local authority

[pigeonblaster]

hi, as a local authority tenant i have just recieved new tenancy conditions, they now state that NO shotguns or ammo can be kept on there property, as a shotgun cert holder for the last 35 years, in which time i have stored shotguns on there property, can they suddenly change the tenants agreement to penalise law abiding tenants, i have been an active member of a local clay shoot for the last 35 years and belong to a local rough shoot [plenty of woodies on there] is what they are doing legal or must i give up the sport i love, so as not to loose my home. HELP!!!!!!!!!

[djgeoff]

hi, as a local authority tenant i have just recieved new tenancy conditions, they now state that NO shotguns or ammo can be kept on there property, as a shotgun cert holder for the last 35 years, in which time i have stored shotguns on there property, can they suddenly change the tenants agreement to penalise law abiding tenants, i have been an active member of a local clay shoot for the last 35 years and belong to a local rough shoot [plenty of woodies on there] is what they are doing legal or must i give up the sport i love, so as not to loose my home. HELP!!!!!!!!!

hi i work for local authority i will check tomorrow and get back to u 2morrow nite

regards

geoff

[pigeonblaster]

hi i work for local authority i will check tomorrow and get back to u 2morrow nite

regards

geoff

thanks

[HDAV]

IF you are a BASC/CPSA/ A N Other member I would get on to them ASAP with a copy of the tenancy agreement.

[pigeonblaster]

IF you are a BASC/CPSA/ A N Other member I would get on to them ASAP with a copy of the tenancy agreement.

thanks, belong to cpsa so will give them a call.

[guest1957]

Challenge it. There is all sorts of law that should prevent them from being able to do so. For example Article 1, Protocol 1 of the European Convention on Human Rights states:

 

"Every natural or legal person is entitled to the peaceful enjoyment of his possessions. No one shall be deprived of his possessions except in the public interest and subject to the conditions provided for by law and by the general principles of international law."

 

As other people in the same situation to you, apart from the fact that they are not living in local authority housing are entitled to keep a shotgun, they are breaching this.

 

Also, Article 14 of the 1998 Human Rights Act states:

 

"The enjoyment of the rights and freedoms set forth in this Convention shall be secured without discrimination on any ground such as sex, race, colour, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, association with a national minority, property, birth or other status."

 

It is possible to argue that you are being descriminated against on the grounds of social origin. That is to say, that you are being discriminated on the basis that you have a different 'social origin' as you live in local authority housing.

 

They cannot change the terms in a way that binds oyu without valid reason. There is no valid reason to stop you keeping your guns there. They are licenced, they are secure, they are legal, you are responsible.

 

As you have been able to live in the house for many years with your weapons, and are not in agreement with this change, they cannot introduce it. The only change they can make is a change to rent.

 

Hope this helps show them two fingers!

Edited October 7, 2010 by guest1957

[Imperfection]

Just dont tell them-they wont find out unless you say something. :blink:

[guest1957]

Just dont tell them-they wont find out unless you say something. :blink:

 

That could backfire spectacularly.

[Imperfection]

That could backfire spectacularly.

 

But i still dont understand how the council could ever know you own guns?

[guest1957]

I assume, like any landlord, they have some sort of periodic access right which they may or may not take up. If at some point in the property they notice the cabinet they might well kick up a stink that could lead to a battle to keep the property which would be expensive and have potential for long-term damage.

[poontang]

thanks, belong to cpsa so will give them a call.

 

Good luck with that :blink:

[HDAV]

Let us know how you get on.

[djgeoff]

ok pigeonblaster i have asked our tenancy section and they said wow! thats a good one.. i dont really know theres nothing in our agreements and they have not been changed recently but the guy you need to talk to who may know has left for the day.

 

i said well i do recall a tenant loading his own shell in the box room of a council property many years ago and at that time i was not a shooter and i reported what i had seen......... they seemed ok with that.

 

anyway since then things have got a bit hot with shootings etc, the out come of my conversation was they have took my email address and name and the guy will get back to me on Monday i hope.

 

sorry cant be of more help at the moment

regards

Geoff

[pigeonblaster]

ok pigeonblaster i have asked our tenancy section and they said wow! thats a good one.. i dont really know theres nothing in our agreements and they have not been changed recently but the guy you need to talk to who may know has left for the day.

 

i said well i do recall a tenant loading his own shell in the box room of a council property many years ago and at that time i was not a shooter and i reported what i had seen......... they seemed ok with that.

 

anyway since then things have got a bit hot with shootings etc, the out come of my conversation was they have took my email address and name and the guy will get back to me on Monday i hope.

 

sorry cant be of more help at the moment

regards

Geoff

hi Geoff, any news, spoke to local council, more or less said if you dont like it, move .am waiting for local firearms officer to get back to me.

[artschool]

hi Geoff, any news, spoke to local council, more or less said if you dont like it, move .am waiting for local firearms officer to get back to me.

 

 

have you looked at your previous tenancy agreement has it actually expired? are they allowed to change the terms?

 

alternatively you could ask a friend to store it at there house, maybe the FAO could let you do that.

[guest1957]

It is possibly worthwhile contacting a Law Centre. They deal with Local Authorities etc. and might well be able to help clarify your rights.

[wymberley]

Hi,

Don't quote me, but this has happened before. I can't remember when or where, but what I do recall is that the local authority (LA) was blown out of the water when push came to shove.

The bottom line is that you are going to be made homeless. That fact is going to concentrate someone's mind wonderfully.

Don't worry (easy to say I know, but it will be sorted). Get hold of your local MP; he'll love it and will want all the publicity he can get which will do your case a power of good and make the LA look like a bunch of *****.

Good luck,

Cheers

[djgeoff]

hi Geoff, any news, spoke to local council, more or less said if you dont like it, move .am waiting for local firearms officer to get back to me.

well mate no no really had no reply from contact over telephone last wk but i asked another guy today in one of the offices and he said he cant see a problem if there all legal etc and he said if they have been in the property for say 35 yrs ( was it) and they were aware then.

there should be no reason even if they change their policy. you should have a very good reason to put your case forward, he also said court of euro rights is a good way to go.

 

i will keep on at them for you i will jump the offices i think and go to the top man 2morrow and i will ask my landlord and a mate over road who has his own bis doing landlord stuff

will keep u posted sorry for the delay but i am waiting on others to get bck to me

[djgeoff]

hi Geoff, any news, spoke to local council, more or less said if you dont like it, move .am waiting for local firearms officer to get back to me.

sorry i have had no response as yet, but i did ask another chap at work to day and his reply was i cant see no problem if they are all legal there must be hundreds of legally owned guns in rented props,but if your mate is having no joy try the court of euro rights.

 

i have just come off phone to mate who has biz with land lords and lettings, he said councils can be b...... s they chop and change all the time and they dont all have the same rules etc, tell your mate to try local mp ( one thats not gun bias) or/ and court euro rigts

 

i think i will try a couple of more places for u 2morrow, i will jump form local offices and go to top man at my place of work, and then try my old employer ( council).

 

the other idea, have your got free legal advise with your union or debit / cred cards, i have with mine, if i get five mins i will bell them and see what they say

 

will keep u posted

regards

geoff

[fluke2]

Heard something about this a couple of years back from a

guy who worked for a local council up here,it was something they

were talking about at the time but were warned there could be human

rights issues,he said at the time that the council decided to back

heel it until some other council gave it a go,if it comes down to only

being allowed guns in private property then I personally think they

need their tin hats on, a case for discrimination will definitely be on the

table,

 

PS I dont own my house its owned by a lord and a trust so is the

whole estate,the council leases them from the owners collects the

rents and carries out maintenance what happens then.

Edited October 12, 2010 by fluke2

[markbivvy]

Sure it was Camden council who first tried this and failed,courts ruled if you held guns legally you can keep em.

Its a good bit back now but the council in question did fail.

 

 

Are you sure this is not written on the acquirement.

 

 

You must not keep any firearms unless you are legally entitled to hold

them. Examples of firearms include air-weapons, shotguns, replicas and

de-activated weapons. If you have a legal firearm you must use and store

it only in ways the law allows.

Edited October 12, 2010 by markbivvy

[essexfluke]

What did CPSA have to say? Might be worth trying to get togeather with other tenents that are effected. Good luck

[pigeonblaster]

well mate no no really had no reply from contact over telephone last wk but i asked another guy today in one of the offices and he said he cant see a problem if there all legal etc and he said if they have been in the property for say 35 yrs ( was it) and they were aware then.

there should be no reason even if they change their policy. you should have a very good reason to put your case forward, he also said court of euro rights is a good way to go.

 

i will keep on at them for you i will jump the offices i think and go to the top man 2morrow and i will ask my landlord and a mate over road who has his own bis doing landlord stuff

will keep u posted sorry for the delay but i am waiting on others to get bck to me

Hi Geoff, thanks for your time, really appreciate any help, have contacted my FAO who has put me in touch with a local gundealer who works for the NRA at bisley, also contacted the CPSA and spoken to there solicitor who seems to think it is against my rights to impose such tenancy changes, have also spoken to my MP who wants to see a copy of new tenancy changes. so fingers crossed i may get somewhere,

[pigeonblaster]

Sure it was Camden council who first tried this and failed,courts ruled if you held guns legally you can keep em.

Its a good bit back now but the council in question did fail.

 

 

Are you sure this is not written on the acquirement.

 

 

You must not keep any firearms unless you are legally entitled to hold

them. Examples of firearms include air-weapons, shotguns, replicas and

de-activated weapons. If you have a legal firearm you must use and store

it only in ways the law allows.

it only says NO FIREARMS, NO SHOTGUNS, NO AMMO, NO AIR RIFLES. OH AND NO REPLICA GUNS, WHATS NEXT WATER PISTOLS ?

[guest1957]

Heard something about this a couple of years back from a

guy who worked for a local council up here,it was something they

were talking about at the time but were warned there could be human

rights issues,he said at the time that the council decided to back

heel it until some other council gave it a go,if it comes down to only

being allowed guns in private property then I personally think they

need their tin hats on, a case for discrimination will definitely be on the

table,

 

 

I personally cannot see how the move by the council can be in line with the Human Rights Act at all. I will try and dig out the council case that has been mentioned by others and see what that says.