Copper coated shot

[rbrowning2]

3 hours ago, wymberley said:

If your "done" is 'don't', I'm with you. A sharp bright knife will cut better than a dull blunt one. I would imagine that the operative word is, "kills" and that if two equally sized  pellets having the same velocity and sectional density, then the bright shiney and smoother one is going to slice through fur/feather and flesh more easliy than the other. To what degree though I know not especially if you were comparing a copper coated one with, say, a Diamond shot quality alternative. Comparing the ranges in question would also be problematic as I guess they would be critical.

The colour of a knife blade has nothing to do with its ability to cut, you can get black carbide knifes which by your logic should not be able to cut.  Also the ability of a knife to cut is down the geometry of the blade edge, we have no such edge with a round pellet.

if the copper coating does facilitate the leads pellets ability to penetrate through fur/feather and flesh more easily would it not be possible to prove this by shooting at say bundles of wet news paper and measuring the pellets penetration depth.

 

 

[swan40]

As somebody who has reloaded small gauges for more than a year or two,  and counted more than my share of holes in big sheets of paper I have decided I don't want to know if copper or nickel  pattern better or worse . I don't know the velocity of the cartridge I am using or how many sheets of wet telephone directory it  penetrates  - however- they just work .

I have resisted taking them to the pattern plate because as long as they are effective  why would  I . The only outcome of knowing exactly all the statistics would make me question how good they are and until they stop doing what I want them to do I will leave well alone, which is something I have had great difficulty doing in the past.

It is not in my nature to be in the dark of these things but for now I will resist ( even though I really want to know ) .

I have just enough 12 bore game cartridges left to last me next year , but then I will have to decide what to do as my preferred choice (which was a special order) is no longer made,  30 gram nickel 2.7mm fibre wad  in a pretty case which defiantly makes all the difference.

My main point  is if you are sure it works it probably will -and most of the time it dose for me.

Edited December 22, 2019 by swan40

[wymberley]

3 hours ago, rbrowning2 said:

The colour of a knife blade has nothing to do with its ability to cut, you can get black carbide knifes which by your logic should not be able to cut.  Also the ability of a knife to cut is down the geometry of the blade edge, we have no such edge with a round pellet.

if the copper coating does facilitate the leads pellets ability to penetrate through fur/feather and flesh more easily would it not be possible to prove this by shooting at say bundles of wet news paper and measuring the pellets penetration depth.

 

 

Interesting!

I wasn't aware that "dull" and "bright" were colours - yep, agree black is but I didn't mention it. The action of cutting is not simply down to the geometry of the blade edge - when correct this is often termed as the implement being 'sharp', but also includes the resistance of the material behind that edge - bright/smooth is better than dull/manky (to use  the non-scientific term). I think 'ballistic gelatin' is the favoured choice for your experiment.

[welshwarrior]

11 hours ago, wymberley said:

If your "done" is 'don't', I'm with you. A sharp bright knife will cut better than a dull blunt one. I would imagine that the operative word is, "kills" and that if two equally sized  pellets having the same velocity and sectional density, then the bright shiney and smoother one is going to slice through fur/feather and flesh more easliy than the other. To what degree though I know not especially if you were comparing a copper coated one with, say, a Diamond shot quality alternative. Comparing the ranges in question would also be problematic as I guess they would be critical.

Yes auto correct changed it to done not don’t.  
 

funnily enough the comparison shot was diamond shot. 

[rbrowning2]

13 hours ago, wymberley said:

I think 'ballistic gelatin' is the favoured choice for your experiment.

'Problem with ballistic gelatin, as far as I know is it is expensive and not easy to source in the uk.

With the exception of diamond shot most normal shot is polished and coated in graphite, which is an excellent dry lubricant and as such has many uses in industry so still unconvinced that the copper shot has any scientific proven advantage.

Confidence in what you use i guess is the name of the game.

[lancer425]

Copper platting can be just a copper wash like the old winchester super double x lead goose loads, or a fe microns thick as in the steel coated in copper alleged to help with corrosion.

Much of the time in lead its marketing , they use it unbuffered and if it improves patterns or not  is a moot point.

Winchester in the old loads did all the right things to make it work, buffer proper wading and the copper wash did help with the soft low antamony lead they used, real performers the old winchesters back then.

  The hard nickel plated lead Ian Charlton ( old C&G) used to import was good it was hard and if you buffered it loaded it right it did show an increase in % no doubt about this.  The copper platted on its own any improvement in % is minimal.

Lead works we all know that but it has to be buffered and good wadding to help it so as to make any significant difference in %.

 Ditto Bismuth though harder its structure if lower in tin dictates you must help it again with buffer and good wading.

Now pure copper is a totaly different animal, you can treat it like steel, but as its denser it creates less pressure yet its hard enough not to deform yet it wont scratch barrels, load it in felt do what you want with it its that hard, and at higher velocity it holds patterns where similar speed steel looses %.

Remember copper is toxic to use it for asthetics alone is not a good idea at all, and in plated lead or steel i see no advantage, the copper plated steel to avoid any pin holing in wad bore contact has some merit i supose, but quite how you would ever know if it works or not i have no idea.

Pure copper as a non lead shot type is good its not cheap though , and you might be better spending your money elsewhere when investing in performance.

We do not shoot non tox here on waterfowl we are NON LEAD.

Copper is legal.