Blackbart Posted August 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 Sorry I must disagree, ricochets are mathematically predictable, granted, not in any practical application when we're talking about the round striking and reflecting against a pebble in the grass or hard soil mounds, etc.Depending on the angle of impact, using said grass mound for example, the ricochet could end up anywhere in a 3-D/360 degree angle, like a game of extremely high speed Pool. Ranging from curving left/right/upwards or returning in the direction of the shooter, and so on. Such a mound in the backstop would be invisible head-on from the shooter's eye, so the use of a suitable backstop isn't really in question, as if the round was indeed heading in your direction on its initial flight, you wouldn't have heard it coming I'm not trying to pick apart your post, but were you actually in the campsite? In this post it gives the impression that you only heard the ricochet, and as already said maybe the wind carried the sound over your head? - Maybe it's just a spelling error, sorry. Other then that though I think you handled the situation well, in regards to having a quiet word and not raising alarm as it could possibly be a worry over nothing. One last point, you say that this campsite is a very obvious site.. to the campers. As you say; it was around 11pm maybe the shooter didn't see the tents/vehicles etc if he came in the dark. Still, in the end it all depends how far he was shooting away from you. As i said shuck i was in the camp site right next to my tent..My tent was in the bottom corner of the site and 10-15 feet from my tent was a strip of grass for dog walking,next to that was a field that had been harvested that day.I dont understand what you mean by "you only heard the ricochet".....as opposed to what ? The shooter was not very far away as i said and while your technical definition of a ricochet is admirable i was basing my theory on actual shooting experience of shooting a .22 on a field,and personally to me if you know your round has a good chance of bouncing,would you use it next to a field full of hundreds of people You say the lampers might not have noticed the site..Put it this way,if you cant see a dozen or so lamp posts(lit) and some buildings with lights on in the NEXT field to where you are lamping what chance have yo got of seeing rabbits eyes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 "You say the lampers might not have noticed the site..Put it this way,if you cant see a dozen or so lamp posts(lit) and some buildings with lights on in the NEXT field to where you are lamping what chance have yo got of seeing rabbits eyes laugh.gif laugh.gif " Lol that is true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shuck. Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 You say the lampers might not have noticed the site..Put it this way,if you cant see a dozen or so lamp posts(lit) and some buildings with lights on in the NEXT field to where you are lamping what chance have yo got of seeing rabbits eyes Right, after much deliberation I've come to the next theory; is it possible he thought it was a nest of giant rabbits? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shuck. Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 I dont understand what you mean by "you only heard the ricochet".....as opposed to what ? Sorry, I meant the phenomenon of a sound wave traveling through an open area, for example if your friend fired a weapon, say 50 yards from you, the sound of the shot, let's say the ultrasonic crack in this instance, may echo depending on the geological angles of the terrain in combination with the open field and seem like the crack of the round is actually moving. This, with the ultrasound crack replaced with a ricochet whizz in conjunction with your situation, may sound like the reflected round was actually traveling in your direction, even over you.. However, disregard this theory completely if you actually heard the round land then you can call me up on my ******** Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackbart Posted August 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 I know where you are coming from shuck and to be honest i can not say for certain the round came over me because i didnt "see" it and i was too busy swearing to hear it land .I am basing it on the sound of the bullet zinging starting off quiet then getting loud then getting quiet(if that makes sense )A bit like standing on the side of the road as a car comes past.I am aware of sound travelling as i have fired an unmoderated 22-250 in the dead of night and it sounds likethe gates of hell opening and goes on for ever.But this was a still night with next to no wind so i dont think the wind would have blew he sound my way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shuck. Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 I have drawn you a rather ****** scientific diagram to get my point across.. I understand you heard the round as if it actually came past you, this could still be plausible even with no wind if: M=Sound wave reflecting material S=Shooter \-Initial ballistic trajectory R=Ballistic reflecting material )=Ricochet trajectory (from ballistic reflecting material) >=Ricochet sound waves =You Ricochet sound wave key: a primitive diagram of wavelength in motion (Top arrow start of Crest in sinewave[approach], middle arrow [flying over], bottom arrow trough[leaving]) This shows the sound wave start and end frequency in effect replicating the sound of the ricochet above your head. M.................................................. M......>..........>.............>........ . M...).....>.....>.....>......>... .>........ M......)......>..............>............>.... M.........R....................................... M..........\....................................... M...........\...................................... M............\..................................... M.............\.................................... M..............S.................................. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heladoxa Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 Shuck Lovely diagram! Is that Metric or Imperial? Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cushat Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 Sorry, I meant the phenomenon of a sound wave traveling through an open area, for example if your friend fired a weapon, say 50 yards from you, the sound of the shot, let's say the ultrasonic crack in this instance, may echo depending on the geological angles of the terrain in combination with the open field and seem like the crack of the round is actually moving. This, with the ultrasound crack replaced with a ricochet whizz in conjunction with your situation, may sound like the reflected round was actually traveling in your direction, even over you.. However, disregard this theory completely if you actually heard the round land then you can call me up on my ******** I have drawn you a rather ****** scientific diagram to get my point across.. I understand you heard the round as if it actually came past you, this could still be plausible even with no wind if: M=Sound wave reflecting material S=Shooter \-Initial ballistic trajectory R=Ballistic reflecting material )=Ricochet trajectory (from ballistic reflecting material) >=Ricochet sound waves =You Ricochet sound wave key: a primitive diagram of wavelength in motion (Top arrow start of Crest in sinewave[approach], middle arrow [flying over], bottom arrow trough[leaving]) This shows the sound wave start and end frequency in effect replicating the sound of the ricochet above your head. M.................................................. M......>..........>.............>........ . M...).....>.....>.....>......>... .>........ M......)......>..............>............>.... M.........R....................................... M..........\....................................... M...........\...................................... M............\..................................... M.............\.................................... M..............S.................................. What on earth are you going on about?? What's an ultrasound crack? Sounds like something related to pregnancy to me The rounds would have more than likely been subsonic anyway so no ultrasound/ultrasonic/ultraviolet/ultravox involved. Been shooting rifles long, have you?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackbart Posted August 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 I have drawn you a rather ****** scientific diagram to get my point across.. I understand you heard the round as if it actually came past you, this could still be plausible even with no wind if: M=Sound wave reflecting material S=Shooter \-Initial ballistic trajectory R=Ballistic reflecting material )=Ricochet trajectory (from ballistic reflecting material) >=Ricochet sound waves =You Ricochet sound wave key: a primitive diagram of wavelength in motion (Top arrow start of Crest in sinewave[approach], middle arrow [flying over], bottom arrow trough[leaving]) This shows the sound wave start and end frequency in effect replicating the sound of the ricochet above your head. M.................................................. M......>..........>.............>........ . M...).....>.....>.....>......>... .>........ M......)......>..............>............>.... M.........R....................................... M..........\....................................... M...........\...................................... M............\..................................... M.............\.................................... M..............S.................................. Shuck...you really need to get out more! I do not know what wall of "sound wave reflecting material" could be in a flat stubble field and i know sound bounces off things like woods,hills,buildings etc etc as i have shot more rounds at night than i have during the day.But i dont think in this situation there was any sound bounce/echo. I will try and put a pic up for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyCM Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 Where can I get some of this Sound wave reflecting material... I want to put some in my moderator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shuck. Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 Nope I just made it up to see how many people I'd catch out For the record, though when I said 'ultrasound/ultrasonic crack' I used it as an example to it wasn't really linked at all to my theory, I'm thinking I should've left that out .. might have you going longer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shuck. Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 I will try and put a pic up for you. Can you draw it please Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 Been shooting rifles long, have you?? my guess is never fired a .22lr, the rounds will bounce off dry ground they don't even need to hit a stone, as Blackbart said if you've used one much you will know that the vast majority of rounds head off in the direction you're shooting in. This is all pretty irrelevant but I'd have been upset in the circumstances as I'm sure most people would be, even the most avid shooter I've known has never tollerated being shot at Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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