given my credit as well as i'm now a proud SGC and FAC holder, I sat down with my FEO's and answered every question he had to ask, even though it made me embarassed beyond belief.

 

there is a thing called a DB1.( i think) available from the the police office for a tenner. its a record of convictions.anyone in any doubt at all should get it when asking for fac/sgc. saves loads of aggro.

 

That only shows convictions or arrests from the last 6 years Mark. It may be of no use to most applying for certs, it wasn't for me

[markbivvy]

That only shows convictions or arrests from the last 6 years Mark. It may be of no use to most applying for certs, it wasn't for me

 

mine had 1 from 38 years back.

[ROBLATCH]

How long ago were they? If one is expired then it's +10 years ago, but what about the other.

 

If you have been naughty years ago its about convincing them you are a reformed character.

 

The form is 100% clear on the fact you have to disclose *everything* including expired offences. Which bit of that did your mate not understand?

 

as i said he could not remember the exact offences of which he hsad been convicted most of which were over 20 years ago and that,s why the f.a.o told him to apply what he could remember and they would rectify on the visit.

[Highlander]

My take on this would be that he’s been refused because he didn’t disclose the info NOT because of the info although that might have had some bearing. Saying you forgot is like saying you didn’t see the red traffic light…it doesn’t wash. No good trying to cover up...big brother is watching!

 

It’s not for us to judge who does and who doesn’t get a certificate that’s for ol’ bill I just wish when they get it wrong (Hungerford/Dunblane) they’d sack the bloke responsible rather than give him a damn great golden handshake.