scarecrow243 Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 a manual is mutch better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 you'll be on first name terms with your local petrol station in no time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webber Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Let me know when you want it converting to LPG webber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scarecrow243 Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 i am already with haveing the cherokee 4 litre auto, they aint that bad if you dont have a lead right foot,plus its comfy and has two sunroofs back one for shooting out off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scarecrow243 Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Hi Webber i dont have the cash for that thanks for the offer, dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryantidgwell Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 sorry to off thread but what is the cost for lpg fitted on a 1.8 freelander 02 plate ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 not worth doing IMHO £1500 for the kit so you'd need to do some serious miles to pay for it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryantidgwell Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 yea i no what your saying do a fair bit of miles and get a measley 20 mpg if i am lucky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 LPG gives worse economy so your payback time will be longer at a guess you'd need to drive 15,000 miles to make back the cost of the system and thats assuming you run on LPG all the time. In practice you don't simply due to having to start them on petrol and also filling stations not being everywhere. so call it 20K miles before you save anything after that you'll save approx 40% the cost of the fuel, that means you have to keep the vehicle a long time to make savings. We run a few wish we didn't as they're not reliable and these are factory converted. LPG hasn't taken off and no manufacturers offer it any more and that says most of it. Were it not for the Congestion charge we would get rid of our vans tomorrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delbert Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Ah another Solihull Victim enjoy! ( I've been clean for 16mths) if you need a copy of RAVE* PM me and I'll root out the URL for the CD image. Derek *RAVE the Landrover workshop manual Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scarecrow243 Posted November 20, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 (edited) Hi Delbert i have found the full disco manual thanks Edited November 20, 2009 by scarecrow243 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delbert Posted November 22, 2009 Report Share Posted November 22, 2009 good one if you can, get a copy of microcat thats the parts disk not that its needed for it's original purpose(dealers know what the bits are) but the exploded diagrams are far superior and make assembling stuff like hubs a lot easier specially if you knocked the parts box and mixed up shims washers etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McF Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 al4x, your talking rubbish mate, i had mine converted at Webbers place 15 months ago and its now paid its self, as for putting petrol in, i may put some in to start the engine every 6 weeks. What i can tell you is when ever you go to fill up with LPG you end up walking away with a smile on your face after youve paid for it, as LPG is half the price of petrol in most garages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackbart Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 al4x, your talking rubbish mate, i had mine converted at Webbers place 15 months ago and its now paid its self, as for putting petrol in, i may put some in to start the engine every 6 weeks. What i can tell you is when ever you go to fill up with LPG you end up walking away with a smile on your face after youve paid for it, as LPG is half the price of petrol in most garages. But when you say "most garages"what you should say is if you can find a garage that sells LPG ! I toyed with the idea but a 28 mile round trip to fill up sort of put me off the idea cos i know i would just stick petrol in because it was closer and less hassle and i dont know all the ins and outs but are the tanks very small ?as one of the lads that worked for me had to fill up twice a day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 al4x, your talking rubbish mate, i had mine converted at Webbers place 15 months ago and its now paid its self, as for putting petrol in, i may put some in to start the engine every 6 weeks. What i can tell you is when ever you go to fill up with LPG you end up walking away with a smile on your face after youve paid for it, as LPG is half the price of petrol in most garages. paid for itself in 15 months so in that time your capital has been tied up in the conversion over the next 15 months in that case you'll save the cost of the conversion but that means you have to keep the truck that long to see the benefits and also you have the increased engine wear that goes with LPG. You'll have knackered valve stem seals within 50K on LPG, the ignition components take a hammering from it. I am on about my 10th LPG vehicle and were it not for the fact they go in the congestion charge zone daily I wouldn't have them. All have been factory converted and over the whole life it would be cheaper to have run diesel vehicles and we're high mileage users. Looks cheap on the weekly fill up but if thats as far as you look then thats usually the cheap part of running a vehicle. I know you have a vested interest in LPG but mine comes from running the vehicles day in day out feedback from other LPG drivers at the pumps also brings out far more engine related issues than running on petrol alone. After all if it was that good there would still be a car made by a manufacturer to run on it and there isn't mostly I'd suggest because the warranty claims were found to be too high Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webber Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 Al4x Poor kit, albeit factory fitted, and no flashlube = disatisfied user. webber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 its all extra costs though webber to reduce the viability when compared to diesel, so why do no manufacturers produce LPG vehicles these days if its so cost effective? are they all failing to see something, or is it that comparing costs its not worth bothering when compared to diesel? Its definitely one for "enthusiasts" even the finding a filling station bit requires dedication Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sooty 54 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 I have a dualfuel astra with 120k on the clock ,runs spot on and has saved me an absolute fortune on fuel costs .What is flashlube all about ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 sounds like what you'll need shortly, I'm amazed you've got to 120K in one without at least valve stem seals needing to be done Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webber Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 I have a dualfuel astra with 120k on the clock ,runs spot on and has saved me an absolute fortune on fuel costs .What is flashlube all about ? Here you go Flashlube webber http://www.flashlube.com/en/valvesaverkit/index.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king cj Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 had an lpg vehicle for the last ten years and its saved me a fortune, now got 2 on lpg and much prefer it to diesel, does have its problem if not cared for tho. both mine are large castiron engines tho, heared ali engines dont like it and wear more in the heads but dont have any experience of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sooty 54 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 (edited) Thanks Webber ,(sorry don't know how to do quotes ) I didn't know lpg increased valve wear . Edited November 24, 2009 by sooty 54 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delbert Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 (edited) After all if it was that good there would still be a car made by a manufacturer to run on it and there isn't mostly I'd suggest because the warranty claims were found to be too high I suppose you mean solely on LPG for which there is reckoned to be a tiny market because there are manufacturers turning out Dual fuel LPG vehicles certainly buses but also Volvo ,Vauxhall / Opel VW and Ford all produce dual fuel cars with full manufacturer warranties. Especially the Volvo's which have modified engines to improve LPG performance. No doubt its happening because at the moment electric cars outside of urban environments are little more than a joke. You have to wonder though how long before Land Rover or Toyota turn out a full house 4x4 I suspect they are out there being tested! Edited November 23, 2009 by Delbert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted November 24, 2009 Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 (edited) Interesting that vauxhall are going back to it as dealerships hate it and warranty claims have been high, they gave up for a good few years so a bit of a back track, and not one they are advertising in the UK yet. the volvo page was from 2001 and they don't seem to do it currently and i never knew Ford did as you certainly haven't been able to buy factory fitted light commercials Lots of people convert certainly their commercial vehicles but they aren't factory conversions, we've 3 of the last Vauxhalls that were factory converted and they were fine for 100K after that they're in and out of the garage all the time with one thing after another. Unless you're in the congestion charge zone or do a lot of miles in your range rover the economies just don't add up as well as the sellers would have you believe. Gas round us is now 60ppl and you use at least 20% more of it than petrol due to the lower calorific value but hey what do I know only been using it for the last 5 years on numerous vehicles Edited November 24, 2009 by al4x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webber Posted November 24, 2009 Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 Gentlemen of PW. Mr. Al4x whilst a dissatisfied user of LPG Autogas makes a few valid although slightly exaggerated statements based on his 5 years of admittedly heavy use. In December I shall be 54, I converted my first vehicle to run on dual fuel LPG when I was an apprentice aged 18 years. I have worked in the LPG industry for 30 years, and been involved with LPG vehicle conversion to varying degrees for the last 20 years. My son now looks after our Autogas conversion business. He is one of the top men in the country, does not advertise at all other than a page on our company web site, and is always busy, either converting vehicles or equipment or correcting the cock ups made by lesser converters. Around 8 years ago several vehicle manufacturers including Vauxhall, Toyota, Ford and Volvo started to offer allegedly factory fitted LPG conversions on a range of vehicles. The LPG equipment chosen, whilst well made was dated technology, made all the worse by being made bespoke for the vehicle. Few if any main dealer technicians fully understood LPG or the technology employed. The project was doomed from the start; made all the worse in several cases as to save money some manufacturers had started to reduce the hardness of valves and seats. Whilst technology from Australia was available to combat this problem and was being fitted by the better aftermarket converters, the vehicle manufacturers failed to take up the solution, yet complained about warranty claims caused by a condition brought about by their own actions. Ford certainly did offer a "hardened head" for vehicles intended for aftermarket LPG conversion. My company purchased 2 such Transit pickups in 02 for gas cylinder deliveries, they are still going fine. We also have older Transits, also on LPG doing sterling work. We have a Vauxhall Vectra estate used as a pool car. We converted it for a customer who had bought it with 8000 on the clock. We purchased it from him when his business changed, the vehicle then had 18,000 on the clock. It now has a little over 160,000 on the clock, and apart from a knackered air con pump is still going well, although we did need to fit a new battery yesterday. I don't doubt Al4x when he states that he is paying 60 pence per litre, too much in my opinion. The price of our retailed Autogas went up early this month to 53.5 pence per Litre, Morrisons who are about 800 yards away from us increased their price to 53.9 pence. We offer a loyalty discount to our vehicle conversion customers of 5% off pump price, no surprise then that McF always has a smile on his face when he pays for his gas. I can confirm that the calorific value of LPG is lower than petrol, but not 20%. However the octane vale of LPG is higher. The technology employed today is a world away from what I was messing around with when I was a lad. The equipment of today is fully computerised, self calibrating and on board diagnostic, comes with a loom as thick as your forearm. Many customers claim that their vehicle runs better on Autogas than it does on petrol. My Range Rover certainly does, but hey, what do I know! webber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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