What can we do for shooting sports .

[Harnser]

As most of you know I am one of the more senior members of this forum . I have seen lots and lots of legislation reff guns and gun ownership over the past 50 years of shooting , absolutely none of it has been to the shooters advantage . All ways an erosion of the right of honest people to own and shoot guns .

You used to be able to buy a shootgun licence at the post office, for if I can remember 10 bob (50p) you would then be able to order a shotgun from one of the many home shopping catalouges and pay 10 bob a week until you had paid for it . Those days are long gone .

I have seen draconian legislation brought in to stop people shooting and to stop honest people owning guns . I dont think that it will stop untill all guns are banned all together . I am convinced that there is a hidden agenda by government to restrict the number of centre fire rifles issued in this country and it will carry on untill they have compleatly outlawed rifles .

So the bottom line ,what can we as shooters do to help to protect our shooting sports . Firstly I think that every body who owns a gun should belong to a shooting club and support it , be it a clay club ,airgun target club ,or a centre fire or smallbore target club . We all should promote shooting sports by introducing at least one other person to a shooting sport . We should all belong without exception to a recognised shooting association that will help to look after our shooting sports and voice our opinion to government .

Its no good sitting on our backsides and hoping legislation will go away , I can assure you that it wont . So get off your bums if you dont belong to a club and put your hand in your pocket if you dont belong to a shooting organisation .

Harnser .

[Guest]

Yes Harnser. Well done for you. I agree there is a hidden agenda to ban weapons from law abiding citizens in order to institute an even harsher "nannny state". I have tried and maanged to introduce severeal friends into shoting clays for a start and now a best friend of mine has just got his first ever shotgun licence and I have convinced my sister's boyfriend to apply for a shotgun licence as well.

[Imperfection]

To be honest-the only thing anyone could do to protect their intrest in shooting is move to another country.If this or any future goverment wanted to ban centrefire rifles-there isnt an organisation going which could prevent it.The goverment effectivley do whatever they want and if people stamp their feet-so what cos it makes no difference to them.

[Guest]

That is an incorect option IMperfection. All countries are trying to bann lawful abiding citizens from having any kind of weaponsry in their posession, Britain is still one of the lucky countries where you can own firearms, Go to China and try to start up a shooting club and see the response you get from the authorities.

[LostWomble]

I agree, everyone should be a member of a local club (lest they disappear forever) and a national body too. Sportsmans Aassociation, NRA at Bisley, CPSA or even BASC are all worth our support.

 

Also, get as many people as you can to try a shooting discipline to help remove their misconceptions. I took 40 colleagues from work to Bisley for a corporate day and everyone had a fantastic time, most of them never held a gun before. They also have an open days twice a year where you can take friends along to have a go at various disciplines.

 

If we don't support our sport no one else will.

[Imperfection]

That is an incorect option IMperfection. All countries are trying to bann lawful abiding citizens from having any kind of weaponsry in their posession, Britain is still one of the lucky countries where you can own firearms, Go to China and try to start up a shooting club and see the response you get from the authorities.

 

I think you'd be lucky to start up a cycling club in China without the authorities closing it down for being an aggresive stance against the state!

 

But seriously,i achknowledge that here in the UK we can own them,but looks at how hard they are to come by and the types.Hungerford and Dunblaine were absoloutely terrible,but they were isolated incidents caused by two people who should not have been granted licences to start with yet every single legitemate owner afterwards was forced to get rid of their chosen guns.I cant rememeber that far back now,but im guessing that BASC,NRA etc put forward their case on both these occasions,but was it listened to?

 

Like i said-im sceptical about any political party because they can do whatever they want.

[Guest]

Yeah well I sent a letter to my local MP asking them to ensure that shooting sports are supported and no other draconian legislation is planned to limit the ability of lawful peple engaging in a hobby of target shooting or in hunting. Since he is an honorary member of Dover Rifle club he said that he has always supported shooting, so saved his email in case he goes back on his word so then I can show what a hypocryte he has been.

[Ozzy Fudd]

im not a member of a gun club (yet), but am a basc member, and have introduced at least 6 others to the sport, one who now has his own shotgun and .22lr, and another two who are currently applying for shotguns.

 

i think the only way to save it is to make sure the big organisations are working together (and not bickering amongst themselves as it seems they do alot). in a perfect world we would only need one shooting organisation covering everything from clays to deer stalking to rough shooting, but as i cant see that happening they should at least be working closely together

[huntercarbine]

if you go on "micks guns" there is a list of countries who banned citizens from gun ownership, then within a few years carried out attrocities against the "un-armed"public. the nazis and ethnic cleansing of the jewish is just one example. the facts and figures are all there have a look. a bit extreme i know, but food for thought?

[Guest]

I would recommend everyone watch the Series Innocents betrayed: gun control

 

Part1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwdO2FLg1Rs

 

Part2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaAr_1ugxu8...feature=related

 

Part 3

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Uf8NTQ9p1c...feature=related

 

Part 4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YoQLXwiNJg...feature=related

 

Part 5

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmVg6IVvffE...feature=related

 

Part 6

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WhStVKme4E...feature=related

[Guest]

Also:

[the last engineer]

you can only do your best to promote and educate the masses to the enjoyment and obvious safe sport we choose as our recreation.

here i belong to the Alberta Sporting Clays Assosiation, have done for many years now.

We are a non profit organization that promotes the sport to as many as possible through all channels.

Our proceeds go back into the sport.

we now have the ability to offer free shooting to the juniors and ladies.

All targets thrown are at club cost and are refunded by the association.

It is a great way to introduce new people as money is an issue with many lately.

A number of us are going to the nationals in Montreal in September; again the association has stepped in and granted a $500. Refund to all attending on flight costs.

Each little helping hand seems to plant seeds of hope in our sport as its growing popularity shows.

this wont work without cooperation, its a must from all clubs around this Province, and all the shooters they represent.

our web site is one we are proud of really, it show the commitment from the directors to make things work regardless of social or political interuption.

 

http://www.asca.ab.ca/

 

you have to give it your all, and not quit.

it takes dedication from many people, its very easy to talk about it and do nothing,,,,,,,,,,, its to late to talk about it when its gone right.

Martin.

[Guest]

Good job the last engineer! I hope your organisation grows and becomes more popular.

[the last engineer]

it has buddy, but not without casualties i can asure you, there are always hurdles and headaches to deal with.

as the old saying goes "united we stand, divided we fall.

some one put a quote earlier before it was deemed derailed (cant think why as it was good harmless fun)

 

"First they came for the pistols, and I didn’t speak up, because I wasn’t a pistol-shooter. Then they came for the airguns, and I didn’t speak up, because I wasn’t an airgunner. Then they came for the rifles, and I didn’t speak up, because I wasn't a rifle-shooter. Then they came for me, and by that time there was no one left to speak up for me."

 

how true these words are.

 

Martin.

[Harnser]

you can only do your best to promote and educate the masses to the enjoyment and obvious safe sport we choose as our recreation.

here i belong to the Alberta Sporting Clays Assosiation, have done for many years now.

We are a non profit organization that promotes the sport to as many as possible through all channels.

Our proceeds go back into the sport.

we now have the ability to offer free shooting to the juniors and ladies.

All targets thrown are at club cost and are refunded by the association.

It is a great way to introduce new people as money is an issue with many lately.

A number of us are going to the nationals in Montreal in September; again the association has stepped in and granted a $500. Refund to all attending on flight costs.

Each little helping hand seems to plant seeds of hope in our sport as its growing popularity shows.

this wont work without cooperation, its a must from all clubs around this Province, and all the shooters they represent.

our web site is one we are proud of really, it show the commitment from the directors to make things work regardless of social or political interuption.

 

http://www.asca.ab.ca/

 

you have to give it your all, and not quit.

it takes dedication from many people, its very easy to talk about it and do nothing,,,,,,,,,,, its to late to talk about it when its gone right.

Martin.

There you go everybody . The canadians are proactive in protecting their sport . We should be as well .

Harnser .

[LostWomble]

Maybe organisations like BASC should spend less time and money preaching to the converted and more on lobbying politicians to get them on-side.

[David BASC]

Hmmm, and what makes you think that all BASC does is preach to the converted?

 

I take it you think that BASC does not do any political lobbying, or media monitoring and lobbying, and that no one at BASC meets regularly with the head of ACPO, nor speak on a regular basis with the firearms enquiry officers around the UK, and that BASC do not sit on the party group of Shooting & Conservation, and that BASC have not responded to loads of shooting related consultations in the past 12 months...hmm, must get onto it straight away, glad you reminded me!

 

All joking apart, you are quite right. Two years ago BASC conducted a survey of its members to ask what areas of the Association’s work the membership thought was most important. Overwhelmingly and not surprisingly the response was that the protection and promotion of shooting and its conservation benefits is the single most important part of the Association’s work.

 

We do not have to convince the million or so people regularly engaged in shooting, that shooting in all its forms is safe, enjoyable and well run and that shooting contributes enormously to conservation and bio -diversity.

 

The future of the sport will depend on those who do not shoot and know little about it. They are the people that can sway political opinion; the antis know this and use this. Therefore it is imperative that BASC can keep ahead of our opponents and radically improve our ability to communicate with key politicians, opinion formers and the wider public.

 

But BASC is not alone, all the orgnaisations/ associations have a part to play, so yes if you shoot join a shooting orgnisation and do your bit.

 

And by the way, lets not argue about which one to join, join the one that fits you best, and be happy in your chioce as we all should be.

 

David

[Breastman]

I wish all of the separate shooting organisations could be merged under one single banner, it would give shooting a MUCH bigger voice and it would get rid of all the “it’s not my type of shooting so I’m not bothered about <insert flavour of the month> being banned” b0ll0x. Can you imagine the power an organisation that could boast it represented 1 million people would have over politicians?! They simply couldn't afford to ignore us

 

Mark

 

P.S. Can we not get 'shooting' registered as a religion?? I'm sure we'd get all the protection we needed then!

[Harnser]

I wish all of the separate shooting organisations could be merged under one single banner, it would give shooting a MUCH bigger voice and it would get rid of all the “it’s not my type of shooting so I’m not bothered about <insert flavour of the month> being banned” b0ll0x. Can you imagine the power an organisation that could boast it represented 1 million people would have over politicians?! They simply couldn't afford to ignore us

 

Mark

 

P.S. Can we not get 'shooting' registered as a religion?? I'm sure we'd get all the protection we needed then!

The American NRA has such a huge lobby that the policitians are afraid to take them on . Thanks to some of the high profile members , The late great charlton Heston but to name just one .

Harnser .

[David BASC]

A couple of points if I may,

 

Firstly if there were just one super merged shooting organisation there would be splinter groups within months, look at all the shooting organisations that have sprung up over the last say 20 years or so. I think at the last count there are over 40 shooting organisations in the UK. Getting them all to merge will be like herding cats!

 

Even the three target organisations, NRA, NSRA and CPSA could not agree a merger, and they are all within spitting distance of each other at Bisley!

 

Having said all that, the shooting organisations do come together under the umbrella of the British Shooting Sports Council.

 

Secondly, I think the American Constitution gives them a right to bear arms – we have no such right. We also have a very different culture when it comes to shooting than the USA or even most of Europe for that matter!

 

David

[Guest]

"Secondly, I think the American Constitution gives them a right to bear arms – we have no such right. We also have a very different culture when it comes to shooting than the USA or even most of Europe for that matter!"

 

HI David can I just say, you said that the American Constitution gives american the right to bear arms and the right of the people shall nto be infringed. however doesn't the Bill of Rights 1689 technically give at least English peopel the right to bear arms also for self defense and as far as I know this legislation hasn't been repealed.

[Breastman]

Even the three target organisations, NRA, NSRA and CPSA could not agree a merger, and they are all within spitting distance of each other at Bisley!

 

David

 

And this is why when the next 'incident' takes place we're going to get our pants pulled down again

 

I don't know the exact reasoning behind the inability to merge but i hope its not down to petty individuals protecting their jobs to the detriment of the sport as a whole.

 

Mark

[LostWomble]

Hmmm, and what makes you think that all BASC does is preach to the converted?

 

I know BASC do alot for shooting in general but I feel they need a louder bark and this can be acheived by getting the right names on board. Not necesserily the MPs, Lords and niche celebs they recruit but mainstream opinion makers who can turn the general public opinion in our favour.

 

All that money spent on the media centre could be used more wisely on direct media promotion. It's not like there are no studios out there they can use (probably and a greatly reduced cost from a member). If the TV or magazine has an anti editor and the general media is not going to run your story just because you made it in your own studio. Anything else is preaching to the converted.

 

I have spoken to some excellent and knowledgable people at BASC but I feel the leadership is stale. I resigned this year after being greatly let down by them...(pah! That's another thread)

 

Whatever my opinions, the general shooting community should support BASC as it is probably the loudest voice we have in the UK, it just needs to be louder.

[Guest]

What I don't understand is when BASC has such honorary members such as the Queen's husband, the duke of Edinborough how do we have such a weak voice in this country? I understand if we were a small organisation with no vocal support, but to have members of the ruling royal family as members and for the government to still be allowed to restrict our sport and our hunting is beyond me.

[LostWomble]

What I don't understand is when BASC has such honorary members such as the Queen's husband, the duke of Edinborough how do we have such a weak voice in this country? I understand if we were a small organisation with no vocal support, but to have members of the ruling royal family as members and for the government to still be allowed to restrict our sport and our hunting is beyond me.

 

 

I think you have summed it up. It may be thought that the leadership is looking after its own best interest while paying lip service to the rest of the members. Ultimately all they need are s/s and o/u shotguns for gamebirds and bolt action rifle for stalking.

 

I would never suggest such an idea though.