njc110381 Posted November 17, 2015 Report Share Posted November 17, 2015 Hey guys. I'm developing a foxing load for my 6.5 and want to get a good amount of velocity out of it. I've looked at various load data sources and they don't seem to add up! Viht N540 for example is listed at 3192fps on their website. Lee however states lower, much lower. H414 on the other hand is top of the Lee table and that info agrees with their website to the letter, which suggests that perhaps the Viht is real world testing and the Hodgdon figures have simply been copied? I'm running a 20" barrel on my Sako. Do any of you have any real world figures that you've found through testing your own loads with various powders? I'm currently running a load with H335 but it's not very fast and the V-Maxes are punching through like deer bullets. I need to speed them up a bit to get them fragmenting ideally and if I can avoid spending a few hundred quid on a load of powder I'll never use then that would be a real advantage! Varget is the obvious choice. It's what I ran my old 6.5 fox loads on but I don't have much left and don't suppose I'll get any more any time soon! Supply needs to be a consideration as I'll be getting through a fair bit of it soon! Any suggestions would be gratefully received! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kernel gadaffi Posted November 17, 2015 Report Share Posted November 17, 2015 I don't have any data for a bullet that weight, as l use 120-140 grainers, but there are plenty of powders out there, N140/160, H4350 or Reloader 19. Alan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2015 I did a huge amount of load development when I had my first Swede. I must have spent near on a grand on various consumables because I just couldn't settle on one load even if it was good! I ended up using Varget and 85gr Speer TNT for foxes, but Varget is now so hard to get that I don't want to rely on it. Unfortunately I think I binned my records when I sold the gun. I used RL19 behind 140gr Speers for a while - that was a very good combination. But I think the ones you've listed are a bit slow for a bullet this light. It's a bit out of the comfort zone of a Swede but I'm determined to find something that is accurate and fast. I'd like a European powder ideally too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 17, 2015 Report Share Posted November 17, 2015 I use to use 100grn v Max in my swede. Or was it a 95 grn! Been a while now. I used the 139 grn hornady too and used h4350 for the lot. Never checked velocity but the trajectory suggest top end I remember. Slightly compressed charges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2015 If Varget is so hard to get, why is it so hard to sell? I have 5lbs sat here that nobody seems to want. Because people want something that they can replace in six months time. All well and good having a tub now, but who wants to go through the whole development phase all over again when it's impossible to find later? Once bitten, twice shy... H4350... I've seen that mentioned elsewhere. I'll look up the data. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 17, 2015 Report Share Posted November 17, 2015 (edited) Fister makes good points but I preference 4350 where ever it can be used, even over 414. It is very forgiving. Edited November 17, 2015 by Underdog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2015 I'm lucky to live near to Dauntsey Guns, and they don't seem to shy away from carrying plenty of consumables. They're certainly at the better end of the scale. Many of the shops around here don't bother carrying any reloading kit, and very limited ammo. If there's no money in it who can blame them? H4350 does look good on the tables. My only concern would be that I'm trying to move over to European powder so Viht is closer to home. I'm not sure the supply will be any more reliable but it feels possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 17, 2015 Report Share Posted November 17, 2015 How many shots do you anticipate a year bud? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2015 300 maybe with that load? So a tub a year should cover it. Looking at the data more I'm going off of Viht. All their figures come from a 26.5" test barrel where as Hodgdon run a 24". Seems to me that Viht are trying to fudge their figures, and my rifle sure as hell won't come close with it's 20" barrel! I'm thinking of loading H335 for it short term. I've got two tubs of that here so it's worth trying it before I buy more. H4350 will only give me another 100fps and considering it's doing 2700 now and I can get near 3000 with what I have that extra 100 isn't worth fussing about really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 17, 2015 Report Share Posted November 17, 2015 In the 20" you may well be better off with a faster powder! I genuinely are surprised with 2700fps, I would be wanting 2900+ with 95 grn bullets! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2015 I've been looking at the data for 85gr and 100gr and trying to work out which one comes highest up the table for both. That seems to be H4350, but I'm having a tight moment and don't want to get my money out. After seven months of renovating my house I have very little money to get out even if I did want to! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
activeviii Posted November 17, 2015 Report Share Posted November 17, 2015 That's a shame, I just loaded the last of the 414 in Johns 243. Is does throw very nicely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 18, 2015 Report Share Posted November 18, 2015 In an old Speer manual of mine a 120grn bullet is up around 2800-2900 from a ruger 22" 77 test rifle. A range of powders are listed but not h335! From what I know of that manual I would easily get more! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 18, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2015 It's simply a matter of testing isn't it. I'll work up a load then chrono the one that works. Accuracy counts more than speed. 6.5x55 data is often ocan just pass it on tthe soft side to stay safe in the older rifles and I've not tried a max load yet that has given me pressure signs. It sounds like I may be trying 414. If that's what John's gun likes then at least buying a tub won't be a waste of time if it doesn't work for me. I can just pass it on to him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjimmer Posted November 18, 2015 Report Share Posted November 18, 2015 Because people want something that they can replace in six months time. How long would Fister's 5 tubs last you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjimmer Posted November 18, 2015 Report Share Posted November 18, 2015 Several people were talking about stuff from http://www.reload-swiss.com/en/reload_swiss/index.phpat Bisley on Sunday, Fultons stock it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 18, 2015 Report Share Posted November 18, 2015 Only tried 414 in 243 once and soon dropped it ! :-( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 18, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2015 How come you didn't like 414 fella? It looks ideal - fine grains to work well in a thrower are helpful for mass producing loads. I was only looking at the RS powders yesterday. I couldn't find any detailed loading data but anything is an option if I can source it and find enough info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 18, 2015 Report Share Posted November 18, 2015 In 243 it seemed peaky pressure wise cranking it up. Considering it was similar to 4350 I found it no where near as forgiving. Think you need mag primers for 414 too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markbjones01 Posted November 18, 2015 Report Share Posted November 18, 2015 I know its on the slower side but I use a fox load with 100 g bt with 47g vvn165 very accurate in my heym Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted November 18, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2015 Accuracy is pretty important. I'm finding my V-Max need to be driven a bit faster though. The exit on the foxes I've shot is fairly small and I'd like them to slop around a bit more when I pick them up. The more trauma there is, the quicker they die. Reading up on the 414 it seems that magnum primers can be used for lower charges. Keep them at the high end though and it should be ok as long as the cartridge has good neck tension or a crimp. I've bought a tub of it as I can't find 4350 anywhere and my mate uses it. If it doesn't work for me I'll pass it on. The pressure thing has been noted. I'll work them up carefully! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted November 18, 2015 Report Share Posted November 18, 2015 Keep us up to date. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted November 19, 2015 Report Share Posted November 19, 2015 (edited) Several people were talking about stuff from http://www.reload-swiss.com/en/reload_swiss/index.phpat Bisley on Sunday, Fultons stock it. I have looked at the Swiss Powders and they do seem very good, the reports are favourable. They supposedly "guarantee" continuity of supply which is good if its true. The only problem was price, while ITL is selling V140 for a £58 / kg I don't see a reason to switch Edited November 19, 2015 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjimmer Posted November 19, 2015 Report Share Posted November 19, 2015 I was told that people were buying the Swiss powder because Vita Vouri was not available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjimmer Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 (edited) You were probably tols that because the shop you were in didn't have any. Viht availability is perhaps THE most consistent. I hadn't been in the shop, somebody on the firing point told me. When I did go in the shop, they just gave me the catalogue to look at, no hard sell at all. Edited November 20, 2015 by rjimmer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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