12 gauge trigger setting franchi

[stut4]

morning all, 
i have 30-40 year old franchi. it was inherited from my grandfather. it sat unused in his cabinet for 10+ years prior to my ownership. i do  not know if it was cocked or not.
i have had to replace the cocking lever in the forend as that broke when i first dismantled it. that took 4-5 months to source the part.
the gun now cocks okay, but on my first usage, the triggers fire, but the pins do not penetrate the cartridges enough to trigger - they only leave a minor indentation on the cartridge.

i've removed the stock to check the action and have attached pictures.

my first thought before inspection was that the springs might not be strong enough to force the hammers if it was left cocked for 10+ years.
then after inspection, i'm wondering if the hammers are cocked far enough back. there are 2 locking points on the hammers - mine will only cock on the first indentation. should they cock on the second? (if so, i suspect my initial cocking lever fix hasn't worked...).
2 x slo-mo vids attached showing firing.videos are c.15-20 seconds into video.
i've asked a local gun smith for his advice, but know hes extremely busy so don't want to chase him.

thanks in advance.

 

IMG_4892.MOV

IMG_4895.MOV

[ditchman]

can you get the firing pins out...maybe a lot of gunk in there stopping the pin goiung fully forward............whatever the problem is it will be a small one as you have coil springs like the Baikal guns..............

[oldypigeonpopper]

hello, i would think it was cocked all that time unless it had snap caps in as i am sure your grandfather would not fired off without 

 10 years of non use could have made the springs to weaken over time, but i am no expert, the reason i post now as have just acquired a 1980s Valmet O/U and has had new pins fitted and serviced by the previous owner in their local RFD, worth a thought?

[figgy]

I think Ditchman is on the money with gunk in the pin holes. Put some solvent down the pins to soften it or see it will disolve and blast out after soaking for a while.

[stut4]

Gents, thank you for the replies. should the pin just lift out, if there is enough top access? i assume there will be a spring underneath?

i have a tin of Napier cleaner/lubricant. would that suffice or a pure solvent better?

thanks in advance.

[stut4]

just pushed the pins out which hold the firing pins in. think i'll need a pipecleaner. bit grubby down there, so i'll give it a good clean.

 

i managed to push the hammers back to the 2nd notch to get the pins out. it that 2nd notch just for that purpose to gain access to the pins? or should it be cocking to the furthest notch for normal use?

[figgy]

Would have thought the second notch is fully cocked the first half cocked, which is a safety sear in case the gun gets knocked when cocked the hammers cant fall on the pins and fire. The second sears catch the falling hammers.

Edited May 1, 2018 by figgy

[stut4]

Just now, figgy said:

Would have thought the second notch is fully cocked the first half cocked, which is a safety sear in case the gun gets knocked when cocked the hammers cant fall on the pins and fire.

thanks for the reply. 

in that case, i think my cocking lever repair is not pushing the hammers back far enough to fully cock then... might need to have another go at that...

[JJsDad]

4 hours ago, figgy said:

Would have thought the second notch is fully cocked the first half cocked, which is a safety sear in case the gun gets knocked when cocked the hammers cant fall on the pins and fire. The second sears catch the falling hammers.

Figgy has got it in one. In the video its firing off the safety sear bent rather than the main bent & thus has insufficient force of blow.

Edited May 1, 2018 by JJsDad

[stut4]

thank you gents. that explains it completely. i'll have to have another look at the cocking lever then, and see if i can adjust it. like a d**k, i araldited the replacement cocking lever into the forend, as i had to machine another franchi one to fit into the foreend. its just a fraction of a millimetre i need so will need to have a tinker later.

 

thank you all once again for this invaluable advice.

[stut4]

Chaps, once again thank you for your help on this.

i pulled the pins out and gave them and the holes a good clean. Lots of filth, so they now pop in and out sweetly.

@figgy and @JJsDad hit the nail on the head. The hammers wouldn’t cock back far enough with my fore end cocking lever repair, so I had to push it out around 1/4” further into the action direction, fill the gap with some more Araldite and now it functions nicely. Breaks better than before, ejects better and the hammers go fully back. Just need to get to my local ground to test fire it. Hopefully the increased travel of the hammers will increase the force on the pins and fire some lead!

thank you once again. My first forum post and well chuffed with the helpful replies. ?

Ps. The mentioned repair i did involved taking a cocking lever from another franchi. I machined it to get the correct profile to my broken one,  but it must have for some reason been slightly shorter so it wouldn’t cock properly. Unfortunately when I took the gun from grandad it was already broken so I never got the chance to see and feel it working properly, and it was the first time I’ve removed the stock so didn’t know how far it needed to go to fully cock it.

thanks again.

[figgy]

Hope it all works and you enjoy using it for many years.

[oldypigeonpopper]

hello, let us know how you get on with sorting out your franchi, not sure on age of my Valmet what is the seriel number on yours?  here are the numbers on mine 4057510

Edited May 2, 2018 by oldypigeonpopper

[stut4]

47 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

hello, let us know how you get on with sorting out your franchi, not sure on age of my Valmet what is the seriel number on yours?  here are the numbers on mine 4057510

hopefully i'll get up to my clay ground on Saturday to give it a trial. i've had it since November and its taken this long to source a replacement cocking lever (last month) and then it wouldn't cock fully, so i've been itching to give it a proper go. i've tried it c.15 times with snap caps and seems to work nicely, so fingers crossed i'll hit some clays on saturday. i've been desperate to get it fixed as i've been using various club guns each time i go, so i'm keen to get one i can use all the time rather than hoping between guns every couple of weeks. i even resorted to using a .410 i have for my son to use last time i was up there and the Franchi didn't work.

i also inherited a Parker Hale side by side, and a Midland Hammer Gun which dates from 1887-1896. The SxS works fine, but i've yet to locate a handful of Black Powder cartridges as its not nitro proofed, and a field to try the hammer gun as i don't think my local clay ground will be keen on it being used.

my Franchi number is 4075041. when i spoke with Franchi, when i was trying to source the parts needed, they were unfortunately not helpful. they could only say that mine was manufactured pre 1984 which means they have no record of it, so i could only guess what model it is. i think its a Alcione 12g based on visual pics from the web and diagrams from Numrich. the only markings are S.P.A Franchi Brescia  2 3/4". 

i'll let you know how it fires on Saturday.

[oldypigeonpopper]

15 minutes ago, stut4 said:

hopefully i'll get up to my clay ground on Saturday to give it a trial. i've had it since November and its taken this long to source a replacement cocking lever (last month) and then it wouldn't cock fully, so i've been itching to give it a proper go. i've tried it c.15 times with snap caps and seems to work nicely, so fingers crossed i'll hit some clays on saturday. i've been desperate to get it fixed as i've been using various club guns each time i go, so i'm keen to get one i can use all the time rather than hoping between guns every couple of weeks. i even resorted to using a .410 i have for my son to use last time i was up there and the Franchi didn't work.

i also inherited a Parker Hale side by side, and a Midland Hammer Gun which dates from 1887-1896. The SxS works fine, but i've yet to locate a handful of Black Powder cartridges as its not nitro proofed, and a field to try the hammer gun as i don't think my local clay ground will be keen on it being used.

my Franchi number is 4075041. when i spoke with Franchi, when i was trying to source the parts needed, they were unfortunately not helpful. they could only say that mine was manufactured pre 1984 which means they have no record of it, so i could only guess what model it is. i think its a Alcione 12g based on visual pics from the web and diagrams from Numrich. the only markings are S.P.A Franchi Brescia  2 3/4". 

i'll let you know how it fires on Saturday.

hello, looking by your franchi number mine maybe older but it has the same markings, where do you shoot clays, do you shop at wiltshire rod and guns, was in there last week, cheers 

[stut4]

21 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

hello, looking by your franchi number mine maybe older but it has the same markings, where do you shoot clays, do you shop at wiltshire rod and guns, was in there last week, cheers 

yep, think yours is a bit older. 

i go to Barbury, near Chisledon. i became a member last year when i got my licence, as it was helpful to have a few lessons and to use their club gun whilst i was waiting. once i've got the Franchi working reliably i'd like to do a bit of pidgeon/crow work. 

i've used Wilts Rod & Gun a bit. i got my .410 from there which my son uses as he needed something light to start with, and also get his cartridges from there. i ended up getting a load of 12g cartridges from my grandad and have also stocked up from my last trip to the Sportsmanguncentre in Newport.

see you're fairly close to me. where do you shoot?

[oldypigeonpopper]

40 minutes ago, stut4 said:

yep, think yours is a bit older. 

i go to Barbury, near Chisledon. i became a member last year when i got my licence, as it was helpful to have a few lessons and to use their club gun whilst i was waiting. once i've got the Franchi working reliably i'd like to do a bit of pidgeon/crow work. 

i've used Wilts Rod & Gun a bit. i got my .410 from there which my son uses as he needed something light to start with, and also get his cartridges from there. i ended up getting a load of 12g cartridges from my grandad and have also stocked up from my last trip to the Sportsmanguncentre in Newport.

see you're fairly close to me. where do you shoot?

hello, ok i think that is where you can try out a gun from WRG, last time i went there was with a new PW member he bought a nice 410 off tony, well the ladies as he was out, a nice deal and i only bought some subs and a few 410s, i just do some rat shooting and a few days a year with shotgun on my friends farm, another small farm for rabbits but like so many on here say there are very few about, for me it is more about getting out to the countryside now being a towny,  not shot clays since the 1980s, i do a couple of days trout fishing a week maybe same shooting, been helping another PW member on decoying this last 2 years. in fact i seem to have to many guns for my shooting so am selling off 2. will just have the franchi and an old single 12, trouting today if weather improves,    

Edited May 2, 2018 by oldypigeonpopper

[stut4]

i'm quite new to the shooting sports, although my extended family have been doing it for generations. i work in an office so love getting out into the country when time allows. my father in law is a keen fisherman too - he does trout in the kennet near where we live. i'd like to get into shooting pigeons with the shotgun. at the moment, i only take pigeons in my garden with an airrifle - they decimate the wifes veggie patch so its a good excuse to keep the numbers down. its also convenient that they taste good too .

enjoy your fishing today!